Help with 7.1.4 Atmos

[shadyJ]

So, a guy shows up with a decent budget and gets advice to mix and match speakers for a "high end" setup?
8700 for ultra towers, 4BS, a CC and 4 prime elevation speakers and 2 pc12pluses. That leaves1300 for a denon 4300 for 1000.00 from a4l and an amp to do 11channels. Plenty more options too, just some quick math. Axiom is in Canada ay! Have you looked there.

The QSC speakers will have a dynamic range well beyond that of the SVS Ultra towers, and they are self-powered, and they are a bit cheaper. Same thing with the JBL speakers. They both look to have flat frequencies responses as well.

 

[Pogre]

The exchange rate of the Canadian dollar vs the US dollar is very bad right now, so anything he buys from the US will cost a lot more. Even so, the Hsu subs would still be a good deal, but I wouldn't be surprised if all the fees and duties took their price up to something like 1500 each.

Ouch. I always forget to factor in the exchange rate for our northern neighbors. There are other options though, I'm sure.

 

[Jhon]

I am just trying to get something good, not some low end solution. I really appreciate all your comments and advice and I am really taking it in consideration. I now know which sub to get and I now know to not use the bi-surround sound!

 

[Jhon]

I don't mind spending 5k more if needed to have the perfect HT!

 

[Jhon]

The QSC speakers will have a dynamic range well beyond that of the SVS Ultra towers, and they are self-powered, and they are a bit cheaper. Same thing with the JBL speakers. They both look to have flat frequencies responses as well.

I feel that the QSC speakers are more for music/concerts from what I see in their website and reviews. I might be wrong

 

[shadyJ]

I feel that the QSC speakers are more for music/concerts from what I see in their website and reviews. I might be wrong

They come from a line that was intended for live sound reinforcement alone, but they are so good that they can be used in a variety of applications. I can tell you they would do better in a dedicated theater room than many home audio speakers.

 

[2channel lover]

The dual price package on the PB13 is 1800 each, 3600 together. That is still a lot of dough. For that kind of dosh, I would go for three PC12-Plus subs. The cylinder subs are a lot easier to use than the box subs.

I didn't read that very well.

If he did spend the $3600 on subs, $2k for an AVR, $550, Oppo 203, $2700 on SVS Ultra towers/CC, $540 Prime Satellite rears x 4, and $300 on 4 in ceiling...he'd tap out around $10k.

 

[2channel lover]

Guys!!

I repeat, the budget is 10k for the speakers/subs/receiver! Stop being confuse!

Okay...I think I got it now....I trust that you have a source already...lol.

Speaking in terms of USDs...I still think one PB16 @ $2500 is not the way to the go. It's pretty clear to me now that you want a kick a-- HT system if you're even entertaining a PB16.

At one point I was when I much younger and played everything loud, and the thinnish highs appealed to me. A lot has changed in my music tastes, a lot more varied now and I've heard a lot more quality speakers that I like the sound better so I'm not a big Klipsch guy now. They are well respected speakers and I'm guessing you'll be happy with them.

Using Amazon as the price reference (rounded up), it looks like you would be around $1200 for your LCR speakers with what you listed earlier (RF82ii mains $800) and that included ramping up the CC to the R62ii ($400).

A decent AVR to drive 11 channels is going to cost about $2200 (Denon 6300 is one example)...the surrounds I assume you can still get those up there, say $500 for 2 pair. You're at roughly $4k and you have the AVR, LCR speakers, and 4 surrounds...that's your 7. Add in $3900 for two PB13 subs...up to $8k now. You could get 4 Polk 70RT in ceiling speakers for about $700 and come in under budget by roughly $1300. I assumed you had a source, but let's say you don't or you want to upgrade it, add an Oppo udp203 unit for $600 and you still have a bit up cash remaining from $10k.

You could up the ante a bit and go with SVS Ultra speakers across the front, and 4 Prime Satellites, take out the Oppo and be right around your max budget...if your local SVS dealer has the towers and Ultra center channel I'm guessing they could cut you a little slack on a package deal of that size and maybe you still get the Oppo.

 

[Jhon]

Okay...I think I got it now....I trust that you have a source already...lol.

Speaking in terms of USDs...I still think one PB16 @ $2500 is not the way to the go. It's pretty clear to me now that you want a kick a-- HT system if you're even entertaining a PB16.

At one point I was when I much younger and played everything loud, and the thinnish highs appealed to me. A lot has changed in my music tastes, a lot more varied now and I've heard a lot more quality speakers that I like the sound better so I'm not a big Klipsch guy now. They are well respected speakers and I'm guessing you'll be happy with them.

Using Amazon as the price reference (rounded up), it looks like you would be around $1200 for your LCR speakers with what you listed earlier (RF82ii mains $800) and that included ramping up the CC to the R62ii ($400).

A decent AVR to drive 11 channels is going to cost about $2200 (Denon 6300 is one example)...the surrounds I assume you can still get those up there, say $500 for 2 pair. You're at roughly $4k and you have the AVR, LCR speakers, and 4 surrounds...that's your 7. Add in $3900 for two PB13 subs...up to $8k now. You could get 4 Polk 70RT in ceiling speakers for about $700 and come in under budget by roughly $1300. I assumed you had a source, but let's say you don't or you want to upgrade it, add an Oppo udp203 unit for $600 and you still have a bit up cash remaining from $10k.

You could up the ante a bit and go with SVS Ultra speakers across the front, and 4 Prime Satellites, take out the Oppo and be right around your max budget...if your local SVS dealer has the towers and Ultra center channel I'm guessing they could cut you a little slack on a package deal of that size and maybe you still get the Oppo.

Do you think the SVS ultra front speakers in term of sound quality are better then the Klipsch? Or they are just more loud? Hahaha

 

[shadyJ]

Since we don't have any extensive measurements of either, anything we could say about one being better than the other in terms of sound quality would be conjecture. That being said, I would guess the SVS Ultra speakers have a more linear response on and off axis than the RF-82s. Supposedly, the Klipsch Reference Premiere series has a better response than the RF series.

 

[2channel lover]

Do you think the SVS ultra front speakers in term of sound quality are better then the Klipsch? Or they are just more loud? Hahaha

Good question...I've heard Klipsch speakers, several models, but have not heard the SVS speakers.

@Pogre has the SVS towers and I want to say he has demoed floor standing Klipsch...he might have better insight.

There are some reviews out there on the SVS Ultra towers...google those and see what those are like in the meantime.

 

[Pogre]

Do you think the SVS ultra front speakers in term of sound quality are better then the Klipsch? Or they are just more loud? Hahaha

In my experience, yes. You will get better sound quality from the Ultras. I say this having not heard some of Klipsch's upper tier speakers, but from what I have heard, I'd go with SVS every time.

 

[everettT]

Since I've only added some semi advice, I'll do a little more. If it were me I'd look at JTR Speakers for the sub, front 3 and surrounds. Then some less expensive for the .4 that have higher dynamic range. Pro amps and x4300 denon or Marantz 6011. RMK doesn't post much, but his opinion on SQ for the JTRs versus what he replaced, Reval Salon2s speaks volumes. Call Jeff give him your room info and expectations and he will steer you right. I only made my previous comments based on what you were looking at.

 

[Mitchibo]

Jhon, I started off with Denon and klipsch in my quest to become an audioholic. Looks like you have enough scratch to cover your goal. I'd go with the higher end Denon. More channels, more pre-outs in the back which you can use later. I had a set of RF82's. If you haven't heard them before just be aware that new ones will sound a bit harsh, metallic. They will break in and that seems to go away. I upgraded to the klipsch heresy IIIs.
My advice is to get the best center channel (RC-450C is on sale) and subs (yes two, the Denon has two independent sub outs) you can afford. I used to run a single RSW10 in my 9.1 setup. After much reading here and on the klipsch forum I bought two R112's. Oh my! A big 'ol difference. I have two more on order. If you have a large room (and it seems like you do) get large subs. You'll need it. Don't do like I did for years and run a puny little 10-er. You'll only end up spending that $$ on better ones soon and it will sit in your office with a potted plant on it. Useless.
I also have 4 bouncy (atmos reflective) speakers in a 8 ft ceiling room. They are fine but if you don't mind crawling in the attic to wire dedicated ones then by all means do so. Relying on direct energy vs. reflective sound is better. This is simple physics.
I'm newer here too and all these dudes seem to know their stuff. There is a world of info here. Please keep us posted. Thank you and good night. God speed Jhon Glenn.

 

[Jhon]

Alright I think I have made my decision

2 x Klipsch RF-7 ii
1 x Klipsch RC64 ii
2 x SVS PB13
4 x Klipsch RP-160M or can i just go something cheaper? R-15M instead?
4 x KlipschCDT5650 C ii or again can i just go for cheaper? like CDT3650 C ii?

I didn't want to change to SVS whole system since I can get a pretty good deal on Klipsch (discount) and other brand is hard to get in store in Montreal.

Now for the Receiver, I am debating between Denon X4300H, X6300H or Marantz SR7011 or SR6021.
The advantage of Denon X6300H is that it can run the whole 7.1.4 but I am not sure if the power will be enough. I am open for suggestion and which Receiver is best to drive those Klipsch.

 

[Jhon]

Jhon, I started off with Denon and klipsch in my quest to become an audioholic. Looks like you have enough scratch to cover your goal. I'd go with the higher end Denon. More channels, more pre-outs in the back which you can use later. I had a set of RF82's. If you haven't heard them before just be aware that new ones will sound a bit harsh, metallic. They will break in and that seems to go away. I upgraded to the klipsch heresy IIIs.
My advice is to get the best center channel (RC-450C is on sale) and subs (yes two, the Denon has two independent sub outs) you can afford. I used to run a single RSW10 in my 9.1 setup. After much reading here and on the klipsch forum I bought two R112's. Oh my! A big 'ol difference. I have two more on order. If you have a large room (and it seems like you do) get large subs. You'll need it. Don't do like I did for years and run a puny little 10-er. You'll only end up spending that $$ on better ones soon and it will sit in your office with a potted plant on it. Useless.
I also have 4 bouncy (atmos reflective) speakers in a 8 ft ceiling room. They are fine but if you don't mind crawling in the attic to wire dedicated ones then by all means do so. Relying on direct energy vs. reflective sound is better. This is simple physics.
I'm newer here too and all these dudes seem to know their stuff. There is a world of info here. Please keep us posted. Thank you and good night. God speed Jhon Glenn.

Wow dude, thanks for all the info. You helped a lot. I really appreciate it.

If you say RF82 and RC450C are good, I will be even better with the RD-7 ii and RC64 ii set up. If you just could help me chose the right atmos speaker for the ceiling I would appreciate it.

As for the receiver, I guess Denon X6300H would be the best choise from what I read in your comments.

Thanks again! and to everyone!

 

[shadyJ]

Alright I think I have made my decision

2 x Klipsch RF-7 ii
1 x Klipsch RC64 ii
2 x SVS PB13
4 x Klipsch RP-160M or can i just go something cheaper? R-15M instead?
4 x KlipschCDT5650 C ii or again can i just go for cheaper? like CDT3650 C ii?

I didn't want to change to SVS whole system since I can get a pretty good deal on Klipsch (discount) and other brand is hard to get in store in Montreal.

Now for the Receiver, I am debating between Denon X4300H, X6300H or Marantz SR7011 or SR6021.
The advantage of Denon X6300H is that it can run the whole 7.1.4 but I am not sure if the power will be enough. I am open for suggestion and which Receiver is best to drive those Klipsch.

R-15M speakers would do just fine in a surround role, you could use those as easily as the RP-160M speakers. In fact, it might be better since they will be easier to mount. You can probably go with less expensive ceiling speakers too without much of a penalty.

As for receivers, in a system like your are thinking about, I would get some external amplification regardless of what receiver you get. You will be pulling a lot of current through its amplifier section. It is going to get hot. Thankfully the Klipsch speakers are a bit more efficient than most, but if it were me, I would feel more secure with an external amplifier pulling those duties. You might just think about getting a processor instead of an AVR for a system like that, and getting some standalone amplifiers.

For the subs, two PB13s will be very good. If it were me, I would get three PC12-Plus subwoofers, which look like the highest value for performance in SVS's line up. That would cost as much as two PB13s and probably give you a little bit better performance. They would also be much easier to handle. The PB13s are very heavy and difficult to get a grip on. You will need twp people to pick that sub up, and even then it is not easy. The cylinder subs from SVS are a lot more appealing to me.

 

[2channel lover]

Alright I think I have made my decision

2 x Klipsch RF-7 ii
1 x Klipsch RC64 ii
2 x SVS PB13
4 x Klipsch RP-160M or can i just go something cheaper? R-15M instead?
4 x KlipschCDT5650 C ii or again can i just go for cheaper? like CDT3650 C ii?

I didn't want to change to SVS whole system since I can get a pretty good deal on Klipsch (discount) and other brand is hard to get in store in Montreal.

Now for the Receiver, I am debating between Denon X4300H, X6300H or Marantz SR7011 or SR6021.
The advantage of Denon X6300H is that it can run the whole 7.1.4 but I am not sure if the power will be enough. I am open for suggestion and which Receiver is best to drive those Klipsch.

RF7...I think you'd be fine with the RF82 with those subs, but I'm all in on the larger speaker. I keep going back to music because that's where I'm grounded, but IIRC your usage is more movies. If so, I like the move to the RC64 even more. Just a quick eyeball you might be over $10k, but if you can swing it, do it.

Surrounds...go cheaper. For surrounds I have a pair of RBH R5Bi...$200, for movies, they are great.

AVR...If you go with anything other than the 6300 you're going to need an auxiliary amp to power all 11 channels....as much as I prefer separates, I think the prudent play here is to get the 6300 and call it a day. Being a music guy, I'd be tempted to buy the 4300 then get two Outlaw monoblocks and use those to power the L&R speakers.

Atmos...I'm sure your local dealer will have a decent in ceiling speaker.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Looks like a plan coming together. I'll just add that I still like the 4300 with an amp as I still think it makes the most sense. I'm not super familiar with the klipsch lineup but the 7's get some love and I would absolutely not back off on surround speakers, but the atmos speakers could take a step down if necessary. I also like shadys suggestion of the pc12plus(3). Great value and the performance isn't miles away from the ultra. And with 3, you should be set. Not the be all end all but good value. Fwiw, I try not to prioritize movies over music or vice versa. A great system should be able to do it all. Looks like you'll be well prepared for both.

 

[2channel lover]

Looks like a plan coming together. I'll just add that I still like the 4300 with an amp as I still think it makes the most sense. I'm not super familiar with the klipsch lineup but the 7's get some love and I would absolutely not back off on surround speakers, but the atmos speakers could take a step down if necessary. I also like shadys suggestion of the pc12plus(3). Great value and the performance isn't miles away from the ultra. And with 3, you should be set. Not the be all end all but good value. Fwiw, I try not to prioritize movies over music or vice versa. A great system should be able to do it all. Looks like you'll be well prepared for both.

Agreed...even though I do prioritize music, but have always felt if I covered the music well, I'm covering movies particularly if I paid special attention to the CC.

You just threw out something that makes me wonder though if I'm missing something. Surrounds...I went with R5Bi for side surrounds...they seems to be great from what I can tell for movies, but for the mult channel SACDs...some send a healthy signal to the rears and I'm considering an upgrade to something like the mini Phils.