Klipsch has made me a believer! But I have a question?

[lsiberian]

It's a well established size for a sealed box for this driver. Here's the testing with the same driver/box size http://www.data-bass.com/data?page=system&id=90 Building a sealed usually can work with a range of box sizes, this driver actually will do a bit better with 6 cuft rather than 4 ish net as I'm using (you calculate internal volume less bracing and the volume of the driver in the box).

You generally model a sub with appropriate software and the driver's T/S (Thiele/Small) parameters (like WinISD for example), especially important for a ported/vented sub for proper dims and port/vent sizing. Most of us copy a proven design.

It's important to understand that if you want maximum performance a sealed sub is not your best option. Sealed subs are best if you want to limit the size of your sub for aesthetics or if you living in a dwelling like an apartment were having a deep sub could cause problems with the neighbors or others you live with. If you can swing it I strongly suggest using a ported sub. I realize I myself use a sealed sub, but that's because I live in an apartment. Sealed subs are of course much easier to build. I could put one together in less than a day and I'm sure you could as well.

Either will be better than any Klipsch sub I'm familiar with.

 

[lovinthehd]

It's important to understand that if you want maximum performance a sealed sub is not your best option. Sealed subs are best if you want to limit the size of your sub for aesthetics or if you living in a dwelling like an apartment were having a deep sub could cause problems with the neighbors or others you live with. If you can swing it I strongly suggest using a ported sub. I realize I myself use a sealed sub, but that's because I live in an apartment. Sealed subs are of course much easier to build. I could put one together in less than a day and I'm sure you could as well.

Either will be better than any Klipsch sub I'm familiar with.

Depends how many subs you're talking about, I totally agree with you for a single sub. Heck subs in apartments wouldn't work for me even with one sub (among other reasons, particularly noise related, that I can't stand apartment living and haven't for the last 36 years).

Maximum performance from sealed requires multiples to make up for some of the advantages of a smaller number of ported as well as the details of the room you're running them in. A single sealed sub can do quite well in a small sealed room. Larger rooms, particularly those that aren't even sealed, you need more sub. I'm running 3 x 18" sealed and a dual-opposed 15" sealed for now, the DO 15 to be replaced by a DO 18 (sealed), my space the subs sees is about 6500 cuft (living room plus big opening to dining/kitchen area).

As to what the hell punchy theater bass means I have no idea but it doesn't sound particularly good. I get great bass performance from my subs, though. Without knowing details of the room you are trying to use a sub in, hard to know what sub(s) might get you to the best levels of performance since your room is a great part of the equation for subs....

 

[KlipschFTW]

It's important to understand that if you want maximum performance a sealed sub is not your best option. Sealed subs are best if you want to limit the size of your sub for aesthetics or if you living in a dwelling like an apartment were having a deep sub could cause problems with the neighbors or others you live with. If you can swing it I strongly suggest using a ported sub. I realize I myself use a sealed sub, but that's because I live in an apartment. Sealed subs are of course much easier to build. I could put one together in less than a day and I'm sure you could as well.

Either will be better than any Klipsch sub I'm familiar with.

Thank you so much for your help man, I've been browsing around the DIY section and really have fell in love with the box you showed me (I think it looks sleek) so now the sub you showed me wouldmt be for that box (I don't think). I'm really having trouble picking a driver and a amp because I can't see which one is better rated etc. etc.

 

[KlipschFTW]

Depends how many subs you're talking about, I totally agree with you for a single sub. Heck subs in apartments wouldn't work for me even with one sub (among other reasons, particularly noise related, that I can't stand apartment living and haven't for the last 36 years).

Maximum performance from sealed requires multiples to make up for some of the advantages of a smaller number of ported as well as the details of the room you're running them in. A single sealed sub can do quite well in a small sealed room. Larger rooms, particularly those that aren't even sealed, you need more sub. I'm running 3 x 18" sealed and a dual-opposed 15" sealed for now, the DO 15 to be replaced by a DO 18 (sealed), my space the subs sees is about 6500 cuft (living room plus big opening to dining/kitchen area).

As to what the hell punchy theater bass means I have no idea but it doesn't sound particularly good. I get great bass performance from my subs, though. Without knowing details of the room you are trying to use a sub in, hard to know what sub(s) might get you to the best levels of performance since your room is a great part of the equation for subs....

Punchy bass is a term people my way use, pretty much when a action scene comes on they want to feel it in there chest? Idk if that makes sense. Basically I want bass you can feel, unfortunately I have a very big room as its a open floor plan that includes a kitchen.

 

[KlipschFTW]

You can split the pre-outs a few times without issue. My two pre-outs are then split again and once more (I have the 4 subs plus a tactile transducer).

Jesus man my house shakes with just the r112sw I couldn't imagine four! I'll have to look up how to split the pre outs, I'm assuming because they are powered subwoofers you can do that?

 

[lovinthehd]

Just use a splitter like this. Well, all subwoofers are powered really....at least any worth using. I split the signal out of the avr before the amps of the subs, whether the sub's amp is mounted on the sub or in a rack doesn't make any difference in that respect.

Imagine more like about a dozen of your subs....yep, can get the house a rockin' pretty good. Almost 5 star, still working on it.

 

[lsiberian]

Thank you so much for your help man, I've been browsing around the DIY section and really have fell in love with the box you showed me (I think it looks sleek) so now the sub you showed me wouldmt be for that box (I don't think). I'm really having trouble picking a driver and a amp because I can't see which one is better rated etc. etc.

http://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-rss460ho-4-18-reference-ho-subwoofer-4-ohm--295-472

I linked the exact driver for the box in the previously linked build thread. If you buy and build this sub you will probably experience real home theater bass for the first time in your life. It will literally dig down all the way to 20hz. Multiple subs can be superior if properly placed, but it's definitely not necessary for most people. I'd suggest trying one sub first.

For an amp I suggest a Crown XLS 1002 or one of their older discounted lines. You will need a high pass filter. For that I suggest a minidsp in a box. A fuzz is selling one in our classsified section for a great price. He's a longtime forum member I'd trust with a purchase. I also suggest using 13 or 11 ply instead of MDF. It's easier to finish, lighter and more durable. MDF of course works fine, but it gets very heavy when you start adding up all the panels.

 

[lovinthehd]

Fuzz apparently sold his unbalanced minidsp, and for the older Crown XLS amp you want the balanced version for the higher voltage sensitivity; the XLS current gen, like the 1002 mentioned is fine as it has an adjustable sensitivity of .775V/1.4V instead of the fixed 1.4V on the older XLS; the unbalanced minidsp is limited to .9V output whereas the balanced has 2.0V....

 

[markw]

Punchy bass is a term people my way use, pretty much when a action scene comes on they want to feel it in there chest? Idk if that makes sense.

Not quite. "punch" comes from a strong mid/upper bass range that can be perceived without a subwoofer. Drums are a good example of this. On virtually any good full range speaker, a kick drum can punch you in the chest.

What a subwoofer does is provide the low, low rumbling bass that one can feel moreso than hear such as an earthquake that shakes the floor or the lowest notes on a synth or a pipe organ that are below the capabilities of a normal full range speaker..

 

[lovinthehd]

Punchy bass is a term people my way use, pretty much when a action scene comes on they want to feel it in there chest? Idk if that makes sense. Basically I want bass you can feel, unfortunately I have a very big room as its a open floor plan that includes a kitchen.

I'm with markw for the most part....another large component is high spl.

 

[Auditor55]

Jesus man my house shakes with just the r112sw I couldn't imagine four! I'll have to look up how to split the pre outs, I'm assuming because they are powered subwoofers you can do that?

Punchy bass is about music. Usually "punchy" bass goes along with" tight" bass.

 

[lovinthehd]

Punchy bass is about music. Usually "punchy" bass goes along with" tight" bass.

What about "fast"?

 

[lsiberian]

Fuzz apparently sold his unbalanced minidsp, and for the older Crown XLS amp you want the balanced version for the higher voltage sensitivity; the XLS current gen, like the 1002 mentioned is fine as it has an adjustable sensitivity of .775V/1.4V instead of the fixed 1.4V on the older XLS; the unbalanced minidsp is limited to .9V output whereas the balanced has 2.0V....

Just an FYI the unbalanced is not limited to .9V this is simply a jumper setting on the board that can be easily changed. You can request the jumper setting you wish when you purchase it. You can also open up the box and change it yourself with ease.

 

[lovinthehd]

Just an FYI the unbalanced is not limited to .9V this is simply a jumper setting on the board that can be easily changed. You can request the jumper setting you wish when you purchase it. You can also open up the box and change it yourself with ease.

The unbalanced is limited to .9V output, the adjustment is for input, not output. Unless they've changed something....

ps In my post I mentioned choosing it for sensitivity, meant output for the amp's sensitivity....

 

[lsiberian]

The unbalanced is limited to .9V output, the adjustment is for input, not output. Unless they've changed something....

ps In my post I mentioned choosing it for sensitivity, meant output for the amp's sensitivity....

Thanks for the clarification. If you do plan to use a balanced only amp it does make sense to follow your suggestion.

 

[lovinthehd]

Thanks for the clarification. If you do plan to use a balanced only amp it does make sense to follow your suggestion.

Well, whether your amp is balanced or not, if it doesn't have suitable sensitivity to make use of only .9V from the unbalanced minidsp, it makes more sense to use the higher output of the balanced minidsp. The Crown XLS amps have both balanced and unbalanced inputs in any case, just that the older series has fixed input sensitivity of 1.4V. I have both minidsps, purchased the unbalanced for when I had a commercial sub that was fine, but not for my XLS first gen amps, so got the balanced version (and will use the balanced inputs on even the commercial sub as it also has both types of inputs)....

 

[lsiberian]

Well, whether your amp is balanced or not, if it doesn't have suitable sensitivity to make use of only .9V from the unbalanced minidsp, it makes more sense to use the higher output of the balanced minidsp. The Crown XLS amps have both balanced and unbalanced inputs in any case, just that the older series has fixed input sensitivity of 1.4V. I have both minidsps, purchased the unbalanced for when I had a commercial sub that was fine, but not for my XLS first gen amps, so got the balanced version (and will use the balanced inputs on even the commercial sub as it also has both types of inputs)....

How does the RCA from your receiver do with the balanced minidsp?

 

[lovinthehd]

After I got the RCA/Phoenix and Phoenix/XLR cables built I had a series of laptop problems, but I just reinstalled REW and haven't taken the time to install and calibrate the subs yet Soon, though. I don't anticipate a problem.....know of any?