Faulty internal crossover?

[mossman77]

What receiver do you have? Any pre/pro or receiver I'm familiar with has a setting in the set up menu to lock the settings so they don't accidentally get changed. Then you release the lock if you want to change a setting and relock it afterwards. If you forget, then you can bet Audyssey will do something dumb because it was written by some sort of Nazi, that insisted "you will conform and use Audyssey".

It's a Marantz SR5012, and it's easy to check whether Audyssey is on or off.

 

[TLS Guy]

Ran some tones again making sure MultiXT was off this time. No change whatsoever. Right channel still playing at 52dB at 100Hz, 70dB at 80Hz, and 72 dB at 63 Hz. Left channel rolls off as expected.

OK now do one with the speakers set to large.

 

[TLS Guy]

It's a Marantz SR5012, and it's easy to check whether Audyssey is on or off.

Then on the second page of the general menu there will be the settings lock.

 

[ryanosaur]

Right, I realize that, but it is not 3dB down at 80 Hz and goes up below 80Hz before rolling back off. Something isn't right.

It's eq-ing below XO because there is still output to eq. That's what you asked. Small setting doesn't matter.

 

[mossman77]

Switched speaker to Large as requested. Same issue (not sure why it would make a difference):

 

[mossman77]

It's eq-ing below XO because there is still output to eq. That's what you asked. Small setting doesn't matter.

Ah, I see. Sorry, I got confused as to what you were referring to.

 

[lovinthehd]

LOL TLS guy shaking his fist at the avr/Audyssey clouds again. Nazis and self-reinserting? Good grief, having a brexit attack or something? LOL. That you need a lock on settings tells me you have no clue in this regard.

FWIW Audyssey doesn't recommend lowering suggested crossovers as it will leave a gap in coverage. From their zendesk articles: " The whole point of measuring the speakers in your room is to see where they roll off. Placement changes the theoretical "full range" spec that doesn't know about your room. You can move the crossover lower, but Audyssey won't be applying any correction below the point it found as the roll off. "

I'd try a soft reset of the avr first to see if that changes anything. Curious, I may have missed but Is the Audyssey app involved or is this the avr alone?

 

[mossman77]

LOL TLS guy shaking his fist at the avr/Audyssey clouds again. Nazis and self-reinserting? Good grief, having a brexit attack or something? LOL. That you need a lock on settings tells me you have no clue in this regard.

FWIW Audyssey doesn't recommend lowering suggested crossovers as it will leave a gap in coverage. From their zendesk articles: " The whole point of measuring the speakers in your room is to see where they roll off. Placement changes the theoretical "full range" spec that doesn't know about your room. You can move the crossover lower, but Audyssey won't be applying any correction below the point it found as the roll off. "

I'd try a soft reset of the avr first to see if that changes anything. Curious, I may have missed but Is the Audyssey app involved or is this the avr alone?

Okay. I'll do a reset, but don't expect any change. I'd bet money on it actually.

Initial measurements are with MultiXT enabled and most recent was with MultiXT disabled. Made no difference.

 

[lovinthehd]

Okay. I'll do a reset, but don't expect any change. I'd bet money on it actually.

Initial measurements are with MultiXT enabled and most recent was with MultiXT disabled. Made no difference.

I meant a soft reset (simply unplugging it for a while). Just to see if that helps, sometimes it does. Sometimes it doesn't and you need to do a full reset (and of course no guarantees that will do it either, you could have some other defect not addressable that way).

So you're just using the avr/mic interface, no Audyssey MultEQ Editor app was more my question.

 

[mossman77]

I meant a soft reset (simply unplugging it for a while). Just to see if that helps, sometimes it does. Sometimes it doesn't and you need to do a full reset (and of course no guarantees that will do it either, you could have some other defect not addressable that way).

So you're just using the avr/mic interface, no Audyssey MultEQ Editor app was more my question.

Correct. AVR and provided mic only. The plots I took were with REW and a Umik-1.

 

[mossman77]

All else aside, given the Audyssey EQ correction curves posted and the RF response I am receiving, do we agree this is not normal operation by any means?

 

[lovinthehd]

Have you tried moving the speakers in case it is a mode issue instead?

Also, how many mic positions are you measuring with or is it just one?

 

[Pogre]

All else aside, given the Audyssey EQ correction curves posted and the RF response I am receiving, do we agree this is not normal operation by any means?

No, I think you might be measuring a room mode or misinterpreting something. I also think there's a misunderstanding or miscommunication. Plus TLS will have you throwing your avr in the river (actually he recycles responsibly so smash it with a hammer then take it to a recycling center). Either way I'm a bit confused.

I suspect you're way overthinking something. Ever since you got REW you've been like a hammer looking for nails, lol.

 

[TLS Guy]

Switched speaker to Large as requested. Same issue (not sure why it would make a difference):

View attachment 35429

Because if it is set to large there is no crossover involved in the receiver. So that then means the power amp or preamp has a non linearity.

 

[TLS Guy]

Have you tried moving the speakers in case it is a mode issue instead?

Also, how many mic positions are you measuring with or is it just one?

Its not, because if he connects the right channel to the left speaker, then the trouble appears on the left speaker.

His latest post now strongly suggests a non linearity in the right channel of that receiver.

 

[lovinthehd]

Its not, because if he connects the right channel to the left speaker, then the trouble appears on the left speaker.

His latest post now strongly suggests a non linearity in the right channel of that receiver.

Could be but still would like to see multi measuring positions as well as possibly playing around with seat and or speaker position as well.....

 

[TLS Guy]

All else aside, given the Audyssey EQ correction curves posted and the RF response I am receiving, do we agree this is not normal operation by any means?

I agree it is not normal. The question is cause. Obviously there is a non linearity somewhere.

LOL TLS guy shaking his fist at the avr/Audyssey clouds again. Nazis and self-reinserting? Good grief, having a brexit attack or something? LOL. That you need a lock on settings tells me you have no clue in this regard.

FWIW Audyssey doesn't recommend lowering suggested crossovers as it will leave a gap in coverage. From their zendesk articles: " The whole point of measuring the speakers in your room is to see where they roll off. Placement changes the theoretical "full range" spec that doesn't know about your room. You can move the crossover lower, but Audyssey won't be applying any correction below the point it found as the roll off. "

I'd try a soft reset of the avr first to see if that changes anything. Curious, I may have missed but Is the Audyssey app involved or is this the avr alone?

On every pre/pro I have had Audyssey has imposed itself unless I have the menu locked down. Anytime I have forgotten Audyssey does its worst. Fortunately my room response curves could not be improved by any correction program, only made worse. When Audyssey inserts its curve from the setup correction curve I can hear the mischief immediately. I have run it in the new room and it inserts harmful totally gratuitous EQ. It is an absolutely ghastly program for any system I have.

I suppose if you have a system with issues you might get lucky. I have zero issues, as I have documented here.

 

[lovinthehd]

On every pre/pro I have had Audyssey has imposed itself unless I have the menu locked down. Anytime I have forgotten Audyssey does its worst. Fortunately my room response curves could not be improved by any correction program, only made worse. When Audyssey inserts its curve from the setup correction curve I can hear the mischief immediately. I have run it in the new room and it inserts harmful totally gratuitous EQ. It is an absolutely ghastly program for any system I have.

I suppose if you have a system with issues you might get lucky. I have zero issues, as I have documented here.

It just sounds you aren't familiar with settings and behavior....whether you need it with your super awesome speaker and room setup, who knows.

 

[mossman77]

I'm about to buy a new o-scope (been wanting one at home for a while), so I can take some voltage measurements at the speaker outputs at different frequencies and that will show without a doubt if the right channel crossover is not filtering properly, which I think we already know. But it will be nice to have some more solid evidence.

 

[TLS Guy]

I'm about to buy a new o-scope (been wanting one at home for a while), so I can take some voltage measurements at the speaker outputs at different frequencies and that will show without a doubt if the right channel crossover is not filtering properly, which I think we already know. But it will be nice to have some more solid evidence.

That will really nail it down. You will also be able to find where this is occurring by measuring the preots and the speaker outputs. I assume you also have a signal generator as well, as that will also be required.