Any opinions on good cheap av receivers?

[William Lemmerhirt]

I'd definitely hold off on the different avr until after you get better speakers/sub setup. If the Pioneer is running warm a relatively inexpensive fan can help cool it/extend its life. Floorstanders don't generally have "subs" nor is the best positions for the L/R speakers usually the best for sub(s) and as far as stereo sub bass, most of it is summed to mono in recordings.

Totally agree. Don’t get towers with “powered subs” in them. You’ll get better performance and more placement options with real subs. I have a pioneer 1019 in my bedroom. It should definitely have a fan. It’s a good AVR though. As far as power goes, it’s rated for 125x7, but once you moved the MV past somewhere around -15 you could just here it running out of steam. The Onkyo that replaced it(gone now) was rated at 135x7 and had seemingly unlimited power. It also weighed at least 10lbs more. Not sure I have a point. Maybe just to share a Puoneer anecdote.

 

[sizzam]

Totally agree. Don’t get towers with “powered subs” in them. You’ll get better performance and more placement options with real subs. I have a pioneer 1019 in my bedroom. It should definitely have a fan. It’s a good AVR though. As far as power goes, it’s rated for 125x7, but once you moved the MV past somewhere around -15 you could just here it running out of steam. The Onkyo that replaced it(gone now) was rated at 135x7 and had seemingly unlimited power. It also weighed at least 10lbs more. Not sure I have a point. Maybe just to share a Puoneer anecdote.

I found that setting a higher crossover gives the reciever much more "energy" in the mids and highs so I have my crossover set to 100hz atm and mixed in with that ive got 2 8" subs in the back corners of my lisening area and 1 10" sub directly behind the listening area, the sound is great with them properly balanced.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

I found that setting a higher crossover gives the reciever much more "energy" in the mids and highs so I have my crossover set to 100hz atm and mixed in with that ive got 2 8" subs in the back corners of my lisening area and 1 10" sub directly behind the listening area, the sound is great with them properly balanced.

Nice.

 

[lovinthehd]

I'd think that depending on the mix of some things 100-500hz would be stereo for bass. But ill get a cheap fan to cool my receiver, and what I meant by subs are actually just some good mid-bass woofers. But in any case I'll have to save up a few dollars to really bump my sound quality up

Sub bass is a different range, generally 20-100hz. Even decent mid-woofers in a bookshelf should be able to better than 100hz....these are good speakers for the price if you don't mind soldering up your own crossover (I've built a set) https://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-br-1-6-1-2-2-way-bookshelf-monitor-speaker-kit-pair--300-640

 

[sizzam]

Sub bass is a different range, generally 20-100hz. Even decent mid-woofers in a bookshelf should be able to better than 100hz....these are good speakers for the price if you don't mind soldering up your own crossover (I've built a set) https://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-br-1-6-1-2-2-way-bookshelf-monitor-speaker-kit-pair--300-640

I like my tower speakers for looks as they look more imposing than bookshelf speakers and I have a pretty large room to fit them into, also by midbass woofer i meant something along the lines of some old Pioneer CS-77A's (nice meaty 15in woofer) or something along the lines of these
https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/kefq750wln/kef-q750-6.5-3-way-floorstanding-speaker-walnut-each/1.html#!specifications

 

[lovinthehd]

Only a 12" in the Pioneers and didn't dig all that deep from what I see in their manual (seems to start to roll off fairly early, starting around 100hz from the charts provided therein). A lot of those old speakers looked better than they performed (I was there ). The Kefs would be better. I also have some JBL 590s, they're probably more what you might like and occasionally go on sale for $900 a pair or so.....

 

[sizzam]

Only a 12" in the Pioneers and didn't dig all that deep from what I see in their manual (seems to start to roll off fairly early, starting around 100hz from the charts provided therein). A lot of those old speakers looked better than they performed (I was there ). The Kefs would be better. I also have some JBL 590s, they're probably more what you might like and occasionally go on sale for $900 a pair or so.....

If I can get my hands on some of those jbls then i will probably do that but the kefs are a great backup.

 

[KEW]

I like my tower speakers for looks as they look more imposing than bookshelf speakers and I have a pretty large room to fit them into, also by midbass woofer i meant something along the lines of some old Pioneer CS-77A's (nice meaty 15in woofer) or something along the lines of these
https://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/kefq750wln/kef-q750-6.5-3-way-floorstanding-speaker-walnut-each/1.html#!specifications

If you want an imposing speaker with great sound, I would suggest the dual 8" driver JBL Studio 590! They have a muscle car look as @Danzilla puts it! These are 50" tall (measure how tall yours are and you will understand what beasts these are)! But more important, they are well designed, dynamic, and fun speakers. It is the big one (to the right) in this pic:

Here is a link to refurbished for $430 each, or if you are patient, they have discounted them to something like $469/ea.when on sale 3 or 4 times a year.

Studio 590 | 250-watt, dual 8" floorstanding loudspeaker

The JBL® Studio 590 floorstanding loudspeaker brings professional-quality sound to the home experience. The Studio 590 uses the technology that JBL engineers developed for pro-audio loudspeakers to deliver accurate, powerful sound to your living room. The Studio 590 is a perfect complement to...

www.jbl.com

But honestly, if you buy a new AVR, I think you'd be let down. If you were buying from new, I would push you towards the Denon, but the Pioneer will handle most modern speakers without any issue.

 

[sizzam]

If you want an imposing speaker with great sound, I would suggest the dual 8" driver JBL Studio 590! They have a muscle car look as @Danzilla puts it! These are 50" tall (measure how tall yours are and you will understand what beasts these are)! But more important, they are well designed, dynamic, and fun speakers. They are the big ones (to the right) in this pic:

Here is a link to refurbished for $430 each, or if you are patient, they have discounted them to something like $469/ea.when on sale 3 or 4 times a year.

Studio 590 | 250-watt, dual 8" floorstanding loudspeaker

The JBL® Studio 590 floorstanding loudspeaker brings professional-quality sound to the home experience. The Studio 590 uses the technology that JBL engineers developed for pro-audio loudspeakers to deliver accurate, powerful sound to your living room. The Studio 590 is a perfect complement to...

www.jbl.com

But honestly, if you buy a new AVR, I think you'd be let down. If you were buying from new, I would push you towards the Denon, but the Pioneer will handle most modern speakers without any issue.

yea a 4 and a half foot tall speaker is exactly what im looking for ill have to save my pennies for a while to get it though.

 

[KEW]

yea a 4 and a half foot tall speaker is exactly what im looking for ill have to save my pennies for a while to get it though.

I am hoping @Danzilla will grace this thread with a photo of his setup! (hint hint), but I think he is pretty busy with work so it may be a day or two!

 

[sizzam]

I am hoping @Danzilla will grace this thread with a photo of his setup! (hint hint), but I think he is pretty busy with work so it may be a day or two!

Well if your speaking like its legendary now i have to see it.

 

[sizzam]

this video is pretty eye opening

 

[Pogre]

Get the Denon 3300 Kurt is suggesting. It's a very good AVR and if it has the connections you need you're good to go.

Don't get hung up on DACs and subjective comments about "warmer sounding", "chocolatey mids" and "better soundstage" when it comes to amplification. Folks who say that are more influenced by their eyes than their ears, IMO.

Most receivers have a pure direct or through mode that defeats any eq'ing and levels the playing field. In that setting I've found that unless there's a defect or something is wrong I don't hear the differences described by some.

I'd forget about passive bi amping unless you have some big speakers and actual separate amps for each set of binding posts. Even then it's very doubtful you'll notice any differences. I don't with my towers and I have 200 wpc of amplification to play with.

Good luck, and watch out for rabbit holes. They're all over the place in the audiophile world. Some are beneficial and you can learn some things. Others will just empty your pockets and leave you wishing you'd bought better speakers instead of dumping 1000s into electronics, cables and DACs.

 

[Pogre]

I am hoping @Danzilla will grace this thread with a photo of his setup! (hint hint), but I think he is pretty busy with work so it may be a day or two!

Whilst we're waiting for Dan...

They might not be quite 4 1/2' tall, but they can fill the room with sound!

 

[sizzam]

Whilst we're waiting for Dan...

View attachment 35666View attachment 35667

They might not be quite 4 1/2' tall, but they can fill the room with sound!

that system is very beautiful in its symmetry and the mains look like the real versions of my "white van" speakers, very nice.

 

[sizzam]

Get the Denon 3300 Kurt is suggesting. It's a very good AVR and if it has the connections you need you're good to go.

Don't get hung up on DACs and subjective comments about "warmer sounding", "chocolatey mids" and "better soundstage" when it comes to amplification. Folks who say that are more influenced by their eyes than their ears, IMO.

Most receivers have a pure direct or through mode that defeats any eq'ing and levels the playing field. In that setting I've found that unless there's a defect or something is wrong I don't hear the differences described by some.

I'd forget about passive bi amping unless you have some big speakers and actual separate amps for each set of binding posts. Even then it's very doubtful you'll notice any differences. I don't with my towers and I have 200 wpc of amplification to play with.

Good luck, and watch out for rabbit holes. They're all over the place in the audiophile world. Some are beneficial and you can learn some things. Others will just empty your pockets and leave you wishing you'd bought better speakers instead of dumping 1000s into electronics, cables and DACs.

I mean there is some merit to the "art" of audiophile equipment in the looks and performance and design all coming together.

At the end of the day I can only build the system I can afford and with limits in what I can buy, ill buy whatever suits my biases.

 

[sizzam]

Well after doing some digging around and stuff I think I found a good receiver to replace my current one

Amazon.com: Sony STR-DN1080 7.2 Channel Audio Video Home Theater Receiver: Electronics

Buy Sony STR-DN1080 7.2 Channel Audio Video Home Theater Receiver: Home Theater Systems - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

Ive not heard much about sony in av but the power supply seems to be able to back up the claimed 165W per channel simultaneously with a pretty meaty 1150W power supply vs my current 165W per channel pioneer vsx1130k with a measly 550W power supply in comparison.

Also it supports a stereo omnidirectional tuning mic that according to a review i read was much more accurate for an auto setup.

On the other hand if I were to stick with Pioneer I found this

Amazon.com: Pioneer Elite VSX-LX304 9.2-ch Network AV Receiver: Electronics

Buy Pioneer Elite VSX-LX304 9.2-ch Network AV Receiver: Receivers - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

The issue with this is it claims "170W per channel" but it only has a 760W power supply.


Any thoughts? cheers

P.S. I think I hit the "sound floor" on my receiver (vsx1130) I hear a hum from the tweeters when I was cranking out some vinyl in stereo, (aka the speakers i heard the hum from were the surrounds and center when they were not playing)

 

[lovinthehd]

Well after doing some digging around and stuff I think I found a good receiver to replace my current one

Amazon.com: Sony STR-DN1080 7.2 Channel Audio Video Home Theater Receiver: Electronics

Buy Sony STR-DN1080 7.2 Channel Audio Video Home Theater Receiver: Home Theater Systems - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

Ive not heard much about sony in av but the power supply seems to be able to back up the claimed 165W per channel simultaneously with a pretty meaty 1150W power supply vs my current 165W per channel pioneer vsx1130k with a measly 550W power supply in comparison.

Also it supports a stereo omnidirectional tuning mic that according to a review i read was much more accurate for an auto setup.

On the other hand if I were to stick with Pioneer I found this

Amazon.com: Pioneer Elite VSX-LX304 9.2-ch Network AV Receiver: Electronics

Buy Pioneer Elite VSX-LX304 9.2-ch Network AV Receiver: Receivers - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

The issue with this is it claims "170W per channel" but it only has a 760W power supply.


Any thoughts? cheers

P.S. I think I hit the "sound floor" on my receiver (vsx1130) I hear a hum from the tweeters when I was cranking out some vinyl in stereo, (aka the speakers i heard the hum from were the surrounds and center when they were not playing)

Where are you getting this "power supply" spec? I'm betting you're using a "power consumption" spec, yes? Not the same thing....nor does it indicate what you think it does if so.

 

[Pogre]

I wouldn't put so much focus on power specs. Look for the connections and features you want at a price you can do. If you're that concerned about power look for something with preouts and plan for a separate amp down the road. The stuff you're looking at and the numbers you're spitting out look like they used 4 different methods to manipulate the power specs and none look overly accurate.

Main features for an avr for me would include:
*Connections modern enough for my gear, or future gear
*Enough connections for all of my speakers, or future speakers
*Good room correction
*Full set of pre outs for additional amplification
*Decent warranty
*Sufficient power

Note that power is at the bottom of my list. That's because pretty much any decent receiver with a full set of pre out's and advanced room correction will have sufficient power for all but the most difficult speakers, and if power is a concern I have the flexibility to add more amplification should it come down to it. If you're after sound quality make sure you have the right speakers and look for good room correction. I really like what XT32 does to my system. Really wakes things up. Which is something I think you're hoping to achieve through amplification. It doesn't work like that.

 

[lovinthehd]

Plus keep in mind most avrs only provide a power rating for 2ch driven, although all channels driven ratings aren't all that meaningful either. If you want an all channels driven rating you generally need to find a bench test of such. Here's one for the Sony for example https://www.soundandvision.com/content/sony-str-dn1080-av-receiver-review-test-bench (perhaps the Sony spec is for the power supply, or at least close).