Monolith 5X or Model 5000 for Polk LSiM707 system

[lovinthehd]

IMO if you own an AVR you probably don’t “need” an external amp, but it doesn’t hurt.

If you’re getting an external amp because you feel your speakers require it, then you might as well go “all the way” and get a more “hardcore” amp like the amps made by ATI (200W and 300W amps).

If you got the Model-5000, you’ll only be asking yourself “what if”.

He said he got the Monoprice/Monolith...so he did get the ATI Will it have the magical soundstage and control, tho?

 

[Danzilla31]

Hi, haven't been here for a while and I did try to search to see if I was kicking an already dead horse here but I couldn't find anything specific to my question so here it goes....

I test drove a friends Monolith 5X and loved it, but will the Outlaw Model 5000 do nearly the same for half the price? I recently bought Polk Audio LSiM707, 706c, 703 based system and my NAD T758 V3 doesn't have the guts these speakers demand. My room is 28x20x9 and I use a sub for LFE but usually run the 707s full range for music.

Seems like the Outlaw is a little warmer and the Monolith a bit more analytical from what I've read here and other places. I run Dirac via my NAD which lessens the affect of an amps signature. I'm inclined to go Monolith for the extra output and perhaps its a bit quicker, but truly the price difference is significant. Oh, I don't need balanced inputs either.

Thoughts, comments, advice?

Thanks.

I think from what I've read the polks can be a difficult load to drive.

Always wanted to experience those speakers myself and the prices right noe since there clearing them out Thanks to to the Legend lineup is ridiculously awesome 50 to 60% markdowns

I'd go with the monolith if it was me both outlaw and monolith amps are done by ATI I believe both fine amps I think the monolith does give you a little more headroom into difficult loads tho.

Give me a heads up on how it sounds looking forward to your experience with whatever you get.

 

[lovinthehd]

I think from what I've read the polks can be a difficult load to drive.

Always wanted to experience those speakers myself and the prices right noe since there clearing them out Thanks to to the Legend lineup is ridiculously awesome 50 to 60% markdowns

I'd go with the monolith if it was me both outlaw and monolith amps are done by ATI I believe both fine amps I think the monolith does give you a little more headroom into difficult loads tho.

Give me a heads up on how it sounds looking forward to your experience with whatever you get.

FWIW the Outlaw 5000 is not one of the ATI made amps that Outlaw markets.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

He said he got the Monoprice/Monolith...so he did get the ATI Will it have the magical soundstage and control, tho?

It will be magic if he thinks it is magic BEFORE listening to it.

 

[Danzilla31]

FWIW the Outlaw 5000 is not one of the ATI made amps that Outlaw markets.

So it's only the higher up models they make for them? Like the 7 channel beasts that are fully balanced. Makes sense when you think about it.

So who makes it then? Is it an in house production? Or is there another company that outsources it for them

Regardless it's a fine amp that tests over what it's specced for wouldnt have surprised me if it had been ATI it's a nice amp

I'd still recommend the monolith for our OP though. From info from members on some other threads and just research on them because I was interested in this polk lineup before JBL won me over they are a tough load to drive and I'm not sure but I don't think they are very sensitive either. So yeah even if its not a huge amount Id take the headroom of the monolith even though the 5000 is a great amp

 

[Danzilla31]

Thanks PENG. All of that makes sense on paper, but when I was using my old Adcom GFA-7300 (like the 758, rated at 60 wpc all channels driven) it appeared to have more control over what the speaker's drivers were doing. I don't know audiophile terminology, but when pushed it was cleaner, it seemed to not only push the drivers but also pull them back creating a sound that was more cohesive and clean than the NAD on its own, best way I know to describe it.

While I'm not much of a fan of audioscience reviews, that is a good point about the pre-out performance. I will research that a bit further.

I still listen to a fair amount of music in 2-channel and I like the Polks running at full range when I do. Until my home is completed (building) I am not using a sub as my current room is tiny and the 707s look ridiculous, but I will buy either a Monolith M15-S or an SB-4000. As mentioned my space is fairly large at 5000 cuft and I listen to music pretty loud along with an occasional movie. Bladerunner 2049 is freaking awesome.... can't wait to fully experience that movie.

And for the record OP I understand what your trying to say like you said it's hard to express it when you dont know all the terms and lingo sounds like what you were saying is the original amp you tried just made things a little cleaner a little clearer and helped with dynamics which is what a good amp will do if you need it it will be accurate and true to the source and just give you better clarity headroom and dynamics. Not everyone on here is going to jump your s@$! just cause it's hard for you to express what your meaning.

A lot of owners that own those polks I spoke to when I was considering them talked about the fact that they performed better with external amplification. Period. enough owners who I knew knew what they were talking about and weren't just doing magical listening that I trust there feedback and you bought an entire set for your surrounds not just the towers

They are all of them a 4 ohm speaker load legitimately and I dont think external amplification will hurt anything may even help you in your case. That's not a small room your about 13 feet back you said? Yeah I think it will help. And my vote is for the monoprice

 

[lovinthehd]

So it's only the higher up models they make for them? Like the 7 channel beasts that are fully balanced. Makes sense when you think about it.

So who makes it then? Is it an in house production? Or is there another company that outsources it for them

Regardless it's a fine amp that tests over what it's specced for wouldnt have surprised me if it had been ATI it's a nice amp

I'd still recommend the monolith for our OP though. From info from members on some other threads and just research on them because I was interested in this polk lineup before JBL won me over they are a tough load to drive and I'm not sure but I don't think they are very sensitive either. So yeah even if its not a huge amount Id take the headroom of the monolith even though the 5000 is a great amp

Yes afaik the other amps are ATI built. The 5000 is made in China (indicates on the back it is designed in the US by Outlaw, tho) but don't know details of who particularly (altho think I ran across some detail once but can't find again). OP said he ordered the Monolith, tho.

Measurements of the LSiM system https://www.soundandvision.com/content/polk-lsim707-surround-speaker-system-ht-labs-measures

 

[Danzilla31]

Yes afaik the other amps are ATI built. The 5000 is made in China (indicates on the back it is designed in the US by Outlaw, tho) but don't know details of who particularly (altho think I ran across some detail once but can't find again). OP said he ordered the Monolith, tho.

Measurements of the LSiM system https://www.soundandvision.com/content/polk-lsim707-surround-speaker-system-ht-labs-measures

Yeah sensitivity not the best and they aren't the easiest of loads I could have sworn I read somewhere there new legend series are going to be even less sensitivity as well and a 4ohm speaker as well. But anyone willing to spend that amount of coin isn't going to be playing around with your everyday run of the mill avr either to drive them I wager good info lovin thanks

 

[tparm]

And for the record OP I understand what your trying to say like you said it's hard to express it when you dont know all the terms and lingo sounds like what you were saying is the original amp you tried just made things a little cleaner a little clearer and helped with dynamics which is what a good amp will do if you need it it will be accurate and true to the source and just give you better clarity headroom and dynamics. Not everyone on here is going to jump your s@$! just cause it's hard for you to express what your meaning.

A lot of owners that own those polks I spoke to when I was considering them talked about the fact that they performed better with external amplification. Period. enough owners who I knew knew what they were talking about and weren't just doing magical listening that I trust there feedback and you bought an entire set for your surrounds not just the towers

They are all of them a 4 ohm speaker load legitimately and I dont think external amplification will hurt anything may even help you in your case. That's not a small room your about 13 feet back you said? Yeah I think it will help. And my vote is for the monoprice

Thanks for the post, you indeed said it better than I! Ordering the Monolith on Black Friday.

 

[PENG]

Yeah sensitivity not the best and they aren't the easiest of loads I could have sworn I read somewhere there new legend series are going to be even less sensitivity as well and a 4ohm speaker as well. But anyone willing to spend that amount of coin isn't going to be playing around with your everyday run of the mill avr either to drive them I wager good info lovin thanks

Combined with other factors such as large room, 13 ft seating distance, and he said " I listen to music pretty loud along with an occasional movie. Bladerunner 2049 is freaking awesome.... can't wait to fully experience that movie. ", that's why I suggested 300 W to 500 WPC power amp.

Again the only thing I am a little skeptical is his avr's pre out voltage, though practically speaking as long as the thing don't shutdown when pushed to the limit, it should be fine during loud movie watching because I highly doubt too many people can hear 1% or even much higher THD+N at loud levels.

There seem to be much misconception (perpetuated from internet and magazine hearsay and even articles written by people who don't have good understand of electrical principles) on the topics of avr/avp+amp in terms of preout specs/measured performance, and the matching power amp sensitivity, as well as the power supplies of amps vs receivers. I am contemplating starting a thread on those topics.

 

[PENG]

Thanks for the post, you indeed said it better than I! Ordering the Monolith on Black Friday.

Would you consider the MCA525? Good price in Canada, not sure about USA.

 

[tparm]

Would you consider the MCA525? Good price in Canada, not sure about USA.

Maybe you could ship me one? I don't know if I am allowed to list prices here so I'll just say the Anthem is nearly 3x the cost of the Monolith, and that's before any sale.

Want to write a brief summary concerning this, "There seem to be much misconception (perpetuated from internet and magazine hearsay and even articles written by people who don't have good understand of electrical principles) on the topics of avr/avp+amp in terms of preout specs/measured performance, and the matching power amp sensitivity, as well as the power supplies of amps vs receivers. I am contemplating starting a thread on those topics."

 

[PENG]

Maybe you could ship me one? I don't know if I am allowed to list prices here so I'll just say the Anthem is nearly 3x the cost of the Monolith, and that's before any sale.

If you can live with 3 channel, the price would be less than double. I think the Monolith amps are good budget choices, personally I prefer the better specs and apparent build quality of the MCA, and the Halo amps too.

 

[Danzilla31]

If you can live with 3 channel, the price would be less than double. I think the Monolith amps are good budget choices, personally I prefer the better specs and apparent build quality of the MCA, and the Halo amps too.

I own the MCA 525 and your right PENG it is an outstanding amp the 3 channel for less then double would be a great deal but the OP wants best bang for buck and I can understand that I think the Monolith is a good option for him in that regards.

 

[KEW]

So it's only the higher up models they make for them? Like the 7 channel beasts that are fully balanced. Makes sense when you think about it.So who makes it then? Is it an in house production? Or is there another company that outsources it for themRegardless it's a fine amp that tests over what it's specced for wouldnt have surprised me if it had been ATI it's a nice ampI'd still recommend the monolith for our OP though. From info from members on some other threads and just research on them because I was interested in this polk lineup before JBL won me over they are a tough load to drive and I'm not sure but I don't think they are very sensitive either. So yeah even if its not a huge amount Id take the headroom of the monolith even though the 5000 is a great amp

M Code offered the following:

The 975 & 5000 are built in mainland China (Nanjing),same factory that builds alot of OE products for NAD, Harman, Bose, Russound.. The Parasound products are mainly built in Taiwan.. Two totally separate vendors..
The Taiwan vendor builds alot of amplifiers for multi-room use for brands such as Niles, SpeakerCraft, Sonance, DaVinchi..

Just my $0.02...

https://forums.audioholics.com/forums/threads/curious-about-power-amp-surround-sound-processor-vs-avreceiver.113662/#post-1292881

He had stated that the Outlaw 2200 is made at the facility that makes Parasound, and, from that, I had incorrectly assumed that all non-ATI Outlaw electronics were made at the Parasound facility. He set me straight with this post! Of course NAD, Harman, and Russound are not bad companies to be associated with!

 

[lovinthehd]

M Code offered the following:

https://forums.audioholics.com/forums/threads/curious-about-power-amp-surround-sound-processor-vs-avreceiver.113662/#post-1292881

He had stated that the Outlaw 2200 is made at the facility that makes Parasound, and, from that, I had incorrectly assumed that all non-ATI Outlaw electronics were made at the Parasound facility. He set me straight with this post! Of course NAD, Harman, and Russound are not bad companies to be associated with!

That's what I was thinking of, thanks for finding it! Had forgotten about the 2200 as well....

 

[tparm]

Just an update, as I know you all are sitting on the edge of your seats in anticipation... Bought the 7X (used) and it arrived scratched and with a broken binding post. For a nearly 100 lb amp it wasn't packaged all that well by the seller and I got all my money back. Also, I sold both Adcoms today (after listing for a month).

So now I think I will alter my house plans to make the dedicated room a bit smaller, sell my T758.3 and buy the T778. Forget the external amps. Hopefully the architecture around the new Sabre DAC set is better, the hybrid tech provides solid output and quick responses to dynamic peaks and life will go on. I love Dirac and BluOS and aside form the measurement debate my 758 has been flawless after some time dedicated to set up.

Whether worth it or not, I don't know, but I have the itch and i'd like to try out the 778. The room will be 5.2.4, changed my mind on subs too and thinking dual HSU ULS-15 Mk IIs. My room should end up being roughly 15-16 x 22-23 x 9.