Incongruous media coverage of Rittenhouse vs actual testimony

[Replicant 7]

Better to be judged by 12 of your peers than to be carried by six of your friends.

 

[Danzilla31]

I didn't see anything other than self-defense in the videos, but I'm sure a lesser charge of a minor controlling a weapon is valid. His mother is dumb, and attending a party after someone posted bail is probably not a good look.

Student taken into custody hours after Texas school shooting

Police have arrested a student suspected of opening fire during a fight at his Dallas-area high school, leaving four people injured

abcnews.go.com

We had that happen here in Texas that shooting incident that happened here in the high school where that one kid shot the other had a party after he got out on bail.

I honestly don't think that's an issue tho. For Kyle or the other kid. If I got oughta jail I'd be pretty darn happy and grateful to be honest with you.

Plus known of that applies in either situation towards whether they are guilty or not. Only what can be proven in a court of law regarding the fact related to each case at the scene of the alleged crime

I do agree with you though that that's not a good look me personally I'd be laying low that's just me personally tho

 

[shadyJ]

It seems that Rittenhouse acted in self-defense in the particular incidents that he is charged with. He will walk from those particular set of charges.

The problem is that everyone knows why Rittenhouse went to those riots and why his mother took him there. They wanted him to kill black people and/or what they considered to be "leftists," and they knew the best chance of doing that with impunity was at those riots. Openly carrying an AR-15 at a riot like that was a deliberate provocation. The incidents that excused the killing of two people were exactly what he was hoping for. That is the larger picture. He is a piece of shi!t, and I wouldn't be surprised if he tried this same stunt again at the next heated protest for some racial injustice.

 

[Danzilla31]

It seems that Rittenhouse acted in self-defense in the particular incidents that he is charged with. He will walk from those particular set of charges.

The problem is that everyone knows why Rittenhouse went to those riots and why his mother took him there. They wanted him to kill black people and/or what they considered to be "leftists," and they knew the best chance of doing that with impunity was at those riots. Openly carrying an AR-15 at a riot like that was a deliberate provocation. The incidents that excused the killing of two people were exactly what he was hoping for. That is the larger picture. He is a piece of shi!t, and I wouldn't be surprised if he tried this same stunt again at the next heated protest for some racial injustice.

And your evidence to support this is what? Because if that's really the case then he could have done a lot better job then what he did. There were plenty of spots he could have hid in and took out black people.

He could have not tried to run away from all 3 situations

He could have once he was attacked used all 3 situations as an excuse to just pull the trigger on everybody there. He only shot anyone who attacked him. And not anybody who backed off.

In fact if nobody had pursued and attacked him in the first place he wouldn't have shot anybody that night at all.

Not a very great opportunist for what your accusing him off.

Out of all the people he shot how many were black by the way?

Your statement is kindoff an example of what @jinjuku is making about the media.

Your doing a lot of speculating and accusing with really nothing to back it up except your obviously biased point of view.

He could've just as easily been a dumb ass kid who wanted to go play what he thought was a hero enabled by a very poor mother. And in the middle of a riot he got in over his head and the sh$t got out of hand

But all this heat on Kyle none on the rioters I'm sorry I mean protesters? Hey you riot and destroy communities that's what you get push back from communities. As @jinjuku said earlier I'm suprised it didn't end up worse.

Or maybe rioters should just do whatever they want right? So people can threaten the new New York mayor with violence and bloodshed if he doesn't do what they want even though he is attempting to honor what his constituents voted him in for

Or hey we could be like LA and just issue a statement to people telling them to just cooperate and comply when people break into there homes. Which they just did

That's ridiculous pushback goes both ways. We're not living in a grand theft auto video game for Christ's sakes. People want to riot they need to realize your ass might just get shot for it.

Damn I'm glad I live in Texas. And let's just cut through all this bullshit. The reason the media wants to put a spin on it. And the reason certain political minded people hate the idea of Kyle walking is because they know dang well if they continue to riot more people will be emboldened to defend and stand up for themselves and there communities if they feel they will get a fair treatment at trial.

People are fed up with the rioting. And if Kyle walks there runs the risk of being real bloodshed if the next round of riots goes down.
A part of me doesn't want him to walk because of this reason alone. But a part of me also doesn't want to be living in an Escape from New York movie either.

Either way if he walks its going to get real interesting. In the media here in the steam vent for sure Lol and definetly out in the streets if people decide to take a protest and turn it into a riot

 

[shadyJ]

And your evidence to support this is what? Because if that's really the case then he could have done a lot better job then what he did. There were plenty of spots he could have hid in and took out black people.

He could have not tried to run away from all 3 situations

He could have once he was attacked used all 3 situations as an excuse to just pull the trigger on everybody there. He only shot anyone who attacked him. And not anybody who backed off.

In fact if nobody had pursued and attacked him in the first place he wouldn't have shot anybody that night at all.

Not a very great opportunist for what your accusing him off.

Out of all the people he shot how many were black by the way?

And let's get the wording right at least Shady the next time a heated protest escalates into a full on riot because that's what that night was. Rioting not protesting

Your statement is kindoff an example of what @jinjuku is making about the media.

Your doing a lot of speculating and accusing with really nothing to back it up except your obviously biased point of view.

He could've just as easily been a dumb ass kid who wanted to go play what he thought was a hero enabled by a very poor mother. And in the middle of a riot he got in over his head and the sh$t got out of hand

But all this heat on Kyle none on the rioters I'm sorry I mean protesters? Hey you riot and destroy communities that's what you get push back from communities. As @jinjuku said earlier I'm suprised it didn't end up worse.

Or maybe rioters should just do whatever they want right? So people can threaten the new New York mayor with violence and bloodshed if he doesn't do what they want even though he is attempting to honor what his constituents voted him in for

Or hey we could be like LA and just issue a statement to people telling them to just cooperate and comply when people break into there homes. Which they just did

That's ridiculous pushback goes both ways. We're not living in a grand theft auto video game for Christ's sakes. People want to riot they need to realize your ass might just get shot for it.

Damn I'm glad I live in Texas. And let's just cut through all this bullshit. The reason the media wants to put a spin on it. And the reason certain political minded people hate the idea of Kyle walking is because they know dang well if they continue to riot more people will be emboldened to defend and stand up for themselves and there communities if they feel they will get a fair treatment at trial.

People are fed up with the rioting. And if Kyle walks there runs the risk of being real bloodshed if the next round of riots goes down.
A part of me doesn't want him to walk because of this reason alone. But a part of me also doesn't want to be living in an Escape from New York movie either.

Either way if he walks its going to get real interesting. In the media here in the steam vent for sure Lol and definetly out in the streets if people decide to take a protest and turn it into a riot

I am not defending the rioters. Anyone who vandalizes property should be charged and given the appropriate sentencing. I am sympathetic to the cause of the protesters, but not the rioters. I don't think there is any justification for random looting and destruction. The rioters suck, end of story.

But what are the odds that Rittinhouse fancies himself some do-gooder out to rescue people or protect their property? Basically zero. There were other right-wing groups showing up to provoke violence in those protests. He surely had much the same motive. He certainly doesn't care about the local people or their property; he was driven in from out of state. Rittinhouse got what he came for. He wanted to kill people that he didn't like under a legally defensible pretense. Really, who wonders into that mess with an AR15? And then he hangs out with Proud Boys flashing white supremacist sings on Facebook?

He will walk on the charges of murder. And maybe that is correct. But he is not entirely innocent of the deaths of those two people. He walked into a volatile situation openly carrying a loaded AR15. He is either an evil piece of sh!t who got exactly what he came for, or the biggest dumbass on earth if he really thought he could do some good strapped with an AR15 in a racially-charged riot.

 

[Danzilla31]

I am not defending the rioters. Anyone who vandalizes property should be charged and given the appropriate sentencing. I am sympathetic to the cause of the protesters, but not the rioters. I don't think there is any justification for random looting and destruction. The rioters suck, end of story.

But what are the odds that Rittinhouse fancies himself some do-gooder out to rescue people or protect their property? Basically zero. There were other right-wing groups showing up to provoke violence in those protests. He surely had much the same motive. He certainly doesn't care about the local people or their property; he was driven in from out of state. Rittinhouse got what he came for. He wanted to kill people that he didn't like under a legally defensible pretense. Really, who wonders into that mess with an AR15? And then he hangs out with Proud Boys flashing white supremacist sings on Facebook?

He will walk on the charges of murder. And maybe that is correct. But he is not entirely innocent of the deaths of those two people. He walked into a volatile situation openly carrying a loaded AR15. He is either an evil piece of sh!t who got exactly what he came for, or the biggest dumbass on earth if he really thought he could do some good strapped with an AR15 in a racially-charged riot.

Yeah we don't see eye to eye on politics but I have a deep respect for you Shady you know that

But some of what your saying just blows my mind. Your viewing his decision making from your point of view which is a very grown up well thought out perspective capable of tackling a lot of complex nuances.

We're talking about a 17 year old kid here. Is it really so hard to understand a kid wanting to be important and save the day? I mean that's what kids do is make very stupid decisions it's part of being 17 years old.

I mean let's make up our minds here either he's a stupid kid who shouldn't have been there or he's a very sophisticated calculating cold blooded monster who deliberately lured those protestors in I mean which is it? Probably just a very misguided dumb kid who isn't at 17. Obviously the parenting in his life was not helping in that regard

Also have you really studied the facts of this incident?

He lives 15 minutes away he worked there at times he had connection to the community

He drove himself people make it sound like he was bussed in from 500 miles away to a town he never heard of. Some of that across state lines is that media spin how our media both left and right love to spin things

Next everyone was armed there protestors and residents alike. Everyone was running around with guns so if you are going to perform medical or community service you damn well better be armed it's why all the adults were that were doing the same job he was supposed to be doing. Not just his mom but those adults should have sent his ass home knowing how dangerous it was going to be.

Next he didn't provoke protestors he was one of the group that put out a fire in a dumpster with a fire extinguisher the rioters were pushing towards a gas station for Christ's sake which pissed them off this set up the situation where the first protestor and who ended up being the first victim was acknowledged by the prosecutions own witnesses as telling Kyle if I catch you alone tonight I'm going to kill you.

And finally if he didn't have that gun he would have been killed that night. When the first victim carried out his threat that would have been it for Kyle. Doubt the media or a lot of the so so Loving and Tolerant far left would have cared about that.

 

[Danzilla31]

I am not defending the rioters. Anyone who vandalizes property should be charged and given the appropriate sentencing. I am sympathetic to the cause of the protesters, but not the rioters. I don't think there is any justification for random looting and destruction. The rioters suck, end of story.

But what are the odds that Rittinhouse fancies himself some do-gooder out to rescue people or protect their property? Basically zero. There were other right-wing groups showing up to provoke violence in those protests. He surely had much the same motive. He certainly doesn't care about the local people or their property; he was driven in from out of state. Rittinhouse got what he came for. He wanted to kill people that he didn't like under a legally defensible pretense. Really, who wonders into that mess with an AR15? And then he hangs out with Proud Boys flashing white supremacist sings on Facebook?

He will walk on the charges of murder. And maybe that is correct. But he is not entirely innocent of the deaths of those two people. He walked into a volatile situation openly carrying a loaded AR15. He is either an evil piece of sh!t who got exactly what he came for, or the biggest dumbass on earth if he really thought he could do some good strapped with an AR15 in a racially-charged riot.

Just answer me this one question Shady why does the left and the media take some of the most common sense things and get them so so wrong?

How can you not understand the need for law and order it's possible to reform the one we have while still enforcing the rules to all members of a society

One of your primary responsibilities as a party in power is to provide security and safety for all your citizens.

Instead we have big cities who have minority communities that can't even get meds because all the stores are closed down permanently because liberals said if it's under a 1000 it's not stealing?

Violence and crime are just out of control in these areas because they won't prosecute criminals demonize there police and cut there funds rather than improve them? In LA your told to let robbers just come in your home because they can't help you. I pay my taxes and vote for this?

Look if I was still full on Republican I'd say keep it up Id just keep my mouth shut because the ass kicking you got in Virgiana would be just the beginning if you can't improve your law and order among other issues

But I really don't want another Trump in office but that's exactly what is being setup here.

Why do you guys insist on doubling down on some the stupidest policies I've ever heard in my life?

And the killer is I like some of your policies some of your ideas are good. Why do you guys f it up when you implement them and make it so damn complicated?

 

[Danzilla31]

I'm sorry I derailed the thread I'll stop but this is so so damn frustrating to me Shady

How can a group of constituents who are obviously so damn intelligent f up the simplest most fundamental parts of what makes a society function?

 

[Trell]

Yeah we don't see eye to eye on politics but I have a deep respect for you Shady you know that

But some of what your saying just blows my mind. Your viewing his decision making from your point of view which is a very grown up well thought out perspective capable of tackling a lot of complex nuances.

We're talking about a 17 year old kid here. Is it really so hard to understand a kid wanting to be important and save the day? I mean that's what kids do is make very stupid decisions it's part of being 17 years old.

I mean let's make up our minds here either he's a stupid kid who shouldn't have been there or he's a very sophisticated calculating cold blooded monster who deliberately lured those protestors in I mean which is it? Probably just a very misguided dumb kid who isn't at 17. Obviously the parenting in his life was not helping in that regard

Also have you really studied the facts of this incident?

He lives 15 minutes away he worked there at times he had connection to the community

He drove himself people make it sound like he was bussed in from 500 miles away to a town he never heard of. Some of that across state lines is that media spin how our media both left and right love to spin things

Next everyone was armed there protestors and residents alike. Everyone was running around with guns so if you are going to perform medical or community service you damn well better be armed it's why all the adults were that were doing the same job he was supposed to be doing. Not just his mom but those adults should have sent his ass home knowing how dangerous it was going to be.

Next he didn't provoke protestors he was one of the group that put out a fire in a dumpster with a fire extinguisher the rioters were pushing towards a gas station for Christ's sake which pissed them off this set up the situation where the first protestor and who ended up being the first victim was acknowledged by the prosecutions own witnesses as telling Kyle if I catch you alone tonight I'm going to kill you.

And finally if he didn't have that gun he would have been killed that night. When the first victim carried out his threat that would have been it for Kyle. Doubt the media or a lot of the so so Loving and Tolerant far left would have cared about that.

This is a white heavily armed racist 17 year old man that travels to protests by black people. Intent matters and he should not go free.

 

[Replicant 7]

Just read a article, a African American woman was stating that Seattle downtown is very dangerous she's an employee and has to be escorted by security guards. Afraid for her safety of herself and her while/black coworkers, Mob rule, Chicago alone has had over 600 + shootings probably higher than that.

 

[jinjuku]

The problem is that everyone knows why Rittenhouse went to those riots and why his mother took him there. They wanted him to kill black people and/or what they considered to be "leftists," and they knew the best chance of doing that with impunity was at those riots.

Maybe or maybe not. I can only be in my my mind.

Openly carrying an AR-15 at a riot like that was a deliberate provocation.

Anything could be construed as a provocation in that environment that night. Wearing a police uniform would have been provocation by your standard. Who in their right mind, when unarmed, chases a gunman into a corner. There are three video's I saw that 100%, objectively, showed that Rittenhouse ran away from Rosenbaum. One from the FBI and one from McGuinness, and Hernandez who was rolling with two camera's.

Did you perchance not see this? Here's another fact: The Hernandez video was the most concise and the DA, as a fact finding body (not a conviction seeking body, there aren't there for that by their oath), declined to call Hernandez to the stand with video.

The incidents that excused the killing of two people were exactly what he was hoping for. That is the larger picture. He is a piece of shi!t, and I wouldn't be surprised if he tried this same stunt again at the next heated protest for some racial injustice.

Given Gaiges testimony we could debate who was the P.O.S. He's a grown man.

These weren't excused killings. This is what the trial process is supposed to resolve. You are either convicted, mis-strialed, or exonerated.

Everyone there was an idiot. If you chase down someone with a rifle your an idiot. If you take your skate board and hit someone in the head that has a rifle your an idiot. If you draw your pistol and point it at someone your an idiot. If you're a 17 year old kid with a rifle in a highly charged riot you and your parents are idiots.

Play stupid games win stupid prizes I guess.

Again I'm going to ask that people actually support their position, opinion, or otherwise with facts from the record. If not, it is my thread, and I'll ask you not to post in it as a courtesy.

 

[jinjuku]

But what are the odds that Rittinhouse fancies himself some do-gooder out to rescue people or protect their property? Basically zero.

I think he fancies himself as some para-mil/cop to be quite honest with you. Some bulwark against the angry mob.

There were other right-wing groups showing up to provoke violence in those protests.

Did you catch what group Gaige Grosskreutz is 'affiliated' with? So pot meet kettle

He surely had much the same motive. He certainly doesn't care about the local people or their property; he was driven in from out of state.

This gets tiring: I can be in Indiana from Kentucky in 8 minutes.

Rittinhouse got what he came for. He wanted to kill people that he didn't like under a legally defensible pretense. Really, who wonders into that mess with an AR15? And then he hangs out with Proud Boys flashing white supremacist sings on Facebook?

The factual record tells a different story. You are welcome to your narrative just be aware the facts don't support it. On the proud boys thing: This is why I hope he never gets to own a fire arm again.

 

[highfigh]

Based on the prosecutions own witnesses I believe the affirmative self defense claims will hold up. This is the entire point behind a trial is to get at the most objective facts that can be had.

The other issue is the premeditation that the DA decided to charge with. This should have been 2nd/3rd or manslaughter. The burden of proof is lower.

He said he went there to protect businesses and give medical aid- who the hell asked a 17 year old to do that and why did he think he could legally carry a rifle, at 17 years of age?

Bottom line- if he hadn't been there, this wouldn't have happened. If the DA can't prove the charges beyond a reasonable doubt, and it looks like he didn't (unless the jury just wants to pin it on him), he should still be charged with something, maybe voluntary manslaughter-

Wisconsin Voluntary Manslaughter Law

An overview of Wisconsin's voluntary manslaughter laws, including potential defenses.

www.findlaw.com

 

[ryanosaur]

It seems that the prosecutor is now seeking lesser charges for the jury to consider.

 

[highfigh]

Did you catch what group Gaige Grosskreutz is 'affiliated' with? So pot meet kettle

The factual record tells a different story. You are welcome to your narrative just be aware the facts don't support it. On the proud boys thing: This is why I hope he never gets to own a fire arm again.

His permit had expired, yet he was carrying his pistol- he needs to be charged, if it was concealed.

However, from the link-

"He said he was “closing the distance between the defendant and I,” when Rittenhouse shot him. He was trying to “do something to prevent myself from being killed and shot.” He said Huber had “just tried wrestling the gun” from Rittenhouse. “I was never trying to kill the defendant,” Grosskreutz testified. “I was trying to preserve my own life.”

Gaige Grosskreutz: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know

Gaige Grosskreutz is the only man shot by Kyle Rittenhouse in Kenosha who lived.

heavy.com

That shows he was basically thoughtless at the time. If he wanted to preserve his own life, he could have walked away and in WI, CCW training courses instruct us that if someone invades our dwelling, we're supposed to try to escape or retreat before firing.

Also, from the link- "Asked by the prosecutor why he didn’t shoot Rittenhouse first, Grosskreutz said he is “not that kind of person.”

If he's not "that kind of person", why was he A) in that place and B), carrying a weapon and C), aiming it at Rittenhouse?

IMO, neither should be able to possess guns.

 

[highfigh]

It seems that the prosecutor is now seeking lesser charges for the jury to consider.

I think they'll make a deal- the DA's witness didn't perform as expected, so his case is DOA unless the jury is sympathetic to these charges and at this point, I think a mistrial is likely if they convict. The defense attorney's firm is one of the more popular ones when people are charged with gun and DUI crimes.

 

[highfigh]

In keeping with the intent of this thread, it is not lamented enough the death of journalistic integrity. I agree that there is far too much attempt… dare I say even blatant intention… to create a narrative in “reporting,” today.
It is getting worse.
I know if I stumble on a HuffPost article, I need to get out my salt cellar, no different than if I stumble on RealClearPolitics. But even on CNN, you can still find some honest journalism… along with a large amount of not-journalism.
Frankly, I see this as an extension of the growing idiocracy and the demise of our collective intellect. Everything now is available in a sound bite or YT video and being spoon fed to us by algorithms, all with the intent to keep us “entertained.”
I just had a conversation with this guy I know who brought up inflation and was solely blaming Biden even though this upward trend started in the previous administration. When I brought that up, he simply stated that he had “heard that,” yet wouldn’t be swayed to consider it because it was outside of the narrative he had accepted.
Gone are the days where a quote like WK Clifford’s from The Ethics of Belief had any meaning:


It is ultimately sad to see the demise of rational and intelligent discourse from our collective whole. Traits like integrity, mutual respect, intelligence and the ability to think for oneself are denigrated at best, if not outright vilified.
I don’t think these are necessarily gone, yet to find sign of them, one has to dig under the surface because the façade has been remade into a disguise, and that disguise is slowly replacing what we used to be; taking over and becoming our nature.
Perhaps one hypothesis is that in the face of globalism, we are reverting to more base and tribal instincts.

People were forced to stay at home, so they looked for something to make them feel good and in many cases, they were looking for it online. That, especially when they were on social media sites, caused a lot of damage. Rittenhouse was 16 at the start of COVID- he's still at an impressionable age and he probably became all quivery and drooling at the prospect of going after some protesters. Can't say for sure how he feels about BLM, etc but Antioch, IL is a small-ish community and they definitely have groups of wingnuts.

Also, Hollywood has weighed in and they don't like Rittenhouse.

 

[highfigh]

Let's be honest: No one really needed to be there. Even the police taking the stand called it a war zone.

No Kyle shouldn't have been there. But he wasn't alone in this, he wasn't the only one armed.

But that's besides the point:

My concern is that the Judge let the prosecutor have it, just lambasted him for his unethical behavior and borderline malpractice, and what I saw from MSM was the judge was acting irrationally. But when you saw the exchange for yourself you understood the sleazeball tactics the the DA was using.

He wasn't the only one there, but he's the only one who carried a rifle as a minor, killed two people, shot a third and is on trial.

I'm not sure that denying a change of venue should have occurred- Kenosha is a very racially-charged area.

BTW- It used to be known as a dumping ground for the Chicago mob's kills.

 

[highfigh]

LOL - "Have fun at the BLM street party, sweetie!"

"Call me when you're ready to come home- should I pick you up at the food court? Love you!".

 

[John Parks]

Injecting some much needed (or not) silliness…