Audioquest Cables

[Johnny2Bad]

With regard to analog interconnect cables:
Capacitance and inductance are opposite sides of the same coin. both can't be low.
While low total capacitance is nice, inductance doesn't matter. For a digital cable the capacitance/inductance ratio determine the cable's impedance.


The copper used by Belden, Canare and Mogami in their conductors is just fine.


To an extent this is true, but so what?


Yes, it sounds like a foil shield. But a foil shield is best at very high radio frequencies (RFI) and poor at low (EMI) frequencies that are more important for audio cables. A foil shield is terrible when it comes to Common Impedance Coupling noise. An unbalance interconnect should be a coax with a heavy braided shield.


I don't recall ever seeing a coax described that way. To me it suggests something other than a coax.

Inductance is reduced by simply separating the L + R cables, versus having a "twinned" cable, or by increasing the separation of active elements within the same cable. You can have low capacitance and low inductance.

Capacitance matters most in interconnects and inductance matters most in loudspeaker cables. Last time I checked, Audioquest sold both, and they are both "cables".

 

[Johnny2Bad]

" ...
panteragstk said: ↑
Sometimes it's exactly what the company paid and in the most rare case it is cost minus 10%.
What on earth do you base this on? and when you say company, which company? The manufacturer, the wholesaler, the retailer?
..."

Cost minus 10 is exactly what I paid for a Luxman amplifier many years ago, in an Industry Accommodation program from the distributor. It was hundreds of dollars below our dealer cost. You had to sign an agreement that you could not resell the item within 12 months. YMMV

Similarly I once bought fly fishing reels and rods for about 20% of retail in a distributor's staff program (made by a very respected Brand), again limited to one purchase every 12 months, and our cost to sell the same products, once shipping was taken into account, was about 70% of retail.

The clothes you are wearing have a 200% markup. This is so stores can sell out-of-season and leftover sizes at huge sale prices when necessary.

All the information you need as a consumer is right before your eyes, in the sale catalogs of everything offered at retail.

Matresses at ⅓ of retail? Guess what the margin is.

Appliances at 25% off? Guess what the margin is.

Computers and other technology products that experience rapid price drops as volume changes the cost of production are rebated for the price difference between what they paid and what the new price is. On the day the price drops, you fill out a form with serial numbers describing your unsold inventory and they send you a credit or a check.

Distributor's reps will show up un-announced and check inventory and if you are cheating, big problems, including losing the line altogether. So tech has the same markup regardless of whether prices are high or have fallen.

Cables at your local audio store are far from the biggest cash profit items in retail.

In one year you can learn the markup of everything you buy by watching the sale prices. Child's play.

 

[Pogre]

Last I checked Coca Cola wasn't trying to get $1000 a can by lying to consumers...

Though I'm sure a few audiophools would buy it.

 

[eljr]

Last I checked Coca Cola wasn't trying to get $1000 a can by lying to consumers...

Though I'm sure a few audiophools would buy it.

Do you ever wear Nike?

Familiar with the practices of Big Pharma?

-------------------

Last I heard, Coca Cola was not good for you.


---------------------

Audioquest and other high end audio is no different than any other business were it to be viewed OBJECTIVELY.

 

[Speedskater]

Inductance is reduced by simply separating the L + R cables, versus having a "twinned" cable,

No that's incorrect. The inductance on one cable as nothing to do with the inductance in another cable.

or by increasing the separation of active elements within the same cable. You can have low capacitance and low inductance.

Nope, separating the conductors in a cable will increase the inductance and decrease the capacitance.

Capacitance matters most in interconnects and inductance matters most in loudspeaker cables. Last time I checked, Audioquest sold both, and they are both "cables".

Yes, inductance matters most in loudspeaker cables.
But high total capacitance matters only in output stages (both interconnect and power amps) that can't deal with it.

 

[Speedskater]

By the way 'active elements' suggests powered circuits or components.
Some passive components are wires, resistors, capacitors and inductors.
Some active components are tubes, transistors and IC's.

 

[Steve81]

Do you ever wear Nike? Familiar with the practices of Big Pharma? Last I heard, Coca Cola was not good for you. Audioquest and other high end audio is no different than any other business were it to be viewed OBJECTIVELY.

So because other companies engage in shady business practices, we shouldn't call out Audioquest on an audio-oriented forum for their specious claims? Maybe you would have a point if we were forced to pick and choose between being angry with Audioquest's business practices and Mylan jacking up the price of Epi-Pens. I suppose I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm capable of caring about a variety of topics.

 

[MrBoat]

The tactical sales model of the entire ad/retail industry should be enough of a clue. All of which is designed around the emotional/intellectual capacity of an average 10 year old child.

It's year 2017. We should be way more evolved by now in which to be insulted by such presentation. This falls below the realm of exposure with regard to low level street smarts and what should be an obvious alarm to natural common sense. Like the type of common sense that tells you to eat when you're hungry, and go to the bathroom when you have to.

 

[Pogre]

So because other companies engage in shady business practices, we shouldn't call out Audioquest on an audio-oriented forum for their specious claims? Maybe you would have a point if we were forced to pick and choose between being angry with Audioquest's business practices and Mylan jacking up the price of Epi-Pens. I suppose I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm capable of caring about a variety of topics.

I don't wear Nike for the same reason I don't buy Audiophool cables. Some of their shoes are way too overpriced for what they do, imo. If folks like the style, then great buy all the Nike you want, but don't try to convince me they'll make me run faster, lose weight and filter distortion...

 

[highfigh]

Sure it is. Depending on the company the employee discounted price is still above what the company paid for the product. Sometimes it's exactly what the company paid and in the most rare case it is cost minus 10%.

Either way it shows how much markup there is as well as how much the cable in question actually costs to make.

Heck, on our terminals it told us exactly how much cost was on every product we rang up.

Cost plus, usually. IF the actual dealer cost is used in the POS terminal, they're reducing the profit they think they're getting. Advertising for that product, display space, shipping (if the minimum order isn't reached) etc all come into play WRT the real cost. Wire, on the manufacturer to warehouse level, costs a fraction of the retail price and every time someone handles it, they make money. This is one reason I could never sell high end cables- one example is AudioQuest 6' HDMI- it retails for $1500.00 and I could never look myself in the eye if I were to sell one.

 

[mtrycrafts]

... We should be way more evolved by now ....

One would think.
But, in the ad world time scale, we are just in the embryo stage.

 

[mtrycrafts]

By the way 'active elements' suggests powered circuits or components.
Some passive components are wires, resistors, capacitors and inductors.
Some active components are tubes, transistors and IC's.

Like passive and active crossovers.

 

[mtrycrafts]

...
Yes, inductance matters most in loudspeaker cables.
But high total capacitance matters only in output stages (both interconnect and power amps) that can't deal with it.

Yes. Like some of the Naim amps that self destructed with some cables.

 

[panteragstk]

Cost plus, usually. IF the actual dealer cost is used in the POS terminal, they're reducing the profit they think they're getting. Advertising for that product, display space, shipping (if the minimum order isn't reached) etc all come into play WRT the real cost. Wire, on the manufacturer to warehouse level, costs a fraction of the retail price and every time someone handles it, they make money. This is one reason I could never sell high end cables- one example is AudioQuest 6' HDMI- it retails for $1500.00 and I could never look myself in the eye if I were to sell one.

Right, I'm just using the data I had available to make a guess as to actual cost. I of course don't know the exact number.

People should really be aware of how high markup is in cables. Sure, Audioquest may have lower margins than some (maybe) but that means there is still at least 60% markup at a minimum.

 

[Bucknekked]

The tactical sales model of the entire ad/retail industry should be enough of a clue. All of which is designed around the emotional/intellectual capacity of an average 10 year old child.

It's year 2017. We should be way more evolved by now in which to be insulted by such presentation. This falls below the realm of exposure with regard to low level street smarts and what should be an obvious alarm to natural common sense. Like the type of common sense that tells you to eat when you're hungry, and go to the bathroom when you have to.

MrBoat
Should is a marvelous word. It fills the bill. We should...........fill in the blanks.........but we arent.
Sometimes we get wrapped around the axle with advertising and snake oil claims in audio because that's what this forum is about. We care about bogus claims so we call them out. Do you think audio is any different than other products? Let's see for a second.

Turn on the TV, or, better yet, open any magazine that caters to women. (For those of you who are unfamiliar with women, they are the humans that usually have longer hair, paint their finger nails, and they smell good.) Look in their cosmetic advertisements. Go ahead. I dare you. In any woman's magazine, there are literally 100's of ads in each magazine. Have a stack of womens mags, like in a beauty shop, and there are 1,000's to 10,000's of those ads. They all have one thing in common : buy our stuff and you will look 10 years younger and be hot as a tv hottie. They often have a guy in a lab coat to reassure them its scientifically proven.

Are any of the claims true? Are any of the claims even physically possible? Is that sh-it expensive? Is that sh-it super expensive? Are the women in your life getting scammed worse than cable sales guys? I think they are, and if you speak up to debunk their new face cream or miracle treatment be prepared for bad things to happen. Tears are possible. Sharp words are possible. Frowny faces are possible. Hey ! Just like here on the AH !

 

[panteragstk]

MrBoat
Should is a marvelous word. It fills the bill. We should...........fill in the blanks.........but we arent.
Sometimes we get wrapped around the axle with advertising and snake oil claims in audio because that's what this forum is about. We care about bogus claims so we call them out. Do you think audio is any different than other products? Let's see for a second.

Turn on the TV, or, better yet, open any magazine that caters to women. (For those of you who are unfamiliar with women, they are the humans that usually have longer hair, paint their finger nails, and they smell good.) Look in their cosmetic advertisements. Go ahead. I dare you. In any woman's magazine, there are literally 100's of ads in each magazine. Have a stack of womens mags, like in a beauty shop, and there are 1,000's to 10,000's of those ads. They all have one thing in common : buy our stuff and you will look 10 years younger and be hot as a tv hottie. They often have a guy in a lab coat to reassure them its scientifically proven.

Are any of the claims true? Are any of the claims even physically possible? Is that sh-it expensive? Is that sh-it super expensive? Are the women in your life getting scammed worse than cable sales guys? I think they are, and if you speak up to debunk their new face cream or miracle treatment be prepared for bad things to happen. Tears are possible. Sharp words are possible. Frowny faces are possible. Hey ! Just like here on the AH !

The best thing about the women's magazines is they say "x product will make you slimmer, younger, etc" while also telling women that those things shouldn't matter to them.

Being a woman has to be annoying...

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

I don't wear Nike for the same reason I don't buy Audiophool cables. Some of their shoes are way too overpriced for what they do, imo. If folks like the style, then great buy all the Nike you want, but don't try to convince me they'll make me run faster, lose weight and filter distortion...

(Super annoying 7 year old know it all with a thuper lithsp)
Yeah right Pogre, my Nike'ths make me run tho much fathster than my New balanth's !!!

 

[panteragstk]

(Super annoying 7 year old know it all with a thuper lithsp)
Yeah right Pogre, my Nike'ths make me run tho much fathster than my New balanth's !!!

It's the springs.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

It's the springs.

Yeth. Tha Springths!!!

 

[eljr]

So because other companies engage in shady business practices, we shouldn't call out Audioquest on an audio-oriented forum for their specious claims? Maybe you would have a point if we were forced to pick and choose between being angry with Audioquest's business practices and Mylan jacking up the price of Epi-Pens. I suppose I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm capable of caring about a variety of topics.

just pointing out the hypocrisy here

---------------------------

I did not call Nike shady

there is nothing shady about what Nike does or what Audioquest does.

If they break the law they are subject to prosecution.

It seems both fail in double blind tests is all.

You have every right and it is prudent, to point out how some cables are likely not providing any audible improvement.

Incessantly, with such malice?

Making one way name calling and insulting posts acceptable in the name of social activism?

Maybe that is extreme behavior that ought to change?

See my point?

BTW, you never said, what branded goods do you wear? Do people on apparel forums call you the equivalent of audiopool, maybe, fashionidiot, with impunity because they wear unbranded?

Why, only in my most beloved endeavor, audio/music, is this so common?