Coronavirus

[pewternhrata]

Riddle me this one. If this is supposed to be this huge wipe out population hide your wife hide your kids virus, the why the hell do the 3 people in Ohio with confirmed cases on 'self quarantine' where they still could go out into the general public? I recently saw possibly one is under full quarantine, that still leaves 2. Also some students were in close contact with one of those, they are only on self quarantine. Your leaving those infected with the opportunity to infect others. Something is missing with this or the media and primaries are just taking this and running with it.

 

[pewternhrata]

The sad truth is we still don't have enough information to make any definitive statements yet. Only time and research will tell. Who's susceptible and at greater risk is still an unknown. For example the pandemic of 1917~1918 hit healthy young men/women with disastrous results, more often than the old and young.

Hopefully the Chinese and South Korea & Japan will be more forthcoming and share their data with us, to combat this threat.

For now the old adage applies, cleanliness is next to godliness.

For example; that was over a hundred years ago and life expectancy was 50yrs. Advancements in health will greatly reduce those pandemics....or we could only hope

 

[Dan]

Well my east coast hospital has our first patient with more suspected. As I figured it was a mess before he was diagnosed as he had not traveled abroad. He had contact through his job with hundreds of people before coming to get x rays as an outpatient and then in the ED. Two x rays techs and 14 nurses are now quarantined. Worse he was put in a semiprivate room initially as he wasn't suspected to have it. There are currently only 50 patients a day who can be tested by the DC dept. of Health as the kits are in limited supply, though that should improve soon. For us in health care it's the ones we don't know about that are the problem for now.

The hospital seems more worried about not scaring our regular patients than about what might happen. They have restricted our travel for meetings. I'm just waiting for the deluge...

 

[Ponzio]

There are now 77 confirmed cases in Canada and we've just had our first reported death from the virus, in British Columbia. There have been no cases reported on the east coast yet. The Nova Scotia government has stopped all school class trips to Europe until the end of April, although I fully expect that to be extended. My daughter is supposed to be going to New York City, in May, on a class trip.

Sadly this insidious disease has hit 3 southeastern Pennsylvania counties in the last 4 days with an unbelievable ferocity. In Montgomery County where I live there are 2 dead now and countless affected we're coming to learn. Countless school districts have closed, including 9 in my county. I literally live right across from a middle-school and they anticipate that Plymouth Meeting will soon follow suit.

 

[Kvn_Walker]

Riddle me this one. If this is supposed to be this huge wipe out population hide your wife hide your kids virus, the why the hell do the 3 people in Ohio with confirmed cases on 'self quarantine' where they still could go out into the general public? I recently saw possibly one is under full quarantine, that still leaves 2. Also some students were in close contact with one of those, they are only on self quarantine. Your leaving those infected with the opportunity to infect others. Something is missing with this or the media and primaries are just taking this and running with it.

You ever considered the fact that some people are just dumbasses? If you're so sure it's overblown, go visit northern Italy for a few weeks and be sure to take plenty of pictures.

Oh that's right, you can't... because the entire country is under quarantine now due to what you think is an overblown media hoax.

 

[GO-NAD!]

Well my east coast hospital has our first patient with more suspected. As I figured it was a mess before he was diagnosed as he had not traveled abroad. He had contact through his job with hundreds of people before coming to get x rays as an outpatient and then in the ED. Two x rays techs and 14 nurses are now quarantined. Worse he was put in a semiprivate room initially as he wasn't suspected to have it. There are currently only 50 patients a day who can be tested by the DC dept. of Health as the kits are in limited supply, though that should improve soon. For us in health care it's the ones we don't know about that are the problem for now.

The hospital seems more worried about not scaring our regular patients than about what might happen. They have restricted our travel for meetings. I'm just waiting for the deluge...

It's incidents like this that can cripple a health care system, with health care workers either infected, or in quarantine.

 

[herbu]

his statements on the topic sound like those he makes on most topics - pulled straight from his derriere.

More guidance from one who is known for his objective and unbiased analysis.

 

[Swerd]

For example; that was over a hundred years ago and life expectancy was 50 yrs. Advancements in health will greatly reduce those pandemics.

I don't see how your comments about influenza at the end of WWI can be compared to the Covid-19 epidemic we now have. The only thing in common may be the absence of a vaccine. In 1918 we had no influenza vaccine. In 2020 we have no Covid-19 vaccine.

While a 50 year life expectancy 100 years ago is not incorrect, it hardly can be considered normal for 100 years ago. See https://u.demog.berkeley.edu/~andrew/1918/figure2.html. Compare the 1914-15 numbers for men & women to the 1917-18 numbers. There was a world war going on. Also see the different values for men and women in 1917. The 1918 numbers reflect both war and influenza deaths in men, and influenza deaths in women. By 1921 these number had bounced up to at least 60 years.

The world-wide flu epidemic of 1918-19 caused most deaths among young otherwise healthy adults. Older people, were much less affected.

...or we could only hope

That may be a lot more on point. But why rely on only hope?

Year	Male life expectancy	Female life expectancy
1914​	52.0​	56.8​
1915​	52.5​	56.8​
1916​	49.6​	54.3​
1917​	48.4​	54.0​
1918​	36.6​	42.2​
1919​	53.5​	56.0​
1920​	53.6​	54.6​
1921​	60.0​	61.8​

 

[lovinthehd]

More guidance from one who is known for his objective and unbiased analysis.

LOL from a guy who has his nose firmly up said derriere.

 

[Kvn_Walker]

It's incidents like this that can cripple a health care system, with health care workers either infected, or in quarantine.

My best half is an X-Ray tech at one of the 2 hospitals in the city. I intend to have a long talk with her tonight about moving forward if something happens to one of us.

I'm hoping if one of us goes it's me, but she's going to be higher risk of contracting it due to her job. But I've had asthma in the past and am more prone to getting colds, while she's pretty damn resilient.

We have the $$ we pocketed from the house we just sold, and a $29,000 flex line of credit that's in my name only (dead folks ain't gotta pay it back ), plus the cars are both paid off, so she's got cash and assets to live off for at least 2 years, even though the life insurance shouldn't take that long (but that's a possibility if this gets bad enough). I'll even make a list of what my hi-fi equipment should get on the used market.

I've told her for years that if I croak, just take the life insurance, buy a good house with cash, and she will only have to pay property taxes and utilities. I'm not wealthy by any means but at least my affairs are decently in order.

 

[Swerd]

Well my east coast hospital has our first patient with more suspected. As I figured it was a mess before he was diagnosed as he had not traveled abroad. He had contact through his job with hundreds of people before coming to get x rays as an outpatient and then in the ED. Two x rays techs and 14 nurses are now quarantined. Worse he was put in a semiprivate room initially as he wasn't suspected to have it. There are currently only 50 patients a day who can be tested by the DC dept. of Health as the kits are in limited supply, though that should improve soon. For us in health care it's the ones we don't know about that are the problem for now.

The hospital seems more worried about not scaring our regular patients than about what might happen. They have restricted our travel for meetings. I'm just waiting for the deluge...

I hope there will be space for regular patients in the future.

 

[Swerd]

My best half is an X-Ray tech at one of the 2 hospitals in the city. I intend to have a long talk with her tonight about moving forward if something happens to one of us.

I do understand how serious this epidemic might become. Please don't get me wrong. I especially applaud your idea about talking with your wife about moving forward in case one of you dies.

At the risk of being accused of gallows humor, I'll focus only on this:

I'll even make a list of what my hi-fi equipment should get on the used market.

Even an audiophile wannabe would have his hi-fi gear buried with him. A proper audiophile would use one of his massive speaker cabinets as a coffin.

Anything less than that, and we'll have to revoke your AH membership card .

 

[Mr._Clark]

Thanks for providing the link to that report. It's certainly an interesting idea, that might work. Unfortunately those salt-treated surgical masks were tested against influenza virus particles, not Covid-19. Unless we have direct results, we cannot assume it will react the same as influenza did.

Yeah, I understand. Everyone is free to draw their own conclusions concerning the likely effectiveness against Covid-19.

The original paper states that the viruses are physically damaged by recrystallization of the saline solution:

"Here, we report a simple but efficient virus inactivation system exploiting the naturally occurring salt recrystallization. Our strategy is to modify the surface of the fibrous filtration layer within masks with a continuous salt film for virus deactivation via two successive processes: i) salt is locally dissolved by the viral aerosols and ii) supersaturation is followed by evaporation-induced salt recrystallization. Consequently, viruses are exposed to increasingly higher concentrations of saline solution during drying and physically damaged by recrystallization."

https://www.nature.com/articles/srep39956

I'm willing to speculate that this mechanism is likely to be effective against other viruses.

Here's another article:

A biomedical engineer created a mask coated in salt that he says could neutralize viruses like the coronavirus in 5 minutes

A research team says coating surgical face masks in table salt allows them to kill pathogens, thereby reducing disease transmission.

www.businessinsider.com

 

[Mr._Clark]

Here's another article:

>>>"We’ve tested our system on three different influenza viruses and have shown that the virus on the surface of a coated contaminated mask is inactive within five minutes and completely destroyed within 30 minutes," says Choi. He believes that the technology should be equally effective against coronavirus.<<<

Salty masks could kill coronavirus

Should you be in China right now, you'll see a lot of people wearing surgical masks to protect themselves against coronavirus. A Canadian scientist claims that such masks may actually do more harm than good, if handled improperly – so he's created a coating that could reportedly change that.

newatlas.com

Unfortunately, the product is not expected to be commercially available for 12-18 months.

 

[Ponzio]

Are you not assured? [sigh]

Speaking of gallows humor, I couldn't help but laugh at the reactions of the CDC staff(?) as they're internally cringing to some of Don-Don's answers to reporters questions. Especially when he mentions his uncle John, who taught at MIT. This is not the first time he's compared himself to his uncle in an interview [shakes head].

Nice hat Donnie, very appropriate!

What a rube.

 

[GO-NAD!]

More guidance from one who is known for his objective and unbiased analysis.

How kind of you to say!

 

[herbu]

If your source of knowledge on a complex technical subject is binary: - Trump or Pelosi, then you are in the ranks of the ignorant, which at this time seems to be vast. You need to listen to knowledgeable physicians and scientists. Trump I'm sure is being fed good and vital information. He lacks the education and possibly the intelligence to understand it. Worse he has the arrogance to think he has more understanding of the problem than the experts. That is why his handling of this will be almost certain disaster. I tell you this as a committed Republican. Covid 19 and Trump will really put this disaster on steroids. I hope ways are being explored to remove him on grounds of insanity. You can now make a good case for that.

You see, this is where we disagree about Trump. A CEO or President never has the education to understand every discipline he controls. That's why he builds a team he can trust, and relies on them for counsel. Your statements about "intelligence" and "arrogance" are based on your emotion and media bias. You may be a smart guy, but you have no idea what information or advice is being given to POTUS, or why he makes the decisions he does. All we have to judge are the results. And Trump's results, by any objective measure, are positive so far. Criticisms from the left can largely be dismissed with their own statements from the past when a Democrat did the same thing they now decry. But I'm not the one who brought Trump into this discussion, so let's move on.

I am listening to physicians and scientists, and like man-made climate change, I hear conflicting opinions. I hear the numbers in the US will predictably rise because only now are people without symptoms being given the test for Corona. It doesn't mean a massive surge in infections, just a surge in testing. I can't get past the fact that you and I have lived through a number of "epidemics" without catastrophe. I see the relatively huge number of deaths each year from various strains of flu, with what has become a normal acceptance. I see many people with the "binary" view you mention trying to blame Trump for the spread of this virus. I see the country flocking to stock up on butt-ribbon and hand sanitizer.

Even you tell me I should take it more seriously. And do what? What does taking it more seriously mean? We already avoid crowds because we don't like them. We have dogs and cats, so habitually wash hands and surfaces a lot. We have a stock of staples just because we buy cheaper in bulk. So what is the purpose of all the doom-and-gloom? How does it help? What would you have us do?

 

[pewternhrata]

I don't see how your comments about influenza at the end of WWI can be compared to the Covid-19 epidemic we now have. The only thing in common may be the absence of a vaccine. In 1918 we had no influenza vaccine. In 2020 we have no Covid-19 vaccine.

While a 50 year life expectancy 100 years ago is not incorrect, it hardly can be considered normal for 100 years ago. See https://u.demog.berkeley.edu/~andrew/1918/figure2.html. Compare the 1914-15 numbers for men & women to the 1917-18 numbers. There was a world war going on. Also see the different values for men and women in 1917. The 1918 numbers reflect both war and influenza deaths in men, and influenza deaths in women. By 1921 these number had bounced up to at least 60 years.

The world-wide flu epidemic of 1918-19 caused most deaths among young otherwise healthy adults. Older people, were much less affected.
That may be a lot more on point. But why rely on only hope?

Year	Male life expectancy	Female life expectancy
1914​	52.0​	56.8​
1915​	52.5​	56.8​
1916​	49.6​	54.3​
1917​	48.4​	54.0​
1918​	36.6​	42.2​
1919​	53.5​	56.0​
1920​	53.6​	54.6​
1921​	60.0​	61.8​

It wasnt meant to compare, both situations are irrelevant to each other given the decade they took place imo.

 

[pewternhrata]

You ever considered the fact that some people are just dumbasses? If you're so sure it's overblown, go visit northern Italy for a few weeks and be sure to take plenty of pictures.

Oh that's right, you can't... because the entire country is under quarantine now due to what you think is an overblown media hoax.

I'm not saying it is overblown. Pending epidemic yet those with the virus are able to stay home, under 'trust' that they actually do so. Shouldn't they be highly monitored and forced to stay away form those not infected? Doesnt seem like the logical thing to do considering the rate of outbreaks in other countries. Thats why I said something is missing. I never said it was hoax but that's cool.

 

[Kvn_Walker]

I do understand how serious this epidemic might become. Please don't get me wrong. I especially applaud your idea about talking with your wife about moving forward in case one of you dies.

At the risk of being accused of gallows humor, I'll focus only on this:
Even an audiophile wannabe would have his hi-fi gear buried with him. A proper audiophile would use one of his massive speaker cabinets as a coffin.

Anything less than that, and we'll have to revoke your AH membership card .

She could probably cut me up and stuff me in the speakers but they'd have to remove the transmission line first. That's what I get for not buying ported cabinets I guess.