Looking for Advice on Speaker Setup in my HT

[st1r1tup]

I will try and post some when I am done. I did reach out to Dennis Murphy who he said I can come take a listen whenever I like of his system. I have also located a local dealer for the Revel and hope to hear that too.

So the Revel F208 versus Phil 3 Versus CMS10 is what I plan to take a listen to this week.

Btw, the front will go into a cavity that I will build to the side of the screen area (see pic above). I will build a platform and may even line it with plywood (I don't know if that makes sense but if it doesn't hurt I will do it). I will cushion all around the speaker box itself with insulation to reduce vibration transfer to the walls.

 

[Cosmic Char]

I wouldn't bury your speakers in a cabinet. It might distort the sound. Ask Dennis about it when you see him. You will be blow away by the differences in the F208 and Phil's compared to the CM10's. To me, there was no comparison between the F208 and the CM10. However, this is a bit of an unfair comparison, as the 2 speakers are in different classes and sizes.

 

[st1r1tup]

I see. That is a such bummer because I designed the entire space for an in-wall speaker system and decided on the floor standing after the fact. I didn't make room for a speaker system that will not be buried. Perhaps the Phil 3 or Revel will be more useful in my basement rec area which is about four times the HT space and is fully open. Will the fact that I intend to have a wired LFE in each seat compensate for the in-cabinet speaker faux pas?

 

[Cosmic Char]

Ask Dennis, he would be your best source. He will be able to steer you in the right direction.

 

[TheWarrior]

I see. That is a such bummer because I designed the entire space for an in-wall speaker system and decided on the floor standing after the fact. I didn't make room for a speaker system that will not be buried. Perhaps the Phil 3 or Revel will be more useful in my basement rec area which is about four times the HT space and is fully open. Will the fact that I intend to have a wired LFE in each seat compensate for the in-cabinet speaker faux pas?

You don't want any speaker inside of a cabinet! The Phil 3's in particular would suffer endlessly in that configuration due to the Transmission Line woofer and open backed di-pole midrange.

But any speaker would suffer from nasty resonances due to the sound radiating from all sides of the speaker enclosure, regardless of port location.

 

[st1r1tup]

Are there some in-walls I should be looking at suppose for the purposes of aesthetic the speakers being inside a cabinet is my only option? Will the B&W CI 800 series do for the FL/FR?

I visited a friend's house yesterday to take a listen at his HT and he had his FL/FL Boston Acoustics in a cabinet and they sounded fantastic. I have to admit that my ears are not as discerning. I couldn't tell what the model number was but it is at least an eight year old speakers.

 

[TheWarrior]

Are there some in-walls I should be looking at suppose for the purposes of aesthetic the speakers being inside a cabinet is my only option? Will the B&W CI 800 series do for the FL/FR?

I visited a friend's house yesterday to take a listen at his HT and he had his FL/FL Boston Acoustics in a cabinet and they sounded fantastic. I have to admit that my ears are not as discerning. I couldn't tell what the model number was but it is at least an eight year old speakers.

My best advice would be to go out and hear as much as you can before throwing down your hard earned money.

In comparison to a speaker like the Phil 3's, just about any Boston Acoustics speaker (in a cabinet or not) would sound mediocre at best. That's not 'diss-ing' your friends speakers, I am sure they sound lovely.

But there in lies the question, are you a casual listener that would use this for background music, or do you want to hear every last detail within a recording? Do you see the value in having that kind of quality at home?

 

[st1r1tup]

I visited Dennis Murphy over the weekend to take a listen to his Phil 3's and they sounded great. They go very low and come out clean. Dennis was supper nice and explained his speakers to me at length. According to him the issue with the Phil 3 and my setup is that I need a sub but the Phil 3s weren't designed to be used that way. He felt it would be a waste if I were to use the Phil 3s in that configuration. He said his slims will work for what I want to do, unfortunately he didn't have a pair for me to listen to and I don't think I can buy anything I don't have a firsthand experience with. He also echoed the limitation associated with the speaker in the cabinet idea


The speakers will be used exclusively for watching movies. I have two other large areas in my house where we listen to music. My living room is twice the size of my HT room and the rec room is at least three times as large so I will consider the Phil 3s for those areas.



I have an appointment to audition the Revel F208 on Friday. I think the dealer sells other speakers too so I may check whatever comparable ones he has.


I am considering cutting into the columns on either side of screen area (see pics above) such that there is about a six feet of space between the top and bottom halves to address the in cabinet issue. It will not give me the look I was going for but perhaps I could use speaker material to fabricate a sort of false wall or something. Anyways, that is the update

 

[herbu]

He felt it would be a waste if I were to use the Phil 3s in that configuration.

Ahhhh. Very practical advice, as always, from Dennis.
Phil 3s w/ subs are "a waste" just like a separate amp... yet most of us have one.

I have 2 Phil 3s for my fronts, and 2 big subs. The Phils do most of the music duty, and the subs supplement movies/TV. I can say it sounds great to me. Is it overkill? Maybe. Are a separate Living Room, Rec Room and Living Room overkill? Is a car that will go 120mph overkill?

This is an audiophile forum. People here relish in audio overkill. While Phil 3s AND subs may be overkill, I can tell you they are very pleasurable! (And it's fun to play w/ the crossover down to 30-40Hz.)

Edit: One more note. Consider the "Direct" function. It turns your L/R to "Large" and cuts out your subs. For music, especially with a little volume, it is the cleanest sound. But it's only good IF your L/R can handle the lows. The lesson: Great L/Rs like the 3s give you a lot more options and enjoyment. Because something is not necessary does not mean it's not delightful.

 

[st1r1tup]

I appreciate the input Herbu.

 

[st1r1tup]

Update:
I visited the dealer in my area who and auditioned the F208s and they were nice. He too cautioned against the placement of floor standing speakers in a cabinet as my design called for. He said since my architecture does not make room for floor standing speakers not inside a cavity I should consider either an on-wall or In-walls ones. He recommended Triad Gold in-walls and Totem Acoustics #5 on-walls. I listen to both and while the Triads sounded better to me overall none of them really pulled at me in. To be fair I probably had a bias against those speakers going in for some reason. Maybe because I was unfamiliar with them. I need go back with a more open mind and listen to them some more.

I auditioned the Arial Acoustic 7ts (music only) without a sub and they were amazing. The dealer said there is a brand new on-wall version (7LCR) that have just come out (not cheap0 and so I should consider that giving my predicament. He won't have them available for auditioning any time soon, maybe after a month. I said I am in no hurry and could wait if my search leads me to it. He really pushed the Rel Subs on me. He said the wireless input it has eliminates the need for cables and that is an added benefit besides it being great subs. He said the coax I had run for all my subs are not good and that I should have used twisted pairs for instead.

Outcome:
I am therefore pivoting to the in-wall or on-wall LR speakers that comes close a decent floor standing speakers.

I intend to arrange to watch at least a couple of full length movies at the house where he has 2 floor standing Boston Acoustics inside the wall cavities to the left and right of hi screen and see I can live with the limitation which I whole heartedly believe exist based on the opinions of people who know much more than I in the audiophile world but which I am yet to experience. Thanks.