New Setup...4K not reliable from Sony UBP-700 and Onkyo RZ-730

[BS-TX]

Hello All,

This is my first post here.....

I have a new setup as follows......
TV LG OLED65B7A,
Onkyo RZ730 Surround Receiver and
Sony UBP-X700 4K Blu-Ray player.
All HDMI cables are High Speed 4K with ethernet.
I also use a Harmony 700 remote.

Also.....all devices are currently up to date as far as their firmware, etc.

I am having intermittent problems when I have the incoming signal on the LG's HDMI 2 (arc) input, which is hooked to the HDMI output on the Onkyo receiver, and I have the X700 hooked via HDMI into the receiver's BD/DVD input. All HDMI cables are new and are the latest 4K high speed with ethernet.

With the Harmony remote set to "watch a dvd movie" and a "watch direct TV" activity. Here's what happens:

Click "watch direct tv".....all equipment turns on, the receiver sets the correct Cbl/Sat input on the receiver and sends the incoming video signal out to the TV's HDMI2 which detects the signal and we watch TV...no problem.

Click "watch a dvd movie"....all equipment turns on, the receiver sets the correct input on the receiver to BD/DVD and the television (which gets set to its correct HDMI2 input) doesn't detect a signal and displays a message as such. I can go in and try to get the TV to check for a signal again on the HDMI2 input but it does not help. I just shut it all off via the Harmony remote and try again.

Here is the interesting thing.....sometimes it works fine, but not often. I would say that once in every fifteen attempts the process works and we can watch disc content from the X700 on the LG OLED via the receiver as intended.

I checked all of my HDMI cables and all are working correctly. I thought perhaps it was a X700 issue so I returned the X700 for another but the second new one does the same thing. Also, I can take the X700 to any other TV in the house and it works fine though the other TV's are not 4K. I can also make it work perfectly on the LG OLED TV if I just hook the X700 up to the television straight to the TV and not try to send the video signal via the Onkyo receiver.

Right now to watch 4K discs I have the X700 using the HDMI1 port on the LG OLED and I am sending the audio from the X700 to the Onkyo receiver via digital coaxial audio cable. I have reconfigured the Harmony 700 activity to this hook up configuration and it works fine. I have the Direct TV receiver hooked up to the LG OLED's HDMI2 input and the signal does get sent through the Onkyo receiver and on to the TV as desired with no problem.

So, is this a problem with the Onkyo, should I send it back for repair/replacement? I have called Onkyo and discussed it with the support staff......the RZ series allows for elevated customer service. Onkyo staff were unsure what the problem might be.....they did say it might be a faulty receiver, but were unsure.

I am thinking that it is perhaps a "handshake" thing between the X700 player and the Onkyo receiver, but not sure on that obviously. Does anyone know if there are any "issues" between Sony 4K disc players and Onkyo receivers?



Thank you!

 

[Joe B]

I'm sure someone here will be able to help you. It sounds like a handshake issue to me also. In my home theater, I have to power on my equipment in a specific order or I'll never get audio. Hopefully one of the guys here has a similar set up and can guide you to a solution. Good luck!

 

[everettT]

Is there a reason your using ARC? Try another input

 

[BS-TX]

Is there a reason your using ARC? Try another input

Hey thanks for the reply. No real reason for the ARC input. I have tried both HDMI1 which is non-ARC and the HDMI2 which has ARC......neither mattered. I get the same result regardless of the HDMI port on the LG.

Thanks again!

 

[lovinthehd]

Well since the issue seems to have nothing to do with ARC I'd just try it disabled with your original configuration to see if it makes a difference. If you need to source audio from your tv, maybe not.

This is contradictory somewhat "I have the Direct TV receiver hooked up to the LG OLED's HDMI2 input and the signal does get sent through the Onkyo receiver and on to the TV as desired with no problem"....in that the connection is from from the D* receiver direct to the tv via hdmi, then the audio signal is getting sent on to the Onkyo receiver from your TV via ARC (not through the receiver and on to the tv).

My Sony S6700 with a Denon avr and Samsung tv would occasionally have the handshake issue and result in no video....when I left that Sony in standby (rather than full off....forget the actual terminology but basically keeping the Sony at a higher level of readiness) the problem went away for the most part. After I got another BR player for the Denon setup I moved the S6700 to my bedroom with an Onkyo avr and older Vizio and no issues (but leaving it in the higher level of standby). I changed the Vizio out last night for another Samsung and got the no signal thing briefly so am on the watch for it (and may rerun my Harmony setup just to be sure).

You can play with sequence or eve timing of turn-on in the Harmony setup, when I used ARC a while back (no longer use tv based apps) I had to do that with another gear combo.

 

[BS-TX]

Well since the issue seems to have nothing to do with ARC I'd just try it disabled with your original configuration to see if it makes a difference. If you need to source audio from your tv, maybe not.

This is contradictory somewhat "I have the Direct TV receiver hooked up to the LG OLED's HDMI2 input and the signal does get sent through the Onkyo receiver and on to the TV as desired with no problem"....in that the connection is from from the D* receiver direct to the tv via hdmi, then the audio signal is getting sent on to the Onkyo receiver from your TV via ARC (not through the receiver and on to the tv).

My Sony S6700 with a Denon avr and Samsung tv would occasionally have the handshake issue and result in no video....when I left that Sony in standby (rather than full off....forget the actual terminology but basically keeping the Sony at a higher level of readiness) the problem went away for the most part. After I got another BR player for the Denon setup I moved the S6700 to my bedroom with an Onkyo avr and older Vizio and no issues (but leaving it in the higher level of standby). I changed the Vizio out last night for another Samsung and got the no signal thing briefly so am on the watch for it (and may rerun my Harmony setup just to be sure).

You can play with sequence or eve timing of turn-on in the Harmony setup, when I used ARC a while back (no longer use tv based apps) I had to do that with another gear combo.

Lovinthehd,

Thank you for helping!

I'm sorry that there was a part in my description that was kind of confusing. What I'm saying there is that the direct tv box is hooked to the avr via hdmi as it should be and it works fine, the signal for video and audio are both being carried from the direct tv box to the avr and video makes it to the TV and audio gets processed and sent to speakers.....I have not problems getting video to the tv and sound to the audio system when using the direct tv box as my source.

I do have my Sony 4K player set up as yours too....where it is in the "stand by" or whatever you call that mode...it helps boot it quicker so it is available for use faster. I get the same result whether that mode is on or off.

ARC is working from the TV to the avr as my LG apps are getting their audio back to the avr. Having ARC working is kinda cool (this is my first smart tv) but I don't use a lot of app based services for watching content. I do watch some netflix but I do that via a Roku Express which is hooked directly to the avr as well, it is in the Strm input on the Onkyo. That activity "watch Roku" on the Harmony works perfectly too. Hit the "watch Roku" button and all fires up and works as it should. Anyhow, what I'm saying about ARC is that I can turn off ARC and not utilize the TV apps for Prime Video and Netflix, etc because I do like using the Roku Express and plan to continue. Turning off ARC though does not help the problem I have. I don't get a video signal from the Sony X700 4K blu-ray with the ARC on or off....it's the same result.

I am considering going and swapping out the Sony X700 (best buy is going to hate me) for a different 4K player and see if that changes anything. Perhaps I'll try an LG 4K blu-ray and see if it works as it should. If it's a handshake thing with Sony a different brand will be a good test. Also, if another brand boots faster perhaps that maybe will help too.

Thank you again!

 

[PENG]

Lovinthehd,

Thank you for helping!

I'm sorry that there was a part in my description that was kind of confusing. What I'm saying there is that the direct tv box is hooked to the avr via hdmi as it should be and it works fine, the signal for video and audio are both being carried from the direct tv box to the avr and video makes it to the TV and audio gets processed and sent to speakers.....I have not problems getting video to the tv and sound to the audio system when using the direct tv box as my source.

I do have my Sony 4K player set up as yours too....where it is in the "stand by" or whatever you call that mode...it helps boot it quicker so it is available for use faster. I get the same result whether that mode is on or off.

ARC is working from the TV to the avr as my LG apps are getting their audio back to the avr. Having ARC working is kinda cool (this is my first smart tv) but I don't use a lot of app based services for watching content. I do watch some netflix but I do that via a Roku Express which is hooked directly to the avr as well, it is in the Strm input on the Onkyo. That activity "watch Roku" on the Harmony works perfectly too. Hit the "watch Roku" button and all fires up and works as it should. Anyhow, what I'm saying about ARC is that I can turn off ARC and not utilize the TV apps for Prime Video and Netflix, etc because I do like using the Roku Express and plan to continue. Turning off ARC though does not help the problem I have. I don't get a video signal from the Sony X700 4K blu-ray with the ARC on or off....it's the same result.

I am considering going and swapping out the Sony X700 (best buy is going to hate me) for a different 4K player and see if that changes anything. Perhaps I'll try an LG 4K blu-ray and see if it works as it should. If it's a handshake thing with Sony a different brand will be a good test. Also, if another brand boots faster perhaps that maybe will help too.

Thank you again!

Is the intermittent problem with 4K contents only? If it is, it may not be handshake issue, but could be your video settings. Also, have you tried another HDMI input, the Onkyo must have 7 or 8 inputs right?

 

[BS-TX]

Is the intermittent problem with 4K contents only? If it is, it may not be handshake issue, but could be your video settings. Also, have you tried another HDMI input, the Onkyo must have 7 or 8 inputs right?

Hello,

Thanks for your help!

I think I can answer your question with a "yes, it appears to be 4K contents only". I say "think" because I am assuming that the Sony X700's Main Menu (which is the first thing it displays upon boot) is 4K. So if the signal coming from the X700 to display the menu is 4K....yes. Because not even the Main Menu will show up.

I have tried using other ports on the avr too.....it's the same thing, Also keep in mind that sometimes it would work about one time in fifteen or so it will fire up and work displaying the X700's menu and then playing a 4K disc just fine.....but it's rare!

I even tested my previous 1080 blu-ray player which is a Panasonic BMP-BD35 that is about 10 years old. That blu-ray player is pretty slow to boot up (back then that was how they were). When I hook the Panasonic Blu-Ray back up using the same cable, same input on the avr, etc (I change the Harmony remote activity to control the Panasonic) it works fine even though it takes a good bit longer for the Panasonic Blu-Ray to boot up and send a signal. The LG TV does not seem to mind the delay in the signal it briefly gives a message about having no signal but then when the signal hits the input the picture comes right up.

What video settings do you think might be a problem? I ended up resetting both the X700 and Onkyo to their defaults and starting over and that did not help. Is there possibly some settings I'm missing?

Perhaps another brand (higher quality?) HDMI cable might change things? I'm not convinced of that because I have found the same result when swapping out cables ( I wanted to rule out a cable problem) and found that it did the same thing regardless of the cable used. Again all cables are new, high speed 4k, with ethernet cables.

Thank you!

 

[PENG]

What video settings do you think might be a problem? I ended up resetting both the X700 and Onkyo to their defaults and starting over and that did not help. Is there possibly some settings I'm missing?

Perhaps another brand (higher quality?) HDMI cable might change things?

Thank you!

I don't have an Onkyo so can't help much here, but there has to be some different 4K settings such as different resolutions, e.g. 3840X2160 24/30/50/60 Hz, can even try 1080p etc. If nothing work then it mostly is handshaking issue, that can only be resolved, potentially future FW updates, or try a different 4K player.

Have you tried connecting the X700 to the TV directly and use the second HDMI (audio only iirc) for audio for connection to the AVR?

 

[BS-TX]

I don't have an Onkyo so can't help much here, but there has to be some different 4K settings such as different resolutions, e.g. 3840X2160 24/30/50/60 Hz, can even try 1080p etc. If nothing work then it mostly is handshaking issue, that can only be resolved, potentially future FW updates, or try a different 4K player.

Have you tried connecting the X700 to the TV directly and use the second HDMI (audio only iirc) for audio for connection to the AVR?

Hey again. I do have the X700 hooked directly to the TV's HDMI1 port and the X700's sound output is connected to the avr with a digital coaxial cable. With this hook up config...all plays correctly, 4K video, correct surround sound, etc. My 4K Dolby Vision discs even play with Dolby Vision automatically (the TV briefly displays a Dolby Vision logo and the picture tweaks for Dolby Vision). The only thing I seem to lose with this config is the Onkyo's volume indicator.....when adjusting sound levels the Onkyo's level is not output to the TV for display. That does not bother me because I can still see the level on the front of the Onkyo itself.

I'll double check but I'm pretty sure I have the 4K settings on the Onkyo for the BD/DVD input set to "Auto".

Thanks again!

 

[lovinthehd]

Curious, are you using any video processing on the Onkyo? Or is it on a pass-thru type setting?

 

[BS-TX]

Curious, are you using any video processing on the Onkyo? Or is it on a pass-thru type setting?

Hello again,

I don't have the Pass Through function turned on for the BD/DVD input on the avr. It's in its default setting.

Thanks again for your help!

 

[lovinthehd]

Hello again,

I don't have the Pass Through function turned on for the BD/DVD input on the avr. It's in its default setting.

Thanks again for your help!

But are you using processing of the signal? Now that I think of it my Onkyo calls that direct to not process the incoming video signal. Just was curious if turning that off would make any difference.

 

[BS-TX]

But are you using processing of the signal? Now that I think of it my Onkyo calls that direct to not process the incoming video signal. Just was curious if turning that off would make any difference.

Yes, I'm processing the signal because the surround sound is definitely working. I just checked my HDMI the (5-1 menu) settings and the CEC is off, HDMI Standby Through is off, Audio TV is off, auto lip sync is ON.

Thanks so much again for your input and help!

 

[lovinthehd]

Yes, I'm processing the signal because the surround sound is definitely working. I just checked my HDMI the (5-1 menu) settings and the CEC is off, HDMI Standby Through is off, Audio TV is off, auto lip sync is ON.

Thanks so much again for your input and help!

Video processing and audio processing are different settings in an avr. I'm not talking about the audio, but what you set your avr to do with video signal (let it go thru without any processing such as upscaling or resolution or format changes....).

However, now that I look through your manual you do not seem to have any such video processing in your avr, so never mind . Not a bad idea to save money and remove the extra video processing I suppose; mostly I bypass the avr's video processing anyways. The only video processing I saw evident in your manual is that it can take a legacy input, component video, and output that via hdmi.

Curious about the HDMI CEC being off if you're using ARC...on my avrs I have to enable CEC to work with ARC. In your manual it says if you've answered "yes" to ARC Setup (p.157 in the online manual) then HDMI CEC is automatically enabled.

 

[BS-TX]

Video processing and audio processing are different settings in an avr. I'm not talking about the audio, but what you set your avr to do with video signal (let it go thru without any processing such as upscaling or resolution or format changes....).

However, now that I look through your manual you do not seem to have any such video processing in your avr, so never mind . Not a bad idea to save money and remove the extra video processing I suppose; mostly I bypass the avr's video processing anyways. The only video processing I saw evident in your manual is that it can take a legacy input, component video, and output that via hdmi.

Curious about the HDMI CEC being off if you're using ARC...on my avrs I have to enable CEC to work with ARC. In your manual it says if you've answered "yes" to ARC Setup (p.157 in the online manual) then HDMI CEC is automatically enabled.

Good Morning,

Yeah, the CEC was off because I went back in and set it to off (testing to see if ARC was and issue) earlier and found that it made no difference whether it was on or off the problem persists in either state. I went back in and enbled CEC and thus ARC just a short time ago.

I don't really need ARC enabled if I am going to use my Roku Express device as opposed to the TV's built in apps. I kind of prefer the Roku Express over the TV apps because it make it easier for my wife to hit "Watch Roku" on the Harmony Remote and then use the small Roku remote to make her programming selections.

Thanks!

 

[BS-TX]

Here's an update.

After many attempts I cannot get 4K video content to the TV via the avr reliably. I have tried several different avr inputs, reset all devices to factory defaults and started over three times. I have tried two different Sony 4K blu-ray players and today I took the second Sony player back to BB and exchanged it for a LG UBK90 4K blu-ray player and this new LG player has the same behavior. I even swapped brands of certified 4K HDMI cables and get nothing different, I figured I had best rule out for certain that it was probably not cable related.

Just like with the the Sony 4K players I can get the LG 4K player to display video content when going directly from the player's hdmi to the TV's hdmi input. But when cabling from the LG Player to the avr and then to the TV there is no picture.

I've decided that it has to be a defective avr. I have already talked to Onkyo support about this possibility and I'll get back ahold of them and see about a return/exchange. Unfortunately, I'm headed out of town tomorrow and for the ten days that follow so I'll have to wait until I return to proceed with replacement.

I will let you know how this turns out.

Does anyone know of anything I may have overlooked?

Thank you and Merry Christmas!!!!

 

[fast fred]

I believe I am having the same issue with my SonyX700 and my Marantz SR6013 - cant tell if 4K Discs are playing real Dolby Vision and/or 4K Audio??

Do we need special 4K certified cables for this to work?

Are there settings in the Marantz or Sony to Click?

 

[BMXTRIX]

I believe I am having the same issue with my SonyX700 and my Marantz SR6013 - cant tell if 4K Discs are playing real Dolby Vision and/or 4K Audio??

Do we need special 4K certified cables for this to work?

Are there settings in the Marantz or Sony to Click?

You should be connecting the BD player to the Marantz directly using Ultra High Speed Certified HDMI cables for every connection.

In almost all cases, at this point, it will be the cabling which is your issue.

Previous generation 10Gb/s HDMI cables do not work with 18Gb/s HDR 4K signals.

Monoprice has slim HDMI cables up to 8 feet in length. I've used the 8' cable at 4K/60 without issue.
https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=24187

 

[fast fred]

You should be connecting the BD player to the Marantz directly using Ultra High Speed Certified HDMI cables for every connection.

In almost all cases, at this point, it will be the cabling which is your issue.

Previous generation 10Gb/s HDMI cables do not work with 18Gb/s HDR 4K signals.

Monoprice has slim HDMI cables up to 8 feet in length. I've used the 8' cable at 4K/60 without issue.
https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=24187

Ok I thought so
Thanks for that