Yamaha Owners’ Thread (AVR, Pre-pro, Amp)

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I played around with the Yamaha EQ settings. There are 3 choices.

1. Through - Bypass mode - no EQ, does not allow you to adjust anything.

2. Auto EQ - 3 options - Flat, Front, or Natural- does not allow you to adjust anything except for the 3 choices of Flat, Front, or Natural.

3. Manual - Parametric EQ - by default it is set to no EQ - frequency response is flat. This allows you to manually adjust all the speakers and subwoofers.

Yamaha PEQ
Number of Bands: 7
Default Bands:
#1: 62.50 Hz
#2: 125.0 Hz
#3: 396.9 Hz
#4: 1.00 kHz
#5: 2.52 kHz
#6: 6.35 kHz
#7: 16.0 kHz

You can change any of the 7 Bands Frequency to any of the Frequencies.

Frequencies: 15.6 Hz, 19.7, 24.8, 31.3, 39.4, 49.6, 62.5, 78.7, 99.2, 125 Hz, 157.5 Hz, 198.4 Hz, 250 Hz, 315.0 Hz, 396.9 Hz, 500.0 Hz, 630.0 Hz, 793.7 Hz, 1.0 kHz, 1.26 kHz, 1.59 kHz, 2.0 kHz, 2.52 kHz, 3.17 kHz, 4.0 kHz, 5.04 kHz, 6.35 kHz, 8.0 kHz, 10.1 kHz, 12.7 kHz, 16.0 kHz

Q: 0.5, 0.63, 0.794, 1.0, 1.26, 1.587, 2.0, 2.52, 3.175, 4.0, 5.04, 6.35, 8.0, 10.08

Gain (0.5 dB increments) : -20.0 to +6.0 dB

PEQ Data Copy: Copies the Parametric EQ values acquired with "AUTO SETUP" to the "MANUAL" fields for fine adjustment

3 Auto Setup EQ options: Flat, Front, Natural

PEQ Data Clear: Restore default settings for all speakers - all speakers set to no EQ.

Take Home message:
You can apply the YPAO auto EQ if you want. Then, use “PEQ Data Copy” to copy the Auto EQ to manual PEQ. For example, Gene copied the NATURAL YPAO to the Manual PEQ. Then adjusted the manual EQ to fine-tune.

If you don’t want to mess with frequencies above 125Hz, then set the Gain for Frequencies above 125Hz to 0.0dB (flat, no EQ).

As for me, I left all the speakers manual PEQ to default 0.0dB (flat, no EQ) and adjusted only the 2 subwoofers PEQ from 24.8Hz-99.2Hz.

 

[snakeeyes]

I’m now using “Through” mode instead of “Natural” mode. I think I’m liking this one best now.

 

[Ataraxia]

I've been using YPAO Flat for some time now after initially liking Through mode. I dabbled with REW a little bit and have a big null @ 100 HZ. The mid/high clarity and detail is usually greatly improved and bass tighter when in FLAT mode.

 

[snakeeyes]

I've been using YPAO Flat for some time now after initially liking Through mode. I dabbled with REW a little bit and have a big null @ 100 HZ. The mid/high clarity and detail is usually greatly improved and bass tighter when in FLAT mode.

I’ll try that one out too. Thanks

 

[snakeeyes]

Definitely Through mode is the one I’m enjoying most. At least today.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I’m now using “Through” mode instead of “Natural” mode. I think I’m liking this one best now.

Have you ever compared the subjective sound quality between THROUGH and MANUAL (but without changing any PEQ - leave all PEQ at default of 0.0dB for everything)?

I kind of figured we can't tell the difference unless we actually change the PEQ in MANUAL.

Only reason I use MANUAL is because I like to PEQ the Subs.

 

[snakeeyes]

Have you ever compared the subjective sound quality between THROUGH and MANUAL (but without changing any PEQ - leave all PEQ at default of 0.0dB for everything)?

I kind of figured we can't tell the difference unless we actually change the PEQ in MANUAL.

Only reason I use MANUAL is because I like to PEQ the Subs.

I haven’t adjusted anything in manual yet. Probably will try it at some point though.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I haven’t adjusted anything in manual yet. Probably will try it at some point though.

No, I mean DON'T adjust anything in Manual Mode.

But just compare Through Mode vs Manual Mode (with no adjustments).

Can you tell any difference?

 

[snakeeyes]

No, I mean DON'T adjust anything in Manual Mode.

But just compare Through Mode vs Manual Mode (with no adjustments).

Can you tell any difference?

Makes sense they are the same. They sound the same to me at least.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Makes sense they are the same. They sound the same to me at least.

Same here. Many audio experts don't think we should be tinkering with frequencies above 200Hz anyway. So it makes sense that we like THROUGH mode best.

When I changed the mode from THROUGH to MANUAL-WITHOUT-EQ, I couldn't tell the difference, which is great for me since I wanted to EQ only the Subs below 80Hz to get my NUCLEAR Subwoofer bass.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I've been using YPAO Flat for some time now after initially liking Through mode. I dabbled with REW a little bit and have a big null @ 100 HZ. The mid/high clarity and detail is usually greatly improved and bass tighter when in FLAT mode.

Did you like FLAT better than THROUGH after you realized FLAT had a better REW FR graph?

 

[snakeeyes]

Same here. Many audio experts don't think we should be tinkering with frequencies above 200Hz anyway. So it makes sense that we like THROUGH mode best.

When I changed the mode from THROUGH to MANUAL-WITHOUT-EQ, I couldn't tell the difference, which is great for me since I wanted to EQ only the Subs below 80Hz to get my NUCLEAR Subwoofer bass.

The “Natural” setting actually sounded more like my old 2003 Yamaha RXV3300 so maybe it was tuned like that. I think at first I wanted the RXA2060 to sound similar but now I really don’t want that sound effect. (Plenty of DSP modes if I’m wanting that). LOL.

 

[Otto Plyot]

I have a Yamaha A-780 and tried the YPAO calibration. I wasn't happy with the results so I'd like to change them. I understand that once you calibrate with YPAO, you can't go back without a complete reset so the advice is to leave YPAO:Flat and then tweak, either by ear or with an SPL. I don't use any DSP programs so I just keep it at Straight for all of my sources. The system is 5.1.

Crossover for all speakers is set to 80Hz with 120Hz for the sub (LFE). I read somewhere that 0dB would be ideal for your individual speakers output but I'm not so sure. The A-780 only allows me to set the individual loudness to -10dB to +10dB. I've played around with it but can't really hear any real difference on any of the speakers with the Test Tone. I haven't yet tried all of the speakers at 0dB. Confused? Yes. Advice? Please.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I have a Yamaha A-780 and tried the YPAO calibration. I wasn't happy with the results so I'd like to change them. I understand that once you calibrate with YPAO, you can't go back without a complete reset so the advice is to leave YPAO:Flat and then tweak, either by ear or with an SPL. I don't use any DSP programs so I just keep it at Straight for all of my sources. The system is 5.1.

Crossover for all speakers is set to 80Hz with 120Hz for the sub (LFE). I read somewhere that 0dB would be ideal for your individual speakers output but I'm not so sure. The A-780 only allows me to set the individual loudness to -10dB to +10dB. I've played around with it but can't really hear any real difference on any of the speakers with the Test Tone. I haven't yet tried all of the speakers at 0dB. Confused? Yes. Advice? Please.

Some people love Room EQ (YPAO, Audyssey, Dirac),and some people don't love Room EQ.

Many audio experts believe that we shouldn't even mess with any frequencies above 200Hz -- don't use YPAO, Audyssey, Dirac above 200Hz.

So if you re-run YPAO and you still don't like either the FLAT or NATURAL YPAO settings, that's PERFECTLY NORMAL. Just use either MANUAL or THROUGH mode in the YPAO setting.

THROUGH and MANUAL modes can be the same as long as you don't change any PEQ settings (keep all Manual PEQ Frequencies at 0.0dB).

But MANUAL mode allows you to change ONLY the frequencies you want, like change the EQ for ONLY the bass Below 100Hz.

THROUGH doesn't allow you to EQ anything.

In my case, I use MANUAL and manually PEQ only the 2 subwoofers. I don't want to even mess with frequencies above 100Hz.

 

[Otto Plyot]

Ok. I use Straight for all my sources because I want to keep the audio as close to the original encoding as possible. If I use Manual, do I need to go back to Speaker Level and change the dB or will they automatically default to 0.0dB for each speaker. I have no way of adjusting the EQ to their proper settings for my room unless I do it by ear and these old ears aren't what they used to be. My listening environment is not huge so I'm using some nice Aperion bookshelf-sized speakers and an Emotiva sub. 99% of our listening is movies (streamed and disk) and local HDTV stations only.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Ok. I use Straight for all my sources because I want to keep the audio as close to the original encoding as possible. If I use Manual, do I need to go back to Speaker Level and change the dB or will they automatically default to 0.0dB for each speaker. I have no way of adjusting the EQ to their proper settings for my room unless I do it by ear and these old ears aren't what they used to be. My listening environment is not huge so I'm using some nice Aperion bookshelf-sized speakers and an Emotiva sub. 99% of our listening is movies (streamed and disk) and local HDTV stations only.

If you don't need to EQ anything, then just use THROUGH mode.

If I didn't want nuclear-subwoofer bass, I would use THROUGH mode all the way.

But yes, the DEFAULT setting for MANAUL mode is 0.0dB for each speaker.

So the question is, do you want to EQ your subwoofers? If the answer is "NO", then use THROUGH mode.

For DSP mode, I use either 1) STRAIGHT (for Dolby Atmos movies that have great overhead sounds) or 2) DTS NEURAL:X (for EVERYTHING else).

 

[Otto Plyot]

The haze is starting to clear a bit. So, I have no real way to check or set EQ so I just use Through as is and leave it alone (default?) for all the speakers including the sub? The sub is set for 120Hz x-over using the setting control knob on the back of the sub, so leave that alone as well?

What about the individual dB settings under Speaker Levels, do they default to 0.0dB as well? Oh, and I've manually set the speaker distances with a tape measure if that has anything to do with not using the YPAO results.

What's the advantage of DTS NEURAL:X over Straight?

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

1) I just use Through as is and leave it alone (default?)
for all the speakers including the sub?

2) The sub is set for 120Hz x-over using the setting control knob on the back of the sub, so leave that alone as well?

3) What about the individual dB settings under Speaker Levels, do they default to 0.0dB as well?

4) What's the advantage of DTS NEURAL:X over Straight?

1) Yes

2) I would set the XO in the Yamaha to 120Hz for the subs. On the back of the sub, set it to as high as it allows (like 150Hz, 180Hz, etc.).

3) If you ran YPAO, then YPAO will set each speaker level. It may not be 0.0dB. You can check to see what YPAO set the levels at in the Menu.

4) NeuralX takes 2Ch source and Upmix to Multi-Channel or takes MCH and upmix to Atmos/DTSX-type of sound for your ceiling speakers. I think NeuralX is the unexpected SECRET WEAPON. I use this for just about everything (movies, TV, 2Ch CD music, etc.). I mean everything except for the best Dolby Atmos contents. IOW, if the Atmos contents suck, I will use NeuralX anyway.

 

[Otto Plyot]

So then, your starting recommendations would be:

1. Set the PEQ to Through and disregard any Speaker Level dB settings there may be (or should I set them to 0.0dB is they are set to something?).

2. Set the x-overs for all speakers (LF/C/RF/LS/RS) to 80Hz (which they currently are).

3. Set the single sub x-over to 120Hz in the Yamaha Setup -> Speaker -> Crossover menu (I assume there is a setting for adjusting the x-over for the sub) and crank up the back of the subs x-over to max (which I believe is 180Hz).

4. I assume that the above settings are global so I don't have to set them for the individual HDMI inputs?

5. I have Comcast for just local HDTV stations only (no streaming, network broadcasts only), which is connected directly to the C8 due to a Deep Color issue on the legacy 1080 only Comcast STB's. The connection to the receiver is optical so just continue to use Straight as the DSP or will DSur work over an optical connection?

6. The UHD/BD player and the ATV4k are both connected to the A-780, with a single HDMI out to the C8. Straight as it is now or DTS Neural:X? I don't have Atmos setup (no speakers yet), only 5.1, so it sounds like Neural:X would give me the best clarity and definition when using any audio format that is presented from either disk or streaming (ATV4k)?

Thank you for your time and patience. I thought I had this figured out, but the more I thought about it, the less clearer it became. I do have a call into Yamaha but who knows when they will get back to me and what they will recommend.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

1. Set the PEQ to Through and disregard any Speaker Level dB settings there may be (or should I set them to 0.0dB is they are set to something?).

Let’s answer one at a time.

The YPAO settings (Natural, Flat, Through) is one thing. The Speaker Level (Balance) settings is something else.

So

1. Set the YPAO to THROUGH.

When that’s done, move on to the next step.

2. SPEAKER LEVEL setting. This is for balancing the volume of your speakers and subs. When you ran YPAO, the receiver set all speakers and sub to about 75dB level. You can leave this alone.

A. Some people feel that this requires them to turn up the Master Volume Knob too much. If you feel this way, you can manually increase every speaker level the same amount (like 5dB higher). If you don’t mind turning up the volume, just keep the speaker level that was set when you ran YPAO.

B. You can manually increase the Subwoofer level to whatever you like (3dB, 6dB, etc.).