Outdoor speaker connected to home theater system?

[Audio Newb]

Please forgive me if I make myself sound really dumb... I really know nothing about this stuff. Here's my dilemma. We recently moved into a home with 4 speakers built into the walls for a surround sound system (not sure why it isn't 5). I wanted to utilize them for music and movies so I got a denon 5.1 receiver, and currently have the speakers hooked up with the center speaker hook ups blank since there is no 5th speaker. It sounds fine to me as it is, so I was wondering if I could use the center speaker output to connect to an outdoor speaker for my patio? Would that work or would I not get the full sound outside? If not what are my other options? I would like to be able to have the same music on inside and outside, and have the ability to turn off the outside speaker. Is there a relatively cheap/easy way to do this?

 

[lovinthehd]

What model Denon? Does it have a second zone?

 

[Audio Newb]

It is a Denon AVR-S510BT. I don't believe it has a second zone

 

[lovinthehd]

No I don't see that it has zone capability, although it does have a Heos link so you could add extensions via that. If you use the center for an outside speaker then you'd need to use a mono mode or a multi-ch stereo mode to provide a full signal to the center (and if you use a speaker of different sensitivity it may be a volume mis-match issue somewhat); you'd need to go into the speaker menu and tell it to either use or not use the center channel for the on/off to the outside.

 

[herbu]

We recently moved into a home with 4 speakers built into the walls for a surround sound system (not sure why it isn't 5).

Usually, people put both their receiver and their Center speaker at or near their TV. So there is really no need to run the Center speaker wire through a wall for inside.

Do you have speaker wires run from inside to outside? If not, think about how/where you would run the speaker wires. Through a window? Cut a hole in the wall?

 

[Audio Newb]

No I don't see that it has zone capability, although it does have a Heos link so you could add extensions via that. If you use the center for an outside speaker then you'd need to use a mono mode or a multi-ch stereo mode to provide a full signal to the center (and if you use a speaker of different sensitivity it may be a volume mis-match issue somewhat); you'd need to go into the speaker menu and tell it to either use or not use the center channel for the on/off to the outside.

Thanks for your help! I don't really want to spend $350 for the heos link, so I may try the other option. When I have it playing on the multichannel stereo with the center speaker on, will I get the full music outside on the center speaker only?

 

[Audio Newb]

I probably have a weird set up...My speaker wires are all run to the corner of the room in which I do not want my TV so my receiver and TV are in opposite corners. The outside wall to my patio doesn't have siding yet so we were just going to drill a hole through the wall for the outside speaker. I guess I could also do the same to add a 5th speaker inside. Am I really missing out by not having the center speaker hooked up? What would I do for the outside speakers then?

 

[lovinthehd]

Multi-ch stereo mode should mix L&R signals into the center speaker. You need a different receiver with zones or provision for a "B" set of speakers if you want to have both a center channel inside for 5ch audio inside and 2ch (or 1ch) music outside. Personally I prefer having an actual center channel speaker rather than a phantom center but if the speaker setup you have now delivers dialog sufficiently for you....

 

[Speedskater]

When operating speakers outdoors, make sure that the AC power circuit has a GFCI breaker or receptacle. Lots of water outdoors and a mis-wired AC circuit could make the speaker wires hot.

 

[BMXTRIX]

First: If you can run speaker wire outside easily, and it won't damage the side of your house, or you are adding siding shortly, then wire the heck out it! WIRE! WIRE! WIRE! I would recommend you might want to put a piece of cat-5e or two out there as well so you (at some point) could add a security camera outdoors. The cat-5e can provide power and communication so you would be able to easily utilize it.

For speakers, you typically have at least a stereo pair outside, so pulling wiring for two speakers makes sense, even if you run them as mono from a single output, it would be a good idea to do that. If you have a large backyard, then pulling wiring for three speakers would even be a great idea. It's a unique time when you have the ability to wire a home properly.

The outdoor zone can really be run a lot of different ways, but you really can't use the 'center' channel as a solution. It's not a second zone. Anytime you turn on the receiver it would be playing audio outdoors. It wasn't designed for that, and is the wrong solution.

You can use a bluetooth receiver and a small amplifier to run the outdoor zone as a stand-alone option. You would want a volume control with that as well. You could also get a small stereo receiver to run the outdoor zone. Craigslist often has old receivers that are ideal for such a setup. Easily under $100, maybe under $50 to get the receiver setup for that outdoor area. A couple of outdoor speakers from Monoprice, and some 14 gauge speaker wire from Monoprice as well.

Speaker wire: $25 - https://www.monoprice.com/Product?p_id=4039
Outdoor speakers: $30-$150 - http://www.outdoorspeakerdepot.com/patiospeakers.html
Stereo Receiver (new): $95 - http://www.accessories4less.com/?type=&page=category&action=&id=stereoreceivers&skip_redirect_suffix=&view_id=499a8b4bc09cc679fda5d577028a9caac25177fc&mode=&search_query=&category=&thumb_sort=store_price.asc
Craigslist receiver: $25 - https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/ele/6202001914.html

Check your local Craigslist to see what is available, but we have a ton in our area at great prices from people just getting 'junk' out of their house, which is awesome for that type of setup.

 

[BMXTRIX]

When operating speakers outdoors, make sure that the AC power circuit has a GFCI breaker or receptacle. Lots of water outdoors and a mis-wired AC circuit could make the speaker wires hot.

Speakers are low voltage. If wired into a amplifier inside the house, this is never going to be an issue. It's only an issue if the actual high voltage amplifier is outdoors, or if the outdoor speakers are being plugged into a outlet directly, which should never be the case.

 

[Audio Newb]

First: If you can run speaker wire outside easily, and it won't damage the side of your house, or you are adding siding shortly, then wire the heck out it! WIRE! WIRE! WIRE! I would recommend you might want to put a piece of cat-5e or two out there as well so you (at some point) could add a security camera outdoors. The cat-5e can provide power and communication so you would be able to easily utilize it.

For speakers, you typically have at least a stereo pair outside, so pulling wiring for two speakers makes sense, even if you run them as mono from a single output, it would be a good idea to do that. If you have a large backyard, then pulling wiring for three speakers would even be a great idea. It's a unique time when you have the ability to wire a home properly.

The outdoor zone can really be run a lot of different ways, but you really can't use the 'center' channel as a solution. It's not a second zone. Anytime you turn on the receiver it would be playing audio outdoors. It wasn't designed for that, and is the wrong solution.

You can use a bluetooth receiver and a small amplifier to run the outdoor zone as a stand-alone option. You would want a volume control with that as well. You could also get a small stereo receiver to run the outdoor zone. Craigslist often has old receivers that are ideal for such a setup. Easily under $100, maybe under $50 to get the receiver setup for that outdoor area. A couple of outdoor speakers from Monoprice, and some 14 gauge speaker wire from Monoprice as well.

Speaker wire: $25 - https://www.monoprice.com/Product?p_id=4039
Outdoor speakers: $30-$150 - http://www.outdoorspeakerdepot.com/patiospeakers.html
Stereo Receiver (new): $95 - http://www.accessories4less.com/?type=&page=category&action=&id=stereoreceivers&skip_redirect_suffix=&view_id=499a8b4bc09cc679fda5d577028a9caac25177fc&mode=&search_query=&category=&thumb_sort=store_price.asc
Craigslist receiver: $25 - https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/ele/6202001914.html

Check your local Craigslist to see what is available, but we have a ton in our area at great prices from people just getting 'junk' out of their house, which is awesome for that type of setup.

Thanks for all the advice! If I am going to have to purchase another receiver for the outdoor set up, do you think I might be better off just selling the receiver I currently have and buying one with two zones?

 

[Speedskater]

Speakers are low voltage. If wired into a amplifier inside the house, this is never going to be an issue. It's only an issue if the actual high voltage amplifier is outdoors, or if the outdoor speakers are being plugged into a outlet directly, which should never be the case.

No, there is danger.
The speaker wires have a low resistance to the chassis. If there is an AC power wiring error or a failure, the chassis could be at line potential and so could the speaker wires.

 

[lovinthehd]

Thanks for all the advice! If I am going to have to purchase another receiver for the outdoor set up, do you think I might be better off just selling the receiver I currently have and buying one with two zones?

I think you should assess all your audio plans before just buying something to make sure the gear will work with not only current desires but some future ones too. That avr you have is just a minimal low price point design, likely there are many avrs that will fit your current needs but you need to lay out just what you want it to do then look for an avr....

 

[herbu]

Thanks for all the advice! If I am going to have to purchase another receiver for the outdoor set up, do you think I might be better off just selling the receiver I currently have and buying one with two zones?

No. There are limitations and disadvantages to using a single 2-zone receiver. Get a separate one for your outside listening.

 

[Audio Newb]

I think you should assess all your audio plans before just buying something to make sure the gear will work with not only current desires but some future ones too. That avr you have is just a minimal low price point design, likely there are many avrs that will fit your current needs but you need to lay out just what you want it to do then look for an avr....

Yeah I will definitely do that this time around. I wish I would've known about the two zone thing before I purchased this one :-/
I am pretty sure I won't need any other future expansions because once I put the siding on the patio it will be a lot more work to run speaker wire.

 

[Audio Newb]

No. There are limitations and disadvantages to using a single 2-zone receiver. Get a separate one for your outside listening.

What would the disadvantages be? I will only be listening to music outside, so I was thinking it would be easier to have the same thing playing inside and out. For example if I want to play music via Bluetooth off my phone, I couldn't have it in both areas, right? I guess I could use a separate device but then I might as well just get Bluetooth speakers for outside and then not need a second receiver. The Bluetooth speakers may be my most cost efficient option but I'm not sure if the quality would be as good?

 

[herbu]

What would the disadvantages be?

You have to have an analog input on the AVR for any Zone-2 output IF you don't want your Main Zone affected. (At least on my Denon X4000. Check the manual carefully for any unit you consider.)

Here's what that means. Say you have only an HDMI cable from your SAT box to your AVR. You're watching a movie/tv in the Main Zone in 5.1. Now you turn on Zone-2 using the same source. Zone-2 will be in stereo, (you only have L/R outputs for Zone-2.) AND your Main Zone will also change to stereo. (You'll lose the 5.1.)

If you don't want your Main zone changing to stereo, you'll need to run 2 analog cables from the source to your AVR. From my SAT box, I have both an HDMI cable and 2 analog cables to the AVR. Same for Bluray player. For the Main Zone, I select the input with the HDMI cable. For the Zone-2, I select the input with the analog cables.

Check the analog outputs of your prospective source units. How many devices do you want to use as sources? Do they all have L/R analog outputs? Do you care if your Main Zone audio is corrupted when you turn on Zone-2? Just things to think about.

 

[BMXTRIX]

There are some advantages to having a two zone receiver, but as mentioned, you almost always need analog audio connected from a source to get zone 2 working, and most receivers these days don't have a lot of analog inputs.

With a really cheap, old receiver, you can hook up a Bluetooth receiver, or a Sonos, or something very tech to it. If you want it in your main zone as well, you could run digital audio out of the device (Sonos) to your main receiver, and analog to your outdoor receiver. So, both places can play the same thing. Together, or independently as you choose. It would be very much like having a two-zone A/V receiver, except, the second zone has far more power available to it, and is easy to replace if it has issues, and your main receiver could be upgraded completely independently of impacting the outdoor zone.

I think the cost involved is another consideration as you really can just add that second zone for not a lot of cash if you have decent Craigslist opportunities in your area. Even check eBay for some cheap deals. Old receivers go for nothing and can give you exactly what you need.

About the only real advantage to a good two (or 3) zone A/V receiver is that I would get one with Internet access so that I could control from my phone. That would let me run things from outside.

If I were using outdoors for music only, and I didn't care all that much for playing stuff that was connected to my A/V receiver, then I would seriously consider a Sonos Connect Amp. It is a bit pricier, but it allows you to connect completely through your phone. It offers a output which can feed your main A/V receiver, and has an analog input if you want to feed it something like your cable TV into it. You can control volume from outside, pick a source from outside, adjust what's playing directly from your phone, etc. Lots of reading you can do about what Sonos is and what it offers. It really is an ideal secondary zone, audio only, solution. Not a 'cheap' solution though. You can check eBay for Sonos Conect Amp products at a reduced price.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=sonos connect amp&_dcat=168058&rt=nc&LH_ItemCondition=3000&_trksid=p2045573.m1684

They seem to go for around $300 or so. A few lucky people have won in the low $200's, but most aren't that inexpensive.

 

[BMXTRIX]

No, there is danger.
The speaker wires have a low resistance to the chassis. If there is an AC power wiring error or a failure, the chassis could be at line potential and so could the speaker wires.

Once again, this is a non-issue. This is certainly true what you are saying, but this would mean that every single A/V receiver in the world should be on a GFCI outlet, which just isn't the case.

People do not need to put indoor A/V equipment on GFCI outlets when connected to speakers or other gear located outside. You can run cat-5e cabling outdoors just fine, you can run control to equipment just fine. Only outdoor located high-voltage outlets and gear needs to be on a GFCI outlet, like an outdoor mounted television.