Better channel separation with pre/pro?

[Walsh1]

It seems to be suggested that there is improved channel separation / delineation of sound with a pre-pro versus an AVR. Is this a myth or a fact? If I am utilizing the RCA preouts on my receiver paired with an amp then isn't the job that it's performing up to snuff with a pre-pro? And if there is a measured improvement couldn't this be from superior room correction?

 

[lovinthehd]

Channel separation is what it is in your avr, as well as in your amp. The spec is called crosstalk, and in modern gear is not an issue I'd worry about generally. Here's what the Audioholics article on amp measurement has to say from this article

Crosstalk - measures channel to channel isolation. We take it one step further and do All-to-One crosstalk measurements where all channels but the channel under test act as a noise source. This measures stereo separation. We test this at 1 watt and full rated power to ensure issues such as magnetic coupling or power transformer saturation don't adversely affect performance. We like to see a number of at least 60dB @ 10kHz for channel to channel crosstalk and about 50db when its a seven channel amp doing All-to-One crosstalk measurements.

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Emotiva UPA-7 All-to-One Crosstalk @ full Rated Power​

 

[lovinthehd]

Oh, and not sure what the connection would be with the use of room correction software....

 

[lovinthehd]

Here's what Douglas Self (well known amp designer) had to say about crosstalk spec, in this excerpt from his book Audio Power Amplifier Design (p.19) regarding using monoblocs to minimize crosstalk:

"There is no need to go to the expense of monobloc power amplifiers in order to keep crosstalk under control even when making it substantially better than the -20dB that is actually necessary. The techniques are conventional; the last stereo power amplifier I designed managed an easy -90dB at 10kHz without anything other than the usual precautions in this area. Dedicated followers of fashion pay dearly for the privilege as the cost of the mechanical parts will be nearly doubled."

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Yeah, it’s a myth/hearsay. Don’t lose any sleep. AVR and AVP can sound as good as one another
.

I think that’s the 1,000th time I’ve said that now. No worries.

 

[Verdinut]

As mentioned by @lovinthehd in post #4, a minimum crosstalk separation of -20dB is sufficient and amply met by multi-channel audiophile equipment.

When you think of it, that spec is a minor concern. When you go to a concert or when a recording is done, all the instruments and/or vocalists are in the same room, so there is a natural acoustical intermixing of the various sounds produced.

 

[Kvn_Walker]

Yeah, it’s a myth/hearsay. Don’t lose any sleep. AVR and AVP can sound as good as one another
.

I think that’s the 1,000th time I’ve said that now. No worries.

Look now, don't be offending us Outlaw 2200 stackers! We're a sensitive bunch.

 

[Walsh1]

Yeah, it’s a myth/hearsay. Don’t lose any sleep. AVR and AVP can sound as good as one another
.

I think that’s the 1,000th time I’ve said that now. No worries.

Thanks for the clarification on this. I suppose that the speculations or critiques on the sound of various units must be mostly attributed to the different room correction software such as Audessey vs ARC, etcetera.

 

[lovinthehd]

Thanks for the clarification on this. I suppose that the speculations or critiques on the sound of various units must be mostly attributed to the different room correction software such as Audessey vs ARC, etcetera.

You could also attribute it to the dsp differences in general, too. Or sales pitches

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Thanks for the clarification on this. I suppose that the speculations or critiques on the sound of various units must be mostly attributed to the different room correction software such as Audessey vs ARC, etcetera.

Biggest problems with most comparisons include different volume levels (not level-matched) and unreliable human memory/bias.

Add to that all the different auto room correction EQs and DSPs and you have a bunch of hearsay and myths.

 

[Phase 2]

Look now, don't be offending us Outlaw 2200 stackers! We're a sensitive bunch.

Yeah! Some guys just don't like having to share all their speakers with one power supply. One thing about monoblocks, jet black noise floor rules!!

 

[Phase 2]

Biggest problems with most comparisons include different volume levels (not level-matched) and unreliable human memory/bias.

Add to that all the different auto room correction EQs and DSPs and you have a bunch of hearsay and myths.

Biggest problems with most comparisons include different volume levels (not level-matched) and unreliable human memory/bias.

Add to that all the different auto room correction EQs and DSPs and you have a bunch of hearsay and myths.

In Spocks beat voice, seems logical.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Look now, don't be offending us Outlaw 2200 stackers! We're a sensitive bunch.

I will admit that mono-blocks are cool. I think most guys (including me) have thought about buying mono-blocks at least once or twice.

 

[Walsh1]

One thing I appreciate about Audioholics is that experienced and educated audiofiles are here to lend their knowledge to others and help dispell any myths buzzing around. I first stumbled upon Audioholics by way of Gene's YouTube videos. Gotta love that guy. Dispelling the BS is what it's about.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

One thing I appreciate about Audioholics is that experienced and educated audiofiles are here to lend their knowledge to others and help dispell any myths buzzing around. I first stumbled upon Audioholics by way of Gene's YouTube videos. Gotta love that guy. Dispelling the BS is what it's about.

But after we dispell the myths, it's perfectly okay to buy Separates and high-end products like amps, Preamps, AVPs, etc.