Multichannel Music listening

[PENG]

Not so sure... If they’re all level matched, normal surround sound listening modes should sound balanced. Theoretically they wouldn’t be competing. However, in an “all channel stereo” configuration, I would be inclined to agree. Also, content would factor in as well.

FWIW, my system is currently 7.3.(.4almost lol)

Level matched is for one for one. If two (sl+sbl) vs one (fl), the sl+sr should win.. Don't forget, MCH stereo is still stereo, not mono.

What is 7.3? I have 5 subs, but it really is still 7.1.

 

[lovinthehd]

What is the way to express speaker/sub setup if not something like 7.3 or 7.5? Content of course remains 7.1....should it be 7.1(3) and 7.1(5)?

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Level matched is for one for one. If two (sl+sbl) vs one (fl), the sl+sr should win.. Don't forget, MCH stereo is still stereo, not mono.

What is 7.3? I have 5 subs, but it really is still 7.1.

Absolutely. Content wise, it’s 2/5/7.1 etc. I just reference 7ch+3 subs(7.3) to avoid the inevitable question of “how many subs do you have?”

Well I agree(I think) that the two would win(your words), in a MCH stereo since the output levels are the same, front and back. In an upscaled surround mode like pliix however the levels of the side/rear speakers are not the same as the fronts.(unless of course you’re using DEQ which boosts the rears. Therefore it sounds balanced front to back. For example if I’m up sampling 2ch music to pliix in 7.1, my surrounds are not louder and overpowering the fronts. If I choose all channel stereo, the sides/rears are louder at the LP. When I move to the middle of the room, where I’m half the distance to my fronts and backs, they have the same output level.

 

[lovinthehd]

Absolutely. Content wise, it’s 2/5/7.1 etc. I just reference 7ch+3 subs(7.3) to avoid the inevitable question of “how many subs do you have?”

Well I agree(I think) that the two would win(your words), in a MCH stereo since the output levels are the same, front and back. In an upscaled surround mode like pliix however the levels of the side/rear speakers are not the same as the fronts.(unless of course you’re using DEQ which boosts the rears. Therefore it sounds balanced front to back. For example if I’m up sampling 2ch music to pliix in 7.1, my surrounds are not louder and overpowering the fronts. If I choose all channel stereo, the sides/rears are louder at the LP. When I move to the middle of the room, where I’m half the distance to my fronts and backs, they have the same output level.

That's my experience with the multich stereo mode, too.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

What is the way to express speaker/sub setup if not something like 7.3 or 7.5? Content of course remains 7.1....should it be 7.1(3) and 7.1(5)?

Good question Chris. To me, since the nerd herd here knows the lingo, I feel like expressing 5/7.x as the number of subs in your system is ok. If not I’ll quit doin that. I think putting the number of subs in parentheses after the x.1 would be even more confusing than just sayin 7.3.

 

[lovinthehd]

Good question Chris. To me, since the nerd herd here knows the lingo, I feel like expressing 5/7.x as the number of subs in your system is ok. If not I’ll quit doin that. I think putting the number of subs in parentheses after the x.1 would be even more confusing than just sayin 7.3.

Yes, it's pretty common to speak of your speaker setup as 7.3 or 7.5 etc, wasn't serious about the parentheses thing, that would definitely be more confusing....

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Yes, it's pretty common to speak of your speaker setup as 7.3 or 7.5 etc, wasn't serious about the parentheses thing, that would definitely be more confusing....

Whew! I can’t handle any more decimals or parentheses... lmao

 

[snakeeyes]

Whew! I can’t handle any more decimals or parentheses... lmao

Not sure I like parentheses but with 5 subs, write it however you like. That’s impressive!

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Not sure I like parentheses but with 5 subs, write it however you like. That’s impressive!

Lol. Thanks brother, but I only have 3 in my main system. Someday 4 I hope.

 

[snakeeyes]

Lol. Thanks brother, but I only have 3 in my main system. Someday 4 I hope.

Like you, my Atmos is my next goal. I’m trying to get that all going now that I’m feeling better. I’ll probably do a caveman sketch this week.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Like you, my Atmos is my next goal. I’m trying to get that all going now that I’m feeling better. I’ll probably do a caveman sketch this week.

I hear you. Glad you’re feeling better. Nothing worse than being knocked down. The only thing I’ve got going more than you(I think) is my rsl’s are actually installed. I’ve been dying watching all the stupid sales on the x4400, and not being able to do anything. My oldest son got his drivers license and we added him to our insurance. Damn, that’s a hit to take. Plus he needs a car so I need to buy him (or myself) one. And now Christmas shopping. Ugh... I actually thought about not logging in to AH until I was done as to not think about it, but that’s lame so... trying to sell my trusty old Onkyo but that’s not going great either.
Let’s see the sketches! I can read caveman.

 

[snakeeyes]

I hear you. Glad you’re feeling better. Nothing worse than being knocked down. The only thing I’ve got going more than you(I think) is my rsl’s are actually installed. I’ve been dying watching all the stupid sales on the x4400, and not being able to do anything. My oldest son got his drivers license and we added him to our insurance. Damn, that’s a hit to take. Plus he needs a car so I need to buy him (or myself) one. And now Christmas shopping. Ugh... I actually thought about not logging in to AH until I was done as to not think about it, but that’s lame so... trying to sell my trusty old Onkyo but that’s not going great either.
Let’s see the sketches! I can read caveman.

Well I think I can try to get that going in the next couple days. I think Friday morning I can crawl up in the attic to see better what I’m dealing with.

 

[sterling shoote]

I don't want to disturb the direction of this thread; yet, this thread inspires me to mention a multi-channel recording which, right now, is at the top of my favorite recordings list: The Firebird performed by the Seattle Symphony, which is not available unfortunately on SACD. I downloaded the 5.1 flac file of this performance from Acoustic Sounds and copied it to a thumb drive to play from my OPPO 205 using front usb port, which supports gapless play. Friends, this is the best music purchase I've ever made. You will be dazzled by this version of The Firebird. Interestingly enough, I contacted the Seattle Symphony to praise them and also inquire if there might be SACDs coming. Their response alluded to SACDs costing too much to secure some profit. At any rate, this recording makes the best case for multi-channel music and will spoil satisfaction for similar recordings presented in stereo.

 

[PENG]

Absolutely. Content wise, it’s 2/5/7.1 etc. I just reference 7ch+3 subs(7.3) to avoid the inevitable question of “how many subs do you have?”

Well I agree(I think) that the two would win(your words), in a MCH stereo since the output levels are the same, front and back. In an upscaled surround mode like pliix however the levels of the side/rear speakers are not the same as the fronts.(unless of course you’re using DEQ which boosts the rears. Therefore it sounds balanced front to back. For example if I’m up sampling 2ch music to pliix in 7.1, my surrounds are not louder and overpowering the fronts. If I choose all channel stereo, the sides/rears are louder at the LP. When I move to the middle of the room, where I’m half the distance to my fronts and backs, they have the same output level.

So I think we agree that in the all channel stereo scenario, if it is a 7.1 system, the surround speakers will appear to be louder because it is a 2 against 1, or 4 against 2 if you consider all 6 speakers, and given that the contents are the same for each of the left and right group of speakers. That is, SL/SR, SBL/SBR against the FL/FR as they are presumable level matched to each other.

For PLIIx etc., the contents are not going to be the same for each channel, so again we can agree in such cases, they surround channels may/should not overwhelm the front channels as it will be contents dependent.

If you move away from the mlp, say further from the surrounds and closer to the fronts, you are effectively "re-balancing" the levels of the front, surround and back surround speakers by distance so then of course there is a point where they will all sound at roughly the same level again. In your case that point just appears to be the middle of the room. This is an interesting topic that I have never even thought about before as I have never listened to all channel stereo.

 

[snakeeyes]

In 7.1, I can see how that could be a lot different than 5.1.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I used to listen to music in 2.1.

I sold all my SACD, DVD-A, DTS CD collection.

Now I listen to music in DSU 5.1.4 from 2Ch music files.

I also have a few Blu-Ray Music Concerts in 5.1.

 

[PENG]

Good question Chris. To me, since the nerd herd here knows the lingo, I feel like expressing 5/7.x as the number of subs in your system is ok. If not I’ll quit doin that. I think putting the number of subs in parentheses after the x.1 would be even more confusing than just sayin 7.3.

Why not.. I was just teasing...

 

[PENG]

In 7.1, I can see how that could be a lot different than 5.1.

For 5 channel stereo, if all the channel levels are balanced perfectly, the surrounds should not overwhelm the fronts at the mlp but they may still appear to sound a little louder depending on the difference in FR. For example, 1000 Hz may sound louder than 80 Hz to our ears but not to the spl meter.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Why not.. I was just teasing...

sorry @PENG, I hate to leave stuff unfinished. just wanted to say "duh", sometimes I don't always catch on to internet humor. Enjoy your inputs, and humors LOL

 

[Blue Dude]

I used to listen to music in 2.1.

I sold all my SACD, DVD-A, DTS CD collection.

Now I listen to music in DSU 5.1.4 from 2Ch music files.

I also have a few Blu-Ray Music Concerts in 5.1.

I got used to playing music discs and files in their original configuration, no upmixing. But that was before Dolby upgraded their upmixing algorithm from Pro Logic (and all of its variants) to Dolby Surround. Is it really that much better? I might have to sit down to conduct listening tests again.