Best Cable and Connectors

[Pogre]

That's what I use. 2 set screws, they don't pull out of the plugs.

 

[highfigh]

Thanks!! That's gonna save me some bucks for other stuff
I'm already using surge protection, but was seeing ppl using power conditioners saying the background is quieter, sound is improved, etc.

If you don't hear audio from radio or TV (stations or CB/Ham radio), I doubt you have a problem. I live within a mile of a TV/Radio antenna farm and never hear anything through my stereo. My guitar rig is different- the effect of the added devices and cables eventually causes problems when the number of devices reaches a certain point.

If you do hear audio from those sources, make sure the ground in the circuit is as good as possible- this doesn't mean throw a power strip, protector/conditioner on it, it means make sure there's no resistance between the system and the ground rods/earth.

 

[prk504]

I'm using Belden 12/4 wire and mediabridge banana plugs and spades. I agree with strum in post 8 that the media bridge are like sewell plugs, but they are 100% stronger. The sewell plugs can strip easily when tightening the cap.

On the speaker end I added some wire pants, tech flex, and a little heatshrink which makes the cable looks very finished.

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[TheWarrior]

If nothing else, cheap monoprice bananas into the AVR/Preamp saves you time trying to squeeze copper strands into each speaker output terminal.

 

[Irvrobinson]

I'm using Belden 12/4 wire and mediabridge banana plugs and spades. I agree with strum in post 8 that the media bridge are like sewell plugs, but they are 100% stronger. The sewell plugs can strip easily when tightening the cap.

On the speaker end I added some wire pants, tech flex, and a little heatshrink which makes the cable looks very finished.

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You're bi-wiring?

 

[prk504]

You're bi-wiring?

Yes. I have a 70ft run to main front speakers. I planned on joining the 4 conductors into 2 conductors to reduce the overall impedance on the long run, but B&w recommended I biwire their speakers instead. They said that their speakers are designed for biwiring. There are quite a few speaker companies that recommend this.





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[slipperybidness]

Yes. I have a 70ft run to main front speakers. I planned on joining the 4 conductors into 2 conductors to reduce the overall impedance on the long run, but B&w recommended I biwire their speakers instead. They said that their speakers are designed for biwiring. There are quite a few speaker companies that recommend this.





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Oh, you have definitely joined the 4 conductors into 2 conductors, the pics on the back of the AVR make that clear!

Even if you took the connection plate off the back of the speaker terminals, it's a moot point b/c they are connected at the AVR.

 

[j_garcia]

Yes. I have a 70ft run to main front speakers. I planned on joining the 4 conductors into 2 conductors to reduce the overall impedance on the long run, but B&w recommended I biwire their speakers instead. They said that their speakers are designed for biwiring. There are quite a few speaker companies that recommend this.

They probably recommend biAMPing, not bi wiring. Biwiring does the same thing as just using larger AWG wire. Not only that, but biwiring or passive biamping off an AVR is also not doing much for you since all channels share one power supply.

ALL of the companies that added dual binding posts will recommend this but most people implement it incorrectly and achieve nothing more than adding more complexity than benefit.

 

[Irvrobinson]

Yes. I have a 70ft run to main front speakers. I planned on joining the 4 conductors into 2 conductors to reduce the overall impedance on the long run, but B&w recommended I biwire their speakers instead. They said that their speakers are designed for biwiring. There are quite a few speaker companies that recommend this.

Bi-wiring and passive bi-amping capabilities are, for the most part, just a marketing tool that most speaker companies (even very good ones) are afraid to be without. Even for 70' runs, single 10-gauge zip cord with those bananas or spades are all you need. Really. The DC resistance on those runs will be only 0.07 ohms. For 12-gauge wire it'll be 0.111 ohms, so I'd go with 10-gauge. I suppose this is a moot point though, since bi-wiring does no harm, so staying where you are is fine.

 

[prk504]

Bi-wiring and passive bi-amping capabilities are, for the most part, just a marketing tool that most speaker companies (even very good ones) are afraid to be without. Even for 70' runs, single 10-gauge zip cord with those bananas or spades are all you need. Really. The DC resistance on those runs will be only 0.07 ohms. For 12-gauge wire it'll be 0.111 ohms, so I'd go with 10-gauge. I suppose this is a moot point though, since bi-wiring does no harm, so staying where you are is fine.

Are you mansplaining?

they recommended biwiring over twisting the wires together in both ends (speaker and amp). There was no discussion of bi amping.

I have a 70ft run which is longer than most and biwiring reduced my impedance of a single 12ga wire into a 9ga wire.




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[pewternhrata]

I thought best rule of thumb is ofc? Highly recommended Belden 5000ue is not ofc?

 

[prk504]

I thought best rule of thumb is ofc? Highly recommended Belden 5000ue is not ofc?

I think you're right, ofc is better than CCA.

I used the Belden 5002up 12/4 which is ofc.



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[highfigh]

I'm using Belden 12/4 wire and mediabridge banana plugs and spades. I agree with strum in post 8 that the media bridge are like sewell plugs, but they are 100% stronger. The sewell plugs can strip easily when tightening the cap.

On the speaker end I added some wire pants, tech flex, and a little heatshrink which makes the cable looks very finished.

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FYI- if you ever have someone who does AV professionally make connections at the speaker end/distributed audio and you attach the speaker wires at the amplifier using that color code, it's likely that they will assume it's not connected in this way- the typical color assignment is:

Red- Right +
Black- Right -
White- Left +
Green- Left -

 

[highfigh]

Are you mansplaining?

they recommended biwiring over twisting the wires together in both ends (speaker and amp). There was no discussion of bi amping.

I have a 70ft run which is longer than most and biwiring reduced my impedance of a single 12ga wire into a 9ga wire.

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Ask B&W when they started telling people they need to bi-wire the speakers. It wasn't done until someone started to market it as better and that low frequencies travel at a different speed from high frequencies. They did it so they would make money- it doesn't improve performance more than using adequate wire gauge. What it does, is sell more spade lugs and banana plugs.


The main difference between doing it the way you did and twisting the wires is that most binding posts and banana plugs don't accept 9ga wire unless it's solid. Otherwise, you can use one banana plug at each end and it won't make any difference. Doubling the wire with four conductor is a good way to avoid paying for the heavier gauge and it's more flexible, in the event that you decide to use an amp or speakers that actually need it (like true bi-amped speakers with no passive crossover). In theory, it does no harm, but it really doesn't help.

 

[prk504]

FYI- if you ever have someone who does AV professionally make connections at the speaker end/distributed audio and you attach the speaker wires at the amplifier using that color code, it's likely that they will assume it's not connected in this way- the typical color assignment is:

Red- Right +
Black- Right -
White- Left +
Green- Left -

Thanks
I didn't know the color code so I just made it up as I'm the only one who is going to work on this.

Is there is a standard bi wire color code?
I used
Red - High +
Black - High -
Green - low +
White - low -

I know it might sound ridiculous but I put the red and green together because they are Christmas colors in my head and I wouldn't forget when doing this late at night after work lol


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[prk504]

Ask B&W when they started telling people they need to bi-wire the speakers. It wasn't done until someone started to market it as better and that low frequencies travel at a different speed from high frequencies. They did it so they would make money- it doesn't improve performance more than using adequate wire gauge. What it does, is sell more spade lugs and banana plugs.


The main difference between doing it the way you did and twisting the wires is that most binding posts and banana plugs don't accept 9ga wire unless it's solid. Otherwise, you can use one banana plug at each end and it won't make any difference. Doubling the wire with four conductor is a good way to avoid paying for the heavier gauge and it's more flexible, in the event that you decide to use an amp or speakers that actually need it (like true bi-amped speakers with no passive crossover). In theory, it does no harm, but it really doesn't help.

I have 12/4 wire and speakers that dip to 2 ohms...at my 70ft run the overall impedance of 12 GA wire would be more than 5% of the speaker impedance when dipping to 2 ohms (I've read that keeping the wire impedance below 5% of the speaker impedance is important for sound quality)...so I thought could just twist the wires together at the amp end and speaker end and leave the jumpers on the speakers...effectively having a 9ga wire with 2 conductors.

When I emailed b&w and asked them about twisting the wire together on both ends and leaving the jumpers on the speakers, they told me not to twist the wires on both ends and that biwiring (and removing jumpers) would be better and that's what the 804d3 is designed for.


This is a quote from the B&W support agent...

"Twisting 2 wires together on both ends could create some inductance issues and throw the cabling out of spec. This is why we recommend removing the bi-wire links on the back of our speakers when biwiring or bi-amping them. You would achieve favorable results by simply bi-wiring the speaker using 4-conductor cable."






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[highfigh]

Thanks
I didn't know the color code so I just made it up as I'm the only one who is going to work on this.

Is there is a standard bi wire color code?
I used
Red - High +
Black - High -
Green - low +
White - low -

I know it might sound ridiculous but I put the red and green together because they are Christmas colors in my head and I wouldn't forget when doing this late at night after work lol


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It's an easy way to remember it, but if you think about RCA audio jacks, Red is Right and White is Left.

 

[prk504]

It's an easy way to remember it, but if you think about RCA audio jacks, Red is Right and White is Left.

Lol that makes a lot of sense. Hobbyist trying professional work = Christmas colors.


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[highfigh]

When I emailed b&w and asked them about twisting the wire together on both ends and leavimg the jumpers on the speakers, they told me not to twist the wires on both ends and that biwiring (and removing jumpers) would be better and that's what the 804d3 is designed for.


This is a quote from the B&W support agent...

"Twisting 2 wires together on both ends could create some inductance issues and throw the cabling out of spec. This is why we recommend removing the bi-wire links on the back of our speakers when biwiring or bi-amping them. You would achieve favorable results by simply bi-wiring the speaker using 4-conductor cable."

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This has been tested- it only moves the point where the conductors merge to the binding post on the amplifier- it's only one stud with one nut, but one of the wires on each is on a banana plug, rather than a spade lug.

If the links are supposed to be removed, they should omit them but if they did that, people would call and say the speakers are defective.

They buy the terminal cups from a supplier that includes the straps and removing the straps not only costs money, it would confuse a lot of customers who don't know how to make these connections. NONE of the best speakers made before this practice suffered for it. Engineers who design pro/commercial/industrial systems use it because it adds cost & complexity and increases the chance of some kind of failure.

If there was a way to switch between bi-wired and twisted pairs, nobody will hear the difference unless they know which is being used at the time.

 

[prk504]

This has been tested- it only moves the point where the conductors merge to the binding post on the amplifier- it's only one stud with one nut, but one of the wires on each is on a banana plug, rather than a spade lug.

If the links are supposed to be removed, they should omit them but if they did that, people would call and say the speakers are defective.

They buy the terminal cups from a supplier that includes the straps and removing the straps not only costs money, it would confuse a lot of customers who don't know how to make these connections. NONE of the best speakers made before this practice suffered for it. Engineers who design pro/commercial/industrial systems use it because it adds cost & complexity and increases the chance of some kind of failure.

If there was a way to switch between bi-wired and twisted pairs, nobody will hear the difference unless they know which is being used at the time.

That's interesting. If there is no difference I'd rather do the biwire the way I have it. The 4 legged speaker pants look way cooler behind the speakers.

That being said, is there a disadvantage doing the biwire the way I have it set up?

Also the speakers I have did not come with jumpers attached, they supplied the jumpers in the accessories kit.

I'm surprised this is basically a marketing gimmick.

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