Subwoofer Recommendations for a 2,500 cubic foot living room? (Monolith/HSU/SVS... 12" vs 15")

[Landmonster]

Hi guys.

So I just took some room measurements:

• My room is: 15'2" long x 16'10" wide x 10 foot ceilings.
• Calculated, this is 2,553 cubic feet (with one wall open to the kitchen (with a bar))
• The front speakers would be along the wall that is 16'10" wide.... and be playing outward into the listening area, which is 15"2 deep.

In any case, I can fit upto 2 subwoofers in this room, but they will likely need to be on the main wall with the L/R/C channel speakers, as the other walls cannot easily fit subs due to furniture. I could have 2 subs on the front wall, or perhaps have 1 sub on the rear wall, and 1 on the front.

What size subs should I be looking at here? And how many? I want to achieve an impressively loud and clear theatre, without goign to the point of extreme overkill... damaging sheetrock, knocking plates off shelves, that kind of thing.

I read very good reviews on the Monoprice 12" THX ultra sub, and it seems like a good price for the quality. It has noticeably more output and less distortion than the 10" version for only slightly more money, so it seems like a good price point.

Questions:

1. Would 2 of the 12" Monoprice subs be overkill in this room, or would that be hitting a "sweet spot"?
2. Would a single 15" Monoprice sub outperform dual 12" Monoprice subs in this room size?
3. Is it worth stepping up to dual Monoprice 15" THX subs?
4. How about a SVS or HSU sub alternative?

Ideally the max budget is around $2,000.... new/used/refurbished, as long as it's pristine.

 

[Landmonster]

Having never owned a high-end subwoofer before in my life..... Lol.... I have no idea what adding dual 12" Monoprice THX subs would even do to my house.

I suspect it would be a humongous change to my theatre. I wonder if I should adjust upward, or downward from thre, because I have no idea really - whether it be too much, about right, or not enough.

 

[ryanosaur]

Dual subs are great! I have two Outlaw x13s in a room about 2000’3. Sure I can shake it like the San Andreas just snapped, but that’s just silly.

Most of that class of sub, Outlaw, Hsu, monolith, svs, Rythmik... is considered to be a pretty safe choice. You are really just shopping for features/connectivity for your particular wants.

Monolith 12s would be a good fit for your room.

If you haven’t stumbled upon it yet, check out the bassaholic room rating protocol for they use here at Audioholics. A lot of good info there. And when you shop for your sub, go up one room size.

 

[ryanosaur]

Oh, forgot: multiple subs will give you more even bass response around the whole room. U can dial one sub in to be almost perfect for one seat, but multiples will really smooth it out by exciting more room modes.
I would still recommend the crude, yet effective, technique of the subwoofer crawl. Without doing room measurements constantly as you move the sub, this little exercise will help you identify the best places to put the sub based on the rooms own acoustics.

 

[shadyJ]

Any of the subs you mentioned would be really good. The Monoprice 12" THX Ultra is a terrific sub. A single Monolith 15" would not outperform two 12" THX Ultras. If you can spend up to $2k though, the Hsu VTF15h mk2 probably maxes out the kind of performance you can get for that cash. If you can push your budget up to dual Monolith 15" THX Ultra, that will give you even greater deep bass performance. However, it is very heavy! The comparable SVS subs would be the PB-3000 or PB-4000, a bit more expensive but a bit more feature rich.

 

[Landmonster]

Any of the subs you mentioned would be really good. The Monoprice 12" THX Ultra is a terrific sub. A single Monolith 15" would not outperform two 12" THX Ultras. If you can spend up to $2k though, the Hsu VTF15h mk2 probably maxes out the kind of performance you can get for that cash. If you can push your budget up to dual Monolith 15" THX Ultra, that will give you even greater deep bass performance. However, it is very heavy! The comparable SVS subs would be the PB-3000 or PB-4000, a bit more expensive but a bit more feature rich.

Random visual question...

This may be audio blasphemy, but I really like the Piano-black finish on some of the SVS subs. I do have to consider aesthetics here too.

Whatever subs I get will be paired with Polk LSiM speakers, which have a semi-glossy dark-mahogany color.... so I feel like the "ash black" paneling on most of these subs are going to look tacky, and clash with my speakers in my living area.

The cheapest SVS sub with such a gloss finish is the SB-3000. Is that one in the same league as the Monoprice THX ultra? Unfortinately, the PB-3000 is NOT offered with a gloss finish... so I wonder how much I would giving up going with the SB series vs the PB series?

1. Is the SB-3000 going to be in the same league of performance as the Monoprice 12" THX?
2. The PB-4000 in piano look looks amazing... but at $2,000 each... wouldn't I be better off with 2 Sb-3000s? or no?
3. What about finish options from HSU, or others... do they have a nice semi-glossy black option?

 

[shadyJ]

Random visual question...

This may be audio blasphemy, but I really like the Piano-black finish on some of the SVS subs. I do have to consider aesthetics here too.

Whatever subs I get will be paired with Polk LSiM speakers, which have a semi-glossy dark-mahogany color.... so I feel like the "ash black" paneling on most of these subs are going to look tacky, and clash with my speakers in my living area.

The cheapest SVS sub with such a gloss finish is the SB-3000. Is that one in the same league as the Monoprice THX ultra? Unfortinately, the PB-3000 is NOT offered with a gloss finish... so I wonder how much I would giving up going with the SB series vs the PB series?

1. Is the SB-3000 going to be in the same league of performance as the Monoprice 12" THX?
2. The PB-4000 in piano look looks amazing... but at $2,000 each... wouldn't I be better off with 2 Sb-3000s? or no?
3. What about finish options from HSU, or others... do they have a nice semi-glossy black option?

The SB-3000 will have much less deep bass than the Monolith 12" THX Ultra. Probably better in frequencies above 40 Hz. The PB-4000 would have a huge deep bass output advantage over the SB-3000s. Two SB-3000s would probably have an advantage above 40 Hz, again. Hsu hasn't had any products made in gloss for awhile. However, their satin black finish is pretty nice. It is not faux satin black like so many other speakers/subs have when they claim satin black which is really just cheap textured vinyl. The Hsu satin black is good, in fact fingerprints can show up on it if you are not careful in handling it. The Outlaw Audio subs also have a nice satin black finish and a nice plexiglass top as well.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

One more option to confuse OP: Rythmik Audio FV15HP-SE piano black with H600PEQ3 comes at $1650. It would be close to the bass output of PB4000 sub.

 

[Landmonster]

Any of the subs you mentioned would be really good. The Monoprice 12" THX Ultra is a terrific sub. A single Monolith 15" would not outperform two 12" THX Ultras. If you can spend up to $2k though, the Hsu VTF15h mk2 probably maxes out the kind of performance you can get for that cash. If you can push your budget up to dual Monolith 15" THX Ultra, that will give you even greater deep bass performance. However, it is very heavy! The comparable SVS subs would be the PB-3000 or PB-4000, a bit more expensive but a bit more feature rich.

How about dual HSU VTF15h MK2 in satin black? Would that be superior to dual Monolith 12" subs?

 

[ryanosaur]

How about dual HSU VTF15h MK2 in satin black? Would that be superior to dual Monolith 12" subs?

If I remember correctly, that sub was responsible for Shady getting kicked off of one of his test sites.

 

[shadyJ]

How about dual HSU VTF15h MK2 in satin black? Would that be superior to dual Monolith 12" subs?

Yes, the VTF15h mk2s would be more powerful than the Monolith 12"s. They would be more comparable to the Monolith 15"s, although the Monolith 15"s are more capable in deep bass. However, the VTF15h mk2 is not at all weak in deep bass.

 

[Landmonster]

If I remember correctly, that sub was responsible for Shady getting kicked off of one of his test sites.

What does that mean?

 

[bigkrazy155]

Monoprice 12s are on sale should you choose that route.

 

[Landmonster]

Yes, the VTF15h mk2s would be more powerful than the Monolith 12"s. They would be more comparable to the Monolith 15"s, although the Monolith 15"s are more capable in deep bass. However, the VTF15h mk2 is not at all weak in deep bass.

Given the fact that I am a subwoofer noob, can you give a brief synopsis of what a VTF15h would do? What about accuracy and clarity? I don't necessarily care about max SPL.

Monoprice 12s are on sale should you choose that route.

I know.... the Monoprice 12s seem great on a price/performance curve, from what I am reading. I have never heard any massive subs like this in a home theater environment, so it's hard for me to judge. The sole concern I have with the Monoprice is the finish. I'm sure it is not lackluster in performance, by any means. The exterior just looks like a big cheap box.

 

[ryanosaur]

What does that mean?

It performs very well. I haven't heard Hsu's myself, but I have never heard a bad word about them. Most people are concerned that they are cheap due to the price, which is foolish. Shady, who tests subwoofers as a job, likes them a lot. They are definitely considered to be the value leader in this class of subs.
My second choice was going to be the VTF15Hmk2s. The reason I chose Outlaw? I like down-firing drivers, I liked the look a little better, and they had a sale at the exact right moment.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

I have heard HSU VTF15h mk1 in a small room and clearly, nothing else was in even the same class as this monster.
Mk2 > mk1 at least by 3db high output. as J said dual HSU 15" subs (including a bit smaller VTF3-mk5) price are unbeatable in performance per buck.

 

[ryanosaur]

The exterior just looks like a big cheap box.

Ha! Indeed. One reason I didn't really look at them much more. I think its safe to say that big boxes aren't considered atractive, and my opinion is they are finished as they are because most will try to hide them away... not draw attention to them. Piano Finishes are usually more expensive, too just because of the labor involved. Not to mention, that little phenomenon known as SAF.

I think it its totally reasonable to be considering the look of them. It is your home, afterall. I will say, though, that the Satin Black on the Outlaws does help it sort of disappear. They would definitely be more noticeable in a piano finish. Considering that, if celebrating the Big Box'O'Boom is in your steez, go piano black.

 

[shadyJ]

Given the fact that I am a subwoofer noob, can you give a brief synopsis of what a VTF15h would do? What about accuracy and clarity? I don't necessarily care about max SPL.

It's hard to explain what the subs can do when you don't have a point of reference. All of these subs are very accurate. They are all very linear, so they have great performance in the frequency domain, time domain, and in nonlinear distortion. I doubt that anyone could tell the difference between them in normal content such as music or movies. Some people think that some subs are somehow qualitatively better in a way that can't be measured, but that is nonsense. I have heard subs from every major brand and have tested a bunch of them. The reality is, when you have a flat frequency response, reasonable time domain behavior, and enough headroom that distortion never becomes audible, you have accurate bass. These subs all have that and they sound the same, as much as the manufacturers might hate me for saying that.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Forget gloss...go crushed velvet baby! PC4000’s all the way!!!

 

[lovinthehd]

Forget gloss...go crushed velvet baby! PC4000’s all the way!!!

Didn't know the PC models were finished in crushed velvet...

@Landmonster BTW since one wall is open to the kitchen, that's part of the room as far as the sub is concerned...my vote is dual of some combo of subs discussed with suitable finish. You really can't go wrong.