Bi-Amping

[everettT]

There is an article on the main site that discusses the topic FWIW. Anyone wanting to switch from passive to active should understand that it's not as simple as hooking something up. First, unless your a DIY guy and even then, it wouldn't be worth doing it in a commercial speaker. If you want active crossovers buy or design a speaker with them. There are some real and perceived advantages to active crossovers, but a well designed passive one is just as good. If you want to improve sound, buy better speakers.

 

[Peace Maker]

I think it's you who might be stoney Altho having those two avrs won't do it....

Please I didn't understand your response. Could you please help walk me through how to do the active bi-amp

I suspect there's a lot more to it than you realize. For starters you would tear all the crossovers out of your speakers or start fresh with speakers designed for it. The gains you would achieve properly bi amping a system are not worth the money and effort involved unless you have plenty of it and deem it worthy.

Google "active crossovers" and "bi amp". Do some research before you do anything else.

Thanks Pogre for the education and also for the quick response.

I have a few more questions. If I want to settle for the vertical or horizontal passive bi-amping, does it have any disadvantages or challenges? If any, what are they please ?

Would it worthwhile undertaking one of the two since I have my Sony STR-DN 1060 sitting idle. Thanks

 

[everettT]

Please I didn't understand your response. Could you please help walk me through how to do the active bi-amp


Thanks Pogre for the education and also for the quick response.

I have a few more questions. If I want to settle for the vertical or horizontal passive bi-amping, does it have any disadvantages or challenges? If any, what are they please ?

Would it worthwhile undertaking one of the two since I have my Sony STR-DN 1060 sitting idle. Thanks

Not to jump in and answer, passive biamping is only good for esthetics. Doing it with two different AVRs is asking for a reduction in sound quality. Just by adding what you think is more power is all negated by the power divide of an passive internal crossover. I'd use the extra gear to feed anothet zone.

 

[lovinthehd]

Please I didn't understand your response. Could you please help walk me through how to do the active bi-amp


Thanks Pogre for the education and also for the quick response.

I have a few more questions. If I want to settle for the vertical or horizontal passive bi-amping, does it have any disadvantages or challenges? If any, what are they please ?

Would it worthwhile undertaking one of the two since I have my Sony STR-DN 1060 sitting idle. Thanks

You aren't going to do an active bi-amp with your current gear. Your speakers aren't particularly good ones to start active bi-amping with either. Passive bi-amping IMO is a waste of wire and time.

 

[MR.MAGOO]

I experimented with bi-amping my front main speakers and the only difference I noticed was a drop in my bank account.

 

[mtrycrafts]

..,. a drop in my bank account.

What did it sound like? I need to get an idea so I can avoid that sound.

 

[MR.MAGOO]

I could not hear any difference before or after.

 

[mtrycrafts]

I could not hear any difference before or after.

I meant the drop in your bank account.

 

[Tri-amp craftsman]

I have bi, tri, and once, for someone else, built a quad amped system.

I said that to say this: YOU can actively bi-amp commercial loud speakers - I have bi & tri-amped them quite successfully.

I have actively triamped my HT speakers. Namely Polk RTi A7* L&R towers and a Polk CSi A6* center channel. I expect to complete biamping my Polk RTi A3 surrounds by late winter. Build threads on the Polk forum.

You will need a 2 way electronic XO and two 2 channel amps and be prepared to do some work.

The TAC

 

[KenM10759]

I have bi, tri, and once, for someone else, built a quad amped system.

I said that to say this: YOU can actively bi-amp commercial loud speakers - I have bi & tri-amped them quite successfully.

I have actively triamped my HT speakers. Namely Polk RTi A7* L&R towers and a Polk CSi A6* center channel. I expect to complete biamping my Polk RTi A3 surrounds by late winter. Build threads on the Polk forum.

You will need a 2 way electronic XO and two 2 channel amps and be prepared to do some work.

The TAC

You seem to have found a great way to empty a wallet for little or no benefit. There's a reason such a small number of people go through that effort. Consider someone who really likes hi-fi and has experience and money. They don't do that. What they do is buy the speakers they like best, the source they deem best, and give it the best amplifier they can. A very few might get into an external crossover.

You may be the only one I've heard of going through those hoops and I'd love to see the before and after measurements of the effectiveness.

 

[Tri-amp craftsman]

You seem to have found a great way to empty* a* wallet*...

I won't attempt to argue that*. OTOH I've been around a few who spend MORE to gain a lot less.

...for little or no benefit*.

Is that your opinion or voice of experience? Either way I take exception to that *. This "ain't my first rodeo".

Your AH title suggests you've been at this awhile. How long have you been into 2 channel or HT as hobby?

There's a reason* such a small number of people go through that effort.

That reason* is, work aside...

Consider someone who really likes hi-fi and has experience and money. They don't do that*.

I love hi-fi. I have a lot of experience, but not a lot of $. However if you spend enough time in this hobby, you will find that* to the contrary.

What they do is buy the speakers they like best, the source they deem best, and give it the best amplifier they can.

IME: source, electronics, then speakers, seems to work better but to each his own. Further YOU seem down on DIY. What attracted me to AH was DIY stuff/info I hadn't seen on other forums.

A very few might get into an external* crossover*.

The few that reached out to me (electronic*) have joyfully expressed their regrets for not doing it sooner.

You may be the only one I've heard of going through those hoops...

Sounds like that makes me unique on this forum

I'd love to see the before and after measurements of the effectiveness.

Copy & paste the following into google to view "before" graphs to your hearts content.

rti a7 frequency response graph

It's what I saw before I got busy w/my soldering iron, etc. The "after?" Well I moved earlier this year and have long honey-do list to make disappear before I retire. IME measurements & specs rarely tell the whole story anyway. I may get to the "after" during a frosty January or February weekend early 2018.

Meanwhile feel free to peruse my build threads.

http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/174880/tri-amped-rti-a7#latest

http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/175612/tri-amped-csi-a6#latest

The TAC

 

[KenM10759]

Linn of Scotland's "Exakt" music systems digitally crossover and individual amp each driver in their speakers. It works FABULOUSLY. I don't presume to know just how you're doing it and how well it works, so I'm sorry I seem to doubt you.

Enjoy your work, just don't expect a lot of people to attempt it on their own or call you to come do it without a lot of documented evidence of it's effectiveness and testimonials as to its value.

I'm not down on DIY at all. In fact, I plan to work with my son to build each of us a pair of full range speakers. He's now got a good joiner, router, and all kinds of other tools so we can do a good job. I'm saving for top quality components from the likes of RAAL, Seas, Morel and others to build what is right of each of our rooms. A little practice with fine wood veneers on some other objects before we tackle doing something on the scale of Jim Salk & Dennis Murphy.

 

[mtrycrafts]

... IME measurements & specs rarely tell the whole story anyway. ...

Try telling that to Dr. Floyd Toole.

 

[PENG]

Try telling that to Dr. Floyd Toole.

Are you sure there is any point though, some people just don't want to go with measurements that show facts and figures. They prefer to go with "subjective" thing that varies between people, mood and many more variables and you can't argue with those things that are not always facts based and/or don't follow any logic. Now I really don't know what I am talking about..

 

[Tri-amp craftsman]

Try telling that to Dr. Floyd Toole.

I will if we chance to meet.

 

[Tri-amp craftsman]

Are you sure there is any point though, some people just don't want to go with measurements that show facts and figures. They prefer to go with "subjective" thing that varies between people, mood and many more variables and you can't argue with those things that are not always facts based and/or don't follow any logic. Now I really don't know what I am talking about..

C'mon admit it you do know what you're talking about.

 

[TLS Guy]

I have bi, tri, and once, for someone else, built a quad amped system.

I said that to say this: YOU can actively bi-amp commercial loud speakers - I have bi & tri-amped them quite successfully.

I have actively triamped my HT speakers. Namely Polk RTi A7* L&R towers and a Polk CSi A6* center channel. I expect to complete biamping my Polk RTi A3 surrounds by late winter. Build threads on the Polk forum.

You will need a 2 way electronic XO and two 2 channel amps and be prepared to do some work.

The TAC

Well certainly the POLK RTi A7 speakers are ripe for active treatment as the passive approach for a speaker like that is just a disaster. A design like that has to be active, no ifs or buts.

However the onus is on you to demonstrate by measurement that you have improved the units. I do show the results of my speakers with active circuitry.

Unless you actually study the effects of what you do, you will have no route to improvement.

However the best route for you is to learn to design and build you own total design concepts. That is where you get the really big pay offs.

 

[Tri-amp craftsman]

Linn of Scotland's "Exakt" music systems digitally crossover and individual amp each driver in their speakers. It works FABULOUSLY.

Yup! You described my work and my opinion of same "Exaktly." BTW I'm VERY familiar w/Linn products

I don't presume to know just how you're doing it and how well it works,

Doin' it digitally w/ multiple amps. It works well for me.

...so I'm sorry I seem to doubt you.

I forgive you.

Enjoy your work...

I do, and I will. Keeps me off the streets at night.

...just don't expect a lot of people to attempt it on their own...

For the uninitiated it can be scary. See my build threads.

...or call you to come do it

gladly take phone calls but until I retire, no time to travel and if I did, house calls won't be free

...without a lot of documented evidence of it's effectiveness and testimonials as to its value.

working on documentation. Testimonials are easy.

I'm not down on DIY at all. In fact, I plan to work with my son to build each of us a pair of full range speakers. He's now got a good joiner, router, and all kinds of other tools so we can do a good job.

Kudos! You're way ahead me on tools.

I'm saving for top quality components from the likes of RAAL, Seas, Morel and others to build what is right of each of our rooms.

Again KUDOs! "Better ingredients, better pizza."

A little practice with fine wood veneers on some other objects before we tackle doing something on the scale of Jim Salk & Dennis Murphy.

my first couple of practice scratch project will be one or more different uncommon sub alignments. Later I plan to replace all my home theatre speakers w/quasi DIYs.

The TAC