Advice needed for a newbie

K

KPBak

Audiophyte
I'm new to the hifi audio world and to this forum. I recently started building a really nice sounding system and my question is to go separates or not. The obvious answer is yes but the condition is that I live in a condo so I never come remotely close to turning the volume up to the point of distortion. I am trying to figure out if a separate amp will further improve the clarity and projection at lower volumes.

I am currently running a Rega RP3/Elys2 into a Cambridge Audio CP-1 phono stage to a Pioneer Elite SC-67 receiver and Pioneer "Andrew Jones" towers with audio quest golden gate cables.

I have read differing views so I'm wondering if someone on here has made a similar move.
 
killdozzer

killdozzer

Audioholic Samurai
Similar questions were posed here many times. I might give you first few info, although I'm not an expert (have that in mind).

First of all, those are highly praised speakers coming from an acknowledged constructor. Great choice.

I will only repeat what members here usually say, perhaps to save them some time. Many of them would say that even for loud listening (at least in small to medium rooms) receivers are usually just fine.

Bearing in mind you said you live in a condo (I suppose your listening room is not so big you'd need an overkill amp) and you will not be 'killing the speakers' any time soon, I suppose the advice is even more applicable.

First match, other than the obvious one; your preference, should be speakers sensitivity and receiver's power. Some members will point out that there are receivers that are 'short of breath' to be polite, when it comes to reference level listening. But if you can find one with sufficient power (and this is not too high), the rest should be OK.

Also, here, in Audioholics forums, members usually point out a plethora of options, connections, settings and so on, that usually come with the receiver making it difficult for most 2 channels amps to compete.

Separates may have some advantages, but improving low level listening is hardly one of them as low level listening requires even less power. The fact that it is separate (from the preamp I'm guessing), most probably will not affect the clarity at low levels.
 
vsound5150

vsound5150

Audioholic
my question is to go separates or not.
I think the Pioneer Elite SC-67 has more than enough guts and clarity for your environment. Maybe throw the money on some nice dual subs to improve the sound.
 
K

KPBak

Audiophyte
Thanks For the input. The sc-67 is definitely not short on volume for this area, unfortunately I can't hook up subs as I'm not on the ground floor and I'm concenicous about the neighbors (most of the time). Hopefully later on this year I will be selling the condo and moving into a house where I can stretch the systems legs then I will start looking at amps I suppose.

Until I hooked up the rega this weekend replacing a music hall USB-1 I was happy with the sound but it got so much better I had to take it a step further so I picked up the cp-1 phono stage and it added even more definition. While I should be content I want to keep making more clear and defined.
 
vsound5150

vsound5150

Audioholic
While I should be content I want to keep making more clear and defined.
Ain't it the truth is there ever an end to it. I just started getting into the vinyl seen still waiting delivery of my first turntable. Been reading a lot and didn't realize all the critical adjustments and details involved to retrieve defined sound out of those grooves.
 
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lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
If you want better sound quality, its not a receiver vs separates thing, its your speakers that are the weak link. Get better speakers before looking at receivers/amps. Sounds like you are limited to lower volumes anyways so amp power shouldn't even be an issue....
 
HTfreak2004

HTfreak2004

Senior Audioholic
Watch the video on increasing dynamic range


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
M

MrBoat

Audioholic Ninja
All of these goals you have set, the tweaks etc. I'm sorry but, you're beyond the point of being able to behave yourself with this system long term.

When I lived close to others, I got on fair terms with my neighbors to start with. One instance where I gained a fan of good music who would stop by often with beverages to share in exchange for. Most people said they didn't mind if I flexed my wattage a bit as long as it wasn't 3 am. Also, I would test them to see at what levels they could hear my system. Often times, they would inform me when they were going to be away so I could really open it up. To the people beside me, it was the headboard I had to be careful of. The music I could close the bedroom door and buy some more distance easily enough.
 
Bucknekked

Bucknekked

Audioholic Samurai
I'm sorry but, you're beyond the point of being able to behave yourself with this system long term.

When I lived close to others, I got on fair terms with my neighbors to start with. One instance where I gained a fan of good music who would stop by often with beverages to share in exchange for.
MrBoat gives great advice.




 
M

Muzykant

Audioholic
Well, sometimes simply getting along well with neighbors is not enough. I am on good terms with mine from a house next door, and they often stop by to check out the garden. But I am always very conscious of them being next door no matter what time of day or night it is. They are an elderly couple, and older folks may have trouble sleeping at night and sometimes take naps during the day. Out of respect for them I make sure nothing is heard outside the house during a movie night or a music session. Which is a shame, because I have 4 nice subwoofers at this place (with 3000 watts rms between them) that don't know what excursion is.
 
K

KPBak

Audiophyte
I am careful of the neighbours in the building. I will turn it up occasionally for an hour or two on the weekends in the afternoon as does everyone else.

I swung by the hifi shop today to pick up some odds and ends and was talking to the guys about headphones and an amp. Seems like a good way to go until I'm ready to take the plunge on a house.


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G

Got Hi-Fi?

Audioholic Intern
Switching from a receiver to separates will offer huge gains in SQ. Even from a receiver to a good integrated amp would benefit. It is not always about power, even at the lowest volumes, you will hear the differences.
 
HTfreak2004

HTfreak2004

Senior Audioholic
Remember that listening level has nothing to do with the recording. All the recording has is sound information for the player to decode for example a 15 hz .lfe channel sound wave or 12khz sound save. The frequency is sent to the processor unit then amplification is added whether from a integrated unit or separate amp. The volume you listen at has nothing to do with the actual frequency being present at the amp either. If the volume is at full mute the signal for 20 hz or 12khz is present without amplification. When you increase the signal current from the processor unit the amp increases current to the speakers for the particular frequency proportionally so the loudness of the frequency increases for the ears. Now low frequencies require much more current to appreciate an increase in the perception of a loudness change. The frequencies between 2500-5000 hz seem to be most noticeable of volume change. Now if you prefer loud deep bass then a dedicated sub normally has a separate stand alone amp and speaker which has a dedicated job for frequencies below 200 hz. The power of the sub amp is very important as "loud" deep bass can become expensive. Keep in mind this asssumes a 90% power efficiency from the amps ability to convert the current to usable watts for your speakers. My five channel amp is 180x5 all channels driven. But at 90% effective watt transfer that would be 162 watts peak. Since ever 3 db increase requires double power then I can say 81 watts or about 45% of my amps stated wattage per channel is safe power and over that is on borrowed time meaning it depends on the frequency duration that will cause a clip or not. If you spend your coin on multiple subs then an integrated receiver unit can easily power the mids and highs as the crossover points are normally 300 hz for the bass drivers high point and midranges low point and the midrange high point between 1500-3000 hz. An important point to remember is the power reserve built into the receiver amp or separate amp. Usually in micro ferrets. These handle sudden rapid changes in the volume of frequency output. Without power storage the amp would be an on demand supplier of mojo and that would be silly as the frequency changes each place different demands on available power. With reserve capacitors the amp buys time to restore power reserve loss instead of being required to produce the immediate power draw. The reserve capacitor is like a backup battery that receives a trickle charge. If you use a phone plan with 5gigs of data and buy an add on with 1 gig the device will use up the one gig first then consume your 5gigs. The capacitor reserve acts like the 1 gig plan but with more storage then the input current can supply all at once the power the amp creates must replace the reserve over the draw may exceed power delivery and frequency clipping would occur. Basically even amps work better with integrated components inside one for storage of power and one for delivery.


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lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Switching from a receiver to separates will offer huge gains in SQ. Even from a receiver to a good integrated amp would benefit. It is not always about power, even at the lowest volumes, you will hear the differences.
Nonsense. IME.
 
G

Got Hi-Fi?

Audioholic Intern
LOL. That the best you have? Where have you been lurking, audiokarma or the polk forums?
Nope, I just have more important things to do than waste my time with a no life loser troll who knows nothing about audio but thinks he knows it all.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Nope, I just have more important things to do than waste my time with a no life loser troll who knows nothing about audio but thinks he knows it all.
You come in here today and post a few nonsensical things about wire and electronics and I'm the troll?
 
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