When will streaming services get "classical" right?

[nathan_h]

I was reminded yet again that streaming services don't understand "classical" music (by which I mean European art music from the middles ages to the present*) today when I decided to seek out some Stravinsky I haven't heard before (or at least don't recall hearing).

It quickly became clear that while the service I selected knew enough to call Stravinsky an artist, it didn't let me search for Stravinsky as the composer and search for him as an artist didn't surface the vast majority of works he composed that have been recorded...... because, for the most part, unless it was him actually conducting the work, the search algorithm didn't consider it a work by Stravinsky.

So you know what? Stravinsky didn't release many albums!

I could find more, and more recent ones, via Stravinsky in the album title search.....sometimes. But not always. And not consistently nor reliably.

God forbid if I was looking for a particular orchestra playing his work.

--

But at least I could to his "top songs"!? (Sarcasm -- it just happens to be the most prominent choice once you enter the word Stravinsky into the search field.)

--

I know I'm not the first person to have this problem. It has been irksome for years. And it has been written about several times going back at least a decade.

The irony is that most meta data systems actually allow for many of the useful fields: composer versus performer, etc, but even that is not implemented well in the services I have looked at.

Maybe I have missed the one service that gets it right? If so, please point it out.

Or maybe we still have to ask, When will streaming services get "classical" right?





----

*I'm guessing it is similarly problematic for classical music from outside the European tradition that have am extensive and rich history, like India, so one would hope a solution would be dextrous enough to not solve solely for the European tradition.

 

[John Parks]

What service are you using?

 

[nathan_h]

So far, I have tried Spotify, Qobuz, Google Music, YT Music, Amazon, Deezer, and Tidal. I have tried to give each one a fair shake by using it for at least a month, to hopefully overcome any challenges with the learning curve.

 

[highfigh]

So far, I have tried Spotify, Qobuz, Google Music, YT Music, Amazon, Deezer, and Tidal. I have tried to give each one a fair shake by using it for at least a month, to hopefully overcome any challenges with the learning curve.

Ask Mark- he hates everything, except classical music.

 

[John Parks]

I've heard good things about Primephonic but have not tried it.

Primephonic Classical Streaming

Three years ago, Primephonic launched with a mission to create a streaming service designed for classical listening and build a bigger and brighter future for classical music in the digital era.

www.primephonic.com

 

[nathan_h]

I've heard good things about Primephonic but have not tried it.

Primephonic Classical Streaming

Three years ago, Primephonic launched with a mission to create a streaming service designed for classical listening and build a bigger and brighter future for classical music in the digital era.

www.primephonic.com

Wow, that looks perfect. I missed them in my searching.

Will be a little problematic in the household to have a service that is EXCLUSIVELY classical, but it does appear that someone has figured out this challenge.... thanks for pointing that out!

 

[slipperybidness]

@TLS Guy will set you straight on the best options for this category.

 

[TLS Guy]

Wow, that looks perfect. I missed them in my searching.

Will be a little problematic in the household to have a service that is EXCLUSIVELY classical, but it does appear that someone has figured out this challenge.... thanks for pointing that out!

I have not tried Primephonic. I have a large collection of LPs CDs, tapes, some SACDs, and quite a few BD discs of mainly opera. I also have a large collection of concerts on my DAW, from broadcasts. I can get the BBC via VPN, and their quality is fantastic.

I do, do a lot of streaming, and subscribe to a number of top quality streaming services. These include, The Berlin Philharmonic Digital Concert Hall, Medici TV, the Metropolitan Opera Player, the SPCO concert library, the Detroit Symphony Orchestra. Recently the DSO have added a subscription Digital Stage. The Philadelphia Orchestra started streaming about a year ago. You have to buy a ticket for their concerts. They are $17.00 per concert. The Minnesota Orchestra has also started streaming it's concerts for the last several months. The Metropolitan Opera in addition to Met Player, has had artist recital concerts, which a $20.00 each, over and above the yearly Met Player subscription. There are a number of others also, but those are the ones I use on a regular basis.

All of those I have mentioned give you picture and superb sound. Also don't forget YouTube. There are lots of great offerings to be had there. One of my favorites since this pandemic began, is the concerts, nearly 30 now in lockdown, given by the Scott Brothers Duo. That is one you absolutely should sample.

There are others out there, but the ones I have mentioned are ones they are really well presented with good AV quality. The BPO have a vast archive going back to the Karajan years.

I have to say, that I think a good HTPC, is by far the best way to navigate, explore and enjoy all these fine productions.

 

[MR.MAGOO]

Streaming services never get anything 'right', they're out to make a fast buck, cramming as much digital rubbish down the pipe as limited bandwidth allows, all of it compressed to the point of no return, but then I'm in my curmudgeon phase of life.

 

[Ren Kitchener]

Not only do they get that part wrong, also they often don't get the period right - classical only covers a period, which misses out baroque, romantic and 20th century modern music - all are completely different to classical. It's like calling a channel 'the Jazz Channel', then playing some Reggae tracks on it - it's really not helpful.

 

[nathan_h]

I have not tried Primephonic. I have a large collection of LPs CDs, tapes, some SACDs, and quite a few BD discs of mainly opera. I also have a large collection of concerts on my DAW, from broadcasts. I can get the BBC via VPN, and their quality is fantastic.

I do, do a lot of streaming, and subscribe to a number of top quality streaming services. These include, The Berlin Philharmonic Digital Concert Hall, Medici TV, the Metropolitan Opera Player, the SPCO concert library, the Detroit Symphony Orchestra. Recently the DSO have added a subscription Digital Stage. The Philadelphia Orchestra started streaming about a year ago. You have to buy a ticket for their concerts. They are $17.00 per concert. The Minnesota Orchestra has also started streaming it's concerts for the last several months. The Metropolitan Opera in addition to Met Player, has had artist recital concerts, which a $20.00 each, over and above the yearly Met Player subscription. There are a number of others also, but those are the ones I use on a regular basis.

All of those I have mentioned give you picture and superb sound. Also don't forget YouTube. There are lots of great offerings to be had there. One of my favorites since this pandemic began, is the concerts, nearly 30 now in lockdown, given by the Scott Brothers Duo. That is one you absolutely should sample.

There are others out there, but the ones I have mentioned are ones they are really well presented with good AV quality. The BPO have a vast archive going back to the Karajan years.

I have to say, that I think a good HTPC, is by far the best way to navigate, explore and enjoy all these fine productions.

thanks for this detailed breakdown.

 

[cpp]

Streaming services never get anything 'right', they're out to make a fast buck, cramming as much digital rubbish down the pipe as limited bandwidth allows, all of it compressed to the point of no return, but then I'm in my curmudgeon phase of life.

So do you stream anything at all ?, someones has to try to make money in Audio music availability. At least with Qobuz I can download.

 

[eljr]

I was reminded yet again that streaming services don't understand "classical" music (by which I mean European art music from the middles ages to the present*) today when I decided to seek out some Stravinsky I haven't heard before (or at least don't recall hearing).

It quickly became clear that while the service I selected knew enough to call Stravinsky an artist, it didn't let me search for Stravinsky as the composer and search for him as an artist didn't surface the vast majority of works he composed that have been recorded...... because, for the most part, unless it was him actually conducting the work, the search algorithm didn't consider it a work by Stravinsky.

So you know what? Stravinsky didn't release many albums!

I could find more, and more recent ones, via Stravinsky in the album title search.....sometimes. But not always. And not consistently nor reliably.

God forbid if I was looking for a particular orchestra playing his work.

--

But at least I could to his "top songs"!? (Sarcasm -- it just happens to be the most prominent choice once you enter the word Stravinsky into the search field.)

--

I know I'm not the first person to have this problem. It has been irksome for years. And it has been written about several times going back at least a decade.

The irony is that most meta data systems actually allow for many of the useful fields: composer versus performer, etc, but even that is not implemented well in the services I have looked at.

Maybe I have missed the one service that gets it right? If so, please point it out.

Or maybe we still have to ask, When will streaming services get "classical" right?





----

*I'm guessing it is similarly problematic for classical music from outside the European tradition that have am extensive and rich history, like India, so one would hope a solution would be dextrous enough to not solve solely for the European tradition.

I have no problem because I do not use a streaming service as a reference source. Maybe just realize that classical music is "tag challenged" and as a result does not offer the same convenience as does popular music.

Peace

 

[eljr]

Qobuz I can download.

Why would you want to download? Are some parts of the country still internet deprived? In all my travels I have never had need of downloading.

 

[eljr]

I have not tried Primephonic. I have a large collection of LPs CDs, tapes, some SACDs, and quite a few BD discs of mainly opera. I also have a large collection of concerts on my DAW, from broadcasts. I can get the BBC via VPN, and their quality is fantastic.

I do, do a lot of streaming, and subscribe to a number of top quality streaming services. These include, The Berlin Philharmonic Digital Concert Hall, Medici TV, the Metropolitan Opera Player, the SPCO concert library, the Detroit Symphony Orchestra. Recently the DSO have added a subscription Digital Stage. The Philadelphia Orchestra started streaming about a year ago. You have to buy a ticket for their concerts. They are $17.00 per concert. The Minnesota Orchestra has also started streaming it's concerts for the last several months. The Metropolitan Opera in addition to Met Player, has had artist recital concerts, which a $20.00 each, over and above the yearly Met Player subscription. There are a number of others also, but those are the ones I use on a regular basis.

All of those I have mentioned give you picture and superb sound. Also don't forget YouTube. There are lots of great offerings to be had there. One of my favorites since this pandemic began, is the concerts, nearly 30 now in lockdown, given by the Scott Brothers Duo. That is one you absolutely should sample.

There are others out there, but the ones I have mentioned are ones they are really well presented with good AV quality. The BPO have a vast archive going back to the Karajan years.

I have to say, that I think a good HTPC, is by far the best way to navigate, explore and enjoy all these fine productions.

Very cool, I too subscribed to most those services simultaneously, about two, three years ago. No more though, for me it's just too much repetition or I wind up not using this or that.

 

[eljr]

I've heard good things about Primephonic but have not tried it.

Primephonic Classical Streaming

Three years ago, Primephonic launched with a mission to create a streaming service designed for classical listening and build a bigger and brighter future for classical music in the digital era.

www.primephonic.com

I was very happy with it, give it a try!

 

[cpp]

Why would you want to download? Are some parts of the country still internet deprived? In all my travels I have never had need of downloading.

Hell why not, You are missing the point, its not about downloading to listen to it anywhere in the world or in space at that given time, I can stream to do just that, its about in my case to keep it, if there is a album you like and can't find it at any store or online for purchase, and Qobuz has it, why not download it if you want it.

 

[nathan_h]

I have no problem because I do not use a streaming service as a reference source. Maybe just realize that classical music is "tag challenged" and as a result does not offer the same convenience as does popular music.

Peace

I used to think what you are saying here was true.

This thread and learning about Primephonic and Idagio taught me that I was wrong, and I am glad to learn about these services.

Still wish that a mainstream service would adopt this level of precision but that's a different discussion.

 

[eljr]

Hell why not, You are missing the point, its not about downloading to listen to it anywhere in the world or in space at that given time, I can stream to do just that, its about in my case to keep it, if there is a album you like and can't find it at any store or online for purchase, and Qobuz has it, why not download it if you want it.

OK, fair enough.
I stopped buying music 2 years ago. It was hard, real hard. I bout about 200-250 albums a year previous.
It was no different than giving up coffee. A real personal challenge.

 

[Hobbit]

I find the same thing with Jazz. Most the streaming services play jazz that if you asked someone on the street to name jazz artists that's what they play ad nauseam.

I had found many good stations through internet radio. However, this seems to be dying a slow death. First, it's a PIA to find stations! Second, similar to what happened trying to watch streamed international sports, they've cracked down international streaming. Many streams disappeared altogether or can disappear at any minute (I'm in the US). Finally, internet radios (in any form) never really caught on. Partially due to the above problems and due to the fact that most people are happy to type in Jazz into Pandora and never get any deeper than Coltrane, Miles, Brubeck, etc.