Upgrade Opinions - Help Me Please?

K

kychucky

Enthusiast
What are my best 'bang for the buck' upgrade(s) are for a stereo system in our master BR? Dont want to $pend much at all...$200 tops on this set up.

Room: 13' x 18'. 10' ceiling, 2 walls have windows, 4 total. Door into the master bath.

I know this is very old stuff, but its what I got and I cant put it at the curb just yet:
Cerwin Vega D-1 speakers (on the floor, I know they need to come up on some stands)
Denon PMA-915R integrated amp
Sony DVP-NS4000 CD/DVD player

Im thinking DAC? Use the optical output on the cd player, clean that up first?
Im thinking upgraded cross overs? or tweeter replacements? I can solder and build stuff, no problem. The CVs could use some more mids.

I listen to everything but country.

Is there hope? or should I just suck it up and put it at the curb.

P e a c e
KYC
 
fuzz092888

fuzz092888

Audioholic Warlord
What would your budget be for a new pair if you were to curb these? Are you completely in love with the CV "sound" or are you looking to get a little bit more accurate sound and improve upon these?
 
K

kychucky

Enthusiast
  • The Sony has 96kHz/24-bit audio D/A converter
something newer like NAD C 546BEE would have:
  • Wolfson Microelectronics 24bit/192KHz digital-to-analog converter
Am I going to be able to tell with these speakers?
 
Steve81

Steve81

Audioholics Five-0
Exactly what I was thinking. If you're looking to really upgrade the audio quality of your system, starting with the speakers first makes the most sense as they're generally the weakest link in the chain. An older Sony DVD player may not be God's gift to audio, but if its in good working order, it'll get the job done.
 
M

Mark of Cenla

Full Audioholic
I agree that speakers is the first place for upgrade. Peace and goodwill.
 
BoredSysAdmin

BoredSysAdmin

Audioholic Slumlord
what fuzz implied and I will reinforce - your best bet for upgrade are speaker by far. tweaking existing speakers is like brain surgery - anyone can do it with an axe and get a zombie :) (or a corpse more likely), but it takes highly skilled pro speaker designer like Dennis Murphy to tweak existing speakers on small budget and actually get measurable improvement.

Your idea of TriTrix mtml kit is great speakers kit for the budget. They are no match for its bigger brother ER18s , but then parts for er18 cost around $600.it

If you have space and skills for basic DIY I don't think you'd be dissapointed in their sound.
Forget about dac/cd players. If CD player breaks - just get ANY working DVD player instead. they are dirt cheap 2nd hand
 
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K

kychucky

Enthusiast
ok.. Can I tweak these cross-overs or replace them ? Replace the tweeters? Keep the bottom end of the CVs and rebuild from the mids up? Crazy?

I have another set of 2 way 8" CVs in the basement in rehab. The cross overs look like something that would come with a lego kit.
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Warlord
I'll echo what all the others here have said. Spend your money on better speakers. Your idea of the Parts Express kit for the TriTrix MTM speakers is a very good one. Build the kit. You'll have fun and be rewarded by some decent sounding speakers. They have a well-designed crossover and cabinet bass tuning that is realistic, not exaggerated sounding.

You won't hear a difference by replacing the CD player with a different player or a DAC. As BoredSysAdmin said, keep your CD player as long as it works. I have an old Sony from the early 1990s and I cannot hear any difference in CD playback between it and other DVD or BluRay players I've had.

Also forget any idea of tweaking the existing crossover in the CV D-1 speakers. I found a thread on AudioKarma (also known as the tweaker-fool's paradise) describing someone's efforts to "rebuild" the crossovers on his D-1s. Don't bother, you will not hear any difference in sound. Most of these crossover rebuild threads make the false assumption that changing the brand of the capacitors to something more expensive will improve the speaker's sound. That is no more true than using expensive speaker cables.

It's my guess that these CV D-1 speakers are not likely to be improved even if a competent crossover designer worked on them. I did look for a frequency response curve, but found none. And I haven't heard them. So these are only general comments:
  • These are 2-way speakers with an 8" woofer and a small horn loaded tweeter, with a 3,000 Hz crossover frequency.
  • No 2-way with an 8" woofer can do mid range with any justice, especially if it goes as high as that crossover freq. There will be a large hole in the off-axis sound, and it is also possible that the woofer is already making break-up noise at that high a frequency.
  • Making the crossover lower is probably not a realistic option (without measurements) because that tweeter may not be able to go lower without significant distortion.
  • And finally, CV does have the long-standing reputation of tuning the bass response of their cabinets to exaggerate the bass in the roughly 75-200 Hz range. It creates loud sounding bass, at the expense of making the bass ring on and on. It muddies up the sound of the upper bass and lower mid range. So no tweak short of building new (probably much larger) cabinets will improve that.
I don't really take any pleasure in dumping on speakers you seem to like. I'm only trying to explain why you shouldn't waste your time & money trying to improve them. Spend a month or so listening to the new TriTrix MTM speakers, and then hook up your CVs and compare them. You may be surprised by what you hear.
 
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K

kychucky

Enthusiast
Swerd:

Thanks - your description of the CVs is what I hear from them.. need some midrange boys.. I don't have a preference toward them, just ended up with them and trying to make the best of it. I will head toward TriTrix MTM.

At any rate - I'm enjoying music again with this second system. The kids / wife & dog have the other 5.1 system.... this one is mine ;)

P e a c e
KYC
 
K

kychucky

Enthusiast
Im sure there will be questions.

Ive built a couple of tube guitar amps with pine cabinets (hand cut dovetails) and numerous effects.
 
K

kychucky

Enthusiast
... still, I don't think Im going to be able to resist fooling around with the CVs - lower the crossover point, put in different tweeter that will cover some more ground.
 
tyhjaarpa

tyhjaarpa

Audioholic Field Marshall
Like already said it is not worth to waste your time and money for those CV speakers. If you want real improvements get either new speakers or build new speakers and you will thank us later.
 
TheWarrior

TheWarrior

Audioholic Ninja
... still, I don't think Im going to be able to resist fooling around with the CVs - lower the crossover point, put in different tweeter that will cover some more ground.
Do you realize the TriTrix kit requires the crossover to be built? Given some of the remarks about changing caps and tweeters, I have to ask if you know how to assemble a crossover from a schematic? Know how to orient the inductors etc? I'm sure there is enough pics on the internet, but the fact remains there is enormous room for error so for your sake, just want to be sure you know what you'd be signing up for!
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Warlord
Do you realize the TriTrix kit requires the crossover to be built? Given some of the remarks about changing caps and tweeters, I have to ask if you know how to assemble a crossover from a schematic? Know how to orient the inductors etc? I'm sure there is enough pics on the internet, but the fact remains there is enormous room for error so for your sake, just want to be sure you know what you'd be signing up for!
This kit is a big seller for Parts Express, and many of the buyers are first time builders. I haven't seen the TriTrix manual, but if it is anywhere as good as the manual that comes with the BR-1 kit, any newbie who reads it should be fine. And I'm guessing KYC is not a total newbie.

Guide for Coil Placement http://www.troelsgravesen.dk/coils.htm
 
TheWarrior

TheWarrior

Audioholic Ninja
We just so often have people with buyer's remorse come here seeking advice AFTER they bought something, so if by being vocal about the potential difficulties of crossover building I can save this advice-seeking person some trouble, I tried!
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Warlord
We just so often have people with buyer's remorse come here seeking advice AFTER they bought something, so if by being vocal about the potential difficulties of crossover building I can save this advice-seeking person some trouble, I tried!
The OP did say "I can solder and build stuff, no problem." I guess I assumed that he understood what that kit involves and that he can handle that.

I now get what you meant. Ask rather than assume :).
 
K

kychucky

Enthusiast
I've built a 5E3 tube amp... not the hardest thing. Ive put together about a dozen guitar effects... I would be quite taken if I got the cross over wrong - but point well taken... mistakes happen, I do get confused...

I actually got the Cerwin Vega CM-80 put together today and gave them some exercise. They sound different than the D1s.. more mids :).. maybe... I put in more insulation as well. The bass seems tighter and less boomy than the D1s

I think my budget may have just went up maybe I can do $500. I think I want it to be a build... just not that interested on something off the shelf.

Thanks for all you input.
 

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