House Republicans ready Volkswagen bailout vote

[TheWarrior]

Reading 'Important Notices' (1) 'This card has been issued for loyalty, AWARD, or promotional purposes...'

And then reading paragraphs 6 and 10 make me want to tell VW, "That's nice, what about the car?"

Going back to the original subject of the thread, like the law itself, this is open to legal interpretation, and as they have not announced anything, at all, what so ever, (besides the care package) my skepticism says I'll sit on this and see what happens!

 

[ParadigmDawg]

Crap...I forgot about the fine print...they are screwing me...lol...

I'm not too worried about it. I will take my $500/$500 and use it to pay for Audi Care which I always sign up with before my second service period. Then the car will get free maintenance during my entire ownership(or longer). If they end up doing a software update that robs my HP or MPG, I will just have my next-door neighbor(Shop Foreman at VW) pull my computer, stick a different one in, chip it for 100 more HP and swap it back out before I dump it or if some gets broken.

 

[ParadigmDawg]

VW to Begin Diesel Buy Back Program - From Dealers
They're protecting their sales apparatus first.

Volkswagen is Buying Back Dirty Diesels, But Not From Owners

 

[TheWarrior]

Crap...I forgot about the fine print...they are screwing me...lol...

I'm not too worried about it. I will take my $500/$500 and use it to pay for Audi Care which I always sign up with before my second service period. Then the car will get free maintenance during my entire ownership(or longer). If they end up doing a software update that robs my HP or MPG, I will just have my next-door neighbor(Shop Foreman at VW) pull my computer, stick a different one in, chip it for 100 more HP and swap it back out before I dump it or if some gets broken.

Remember, you've got urea treatment and are fixable. My 2009 is not. I'm not taking any chances!

Your link below says that the process is finally beginning. But it further reiterates, for me, that I should sit on my care package because this move would fall in line with my 'conspiracy theory' that by accepting this package, after the board meeting, they'll offer me less for my non-compliant diesel.

I do not, yet, feel comfortable in giving up my right to trial by jury!

 

[ParadigmDawg]

Remember, you've got urea treatment and are fixable. My 2009 is not. I'm not taking any chances!

Your link below says that the process is finally beginning. But it further reiterates, for me, that I should sit on my care package because this move would fall in line with my 'conspiracy theory' that by accepting this package, after the board meeting, they'll offer me less for my non-compliant diesel.

I do not, yet, feel comfortable in giving up my right to trial by jury!

I hear you man. I treat cars as disposable so I just don't worry too much about it. Don't get me wrong, if I can somehow get something from Audi for free...I will take it. My dealer also takes really good care of me. If I wanted to dump the car right now, he would take it and get me in something else with nothing lost but it would have to be another Audi.

 

[ParadigmDawg]

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-volkswagen-emissions-idUSKCN0VY29M

 

[TheWarrior]

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-volkswagen-emissions-idUSKCN0VY29M

I know you've got an Audi, but their model lines are well respected beyond TDI. VW was set to surpass everyone as top selling US manufacturer. My dealership is barren, and has nothing but trade ins out front.

When you consider what this thread was originally about, the 'bail out' if you will, since they aren't getting it, do you think they are simply obligated to hold out til their annual board meeting to announce they are pulling out of the US? Is the 'brand image' damage irreparable?

I mean come on, its supposed to be an affordable car, but you have $300 bulb changes due to the front end needing to be taken off, and battery's that can't simply be changed due to their needing to be programmed to the ECM, and now are also just as polluting as anything else..... sorry, what product were you trying to sell again, VW?

 

[ParadigmDawg]

D

I know you've got an Audi, but their model lines are well respected beyond TDI. VW was set to surpass everyone as top selling US manufacturer. My dealership is barren, and has nothing but trade ins out front.

When you consider what this thread was originally about, the 'bail out' if you will, since they aren't getting it, do you think they are simply obligated to hold out til their annual board meeting to announce they are pulling out of the US? Is the 'brand image' damage irreparable?

I mean come on, its supposed to be an affordable car, but you have $300 bulb changes due to the front end needing to be taken off, and battery's that can't simply be changed due to their needing to be programmed to the ECM, and now are also just as polluting as anything else..... sorry, what product were you trying to sell again, VW?

Difficult call but I think they can survive in the US market. 2 years from now no one will care about this any longer.

I was just at my Audi Dealer as it is a good place to grab free snacks and Espresso while I do conference calls. (They don't mind as this is how they got me to trade in my 2013 Q5 and get a 2015 Q5) They had a lot of customers and more new cars then I have ever seen there. They brought in a bunch of the higher end cars like several R8's and every "S" they make. Hell...I dang near started negotiating on a R8 but my wife would kill me...lol...

 

[jinjuku]

I do not, yet, feel comfortable in giving up my right to trial by jury!

This isn't an agreement with VW. It's an agreement with MetaBank.

 

[TheWarrior]

This isn't an agreement with VW. It's an agreement with MetaBank.

It doesn't read like a normal card holder agreement, it is far too VW specific.

At the top, 'Important Notices' #1: ...has been issued for loyalty, AWARD, or promotional purposes.

I'm not an attorney, but this doesn't feel right. And as I am 1 of 50k with the DPF issue which appears to be unresolvable, I want nothing keeping me from a VW buy back!

And if it's all good anyway, the card is valid for a while...

 

[jinjuku]

Steve Lehto of Jalopnik/Opposite Lock (a lemon law attorney) commented on this and there is no issue. The agreement is strictly Meta Bank.

 

[Steve81]

BTW, 46+mpg is still significantly less than the EPA rating. The EPA rating on a Prius is 54mpg city, 50 mpg highway

FWIW, 46mpg vs 54mpg really isn't a significant difference in fuel economy, despite the apparent gap in mpg making it appear that way. A more useful way to compare the difference is to look at fuel consumed for distance traveled. Over 10,000 miles, a 54mpg car would consume about 185 gallons of gas, versus 217 gallons for a 46mpg car. Needless to say, that 32 gallon gap at $2-3 a gallon doesn't amount to much.

Not convinced? Let's to another comparison, this time between a 25mpg vehicle and a 23mpg vehicle. Over the same 10,000 miles, the 25mpg car will need 400 gallons of gas versus 435 gallons for the 23mpg vehicle. Strangely enough, the gap in fuel consumed is almost exactly the same, in spite of there being only a 2mpg difference.

 

[jinjuku]

FWIW, 46mpg vs 54mpg really isn't a significant difference in fuel economy, despite the apparent gap in mpg making it appear that way. A more useful way to compare the difference is to look at fuel consumed for distance traveled. Over 10,000 miles, a 54mpg car would consume about 185 gallons of gas, versus 217 gallons for a 46mpg car. Needless to say, that 32 gallon gap at $2-3 a gallon doesn't amount to much.

Not convinced? Let's to another comparison, this time between a 25mpg vehicle and a 23mpg vehicle. Over the same 10,000 miles, the 25mpg car will need 400 gallons of gas versus 435 gallons for the 23mpg vehicle. Strangely enough, the gap in fuel consumed is almost exactly the same, in spite of there being only a 2mpg difference.

54/45 = 12% loss.

Wake up one day and log onto your banking website and see your bank account down by 12%.

You'll be unhappy at the least.

 

[Steve81]

54/45 = 12% loss.

It's even more than that, the but the point is at such high mpg's it doesn't really matter as much. For a more extreme example, consider a 200mpg vehicle, 100mpg vehicle, 10mpg vehicle, and 9.5mpg vehicle. On the face of it, the difference between 200mpg and 100mpg is absolutely huge, while the difference between 10mpg and 9.5mpg is matter of rounding. Looking at actual fuel consumed over 10,000 miles though, you're using 50, 100, 1000, and 1052 gallons of gas respectively.

 

[jinjuku]

Just providing a perspective that is is based on the percentages and not the scale.

If you have $10 million in the bank and lose 50% you still have a lot.

If you have only $1K in the bank and you lose 10% you have a problem.

Just trying to remove that perspective and keep it to the math/measurements.

 

[Chu Gai]

FWIW, 46mpg vs 54mpg really isn't a significant difference in fuel economy, despite the apparent gap in mpg making it appear that way. A more useful way to compare the difference is to look at fuel consumed for distance traveled. Over 10,000 miles, a 54mpg car would consume about 185 gallons of gas, versus 217 gallons for a 46mpg car. Needless to say, that 32 gallon gap at $2-3 a gallon doesn't amount to much.

Not convinced? Let's to another comparison, this time between a 25mpg vehicle and a 23mpg vehicle. Over the same 10,000 miles, the 25mpg car will need 400 gallons of gas versus 435 gallons for the 23mpg vehicle. Strangely enough, the gap in fuel consumed is almost exactly the same, in spite of there being only a 2mpg difference.

The reduced mileage is going to cost you about 16 medium coffee frappucinno's at StarBuck's.

 

[jinjuku]

That and trade-in / resale is crap.

 

[Steve81]

Just providing a perspective that is is based on the percentages and not the scale.

I understand, but the difference here is that it's not about how much of a given resource you have (I mean, I'd be pretty pissed if my bank account went from 10 million down to 5 mil), but how much you're using. In that sense, mpg is an inversion of what we actually want to know, i.e. fuel consumed for a given distance.

MPG / Consumption per 100 miles
80 / 1.25
70 / 1.43
60 / 1.67
50 / 2.00
40 / 2.50
30 / 3.33
25 / 4.00
20 / 5.00
15 / 6.67
10 / 10.00

Here the absolutes matter a great deal, because the math dictates that doubling the efficiency of a vehicle that is already very efficient doesn't net you much compared to doubling the efficiency of a gas guzzler. Looking at it from this perspective also makes it much easier to understand why real world mpg will tend to vary more versus the EPA figures when you're looking at a high mpg vehicle.

 

[jinjuku]

I'm not debating that point. I'm debating that I purchased a car under fraudulent inducement.

We have 100's of posts long threads here in that department on items costing a fraction of a vehicle.

 

[bonejob]

German cars are overrated IMHO.

A person who likes and buys say, Toyotas, typically neither understands nor cares about German cars' special appeal. They are designed for high performance at sustained high speeds as speed limited highways 'plod along' at 85 mph and many highways still have no speed limits AT ALL! And Germans drive FAST. If a German motorist has a Porsche capable of 200 mph, he WILL drive it at 200 mph! And all the VW Polos (smaller than VW Golfs and not available in North America) sucking wind at 125 mph are legally required to yield right!

They tend to have a "carved-from-solid-billet" structure and a firm and "connected" road feel with positive and quick steering response that are unmatched by cars made in the U.S. or Asia.

They tend toward austerity in their interior look, but that's just European taste. You either like the look or you don't. They aren't as reliable as Japanese appliance-transpods but they're typically overbuilt of sturdier materials. Properly maintained, they last a long time, a good thing, because German drivers hold onto their cars for longer than Americans typically do.

On a more personal note, German car interiors just fit my body type better than most American cars and certainly better than any Asian car I've ever driven; I find them more comfortable on the average.

In my experience, Japanese and Korean cars are numb and dull to drive and most American cars veritably ooze their mediocrity. They are "OK" - "MEH." And if "MEH"is all you want, they are fine. But to me most of them just don't have design, build quality or driving feel enough for 2016 kind of money. At the prices of modern automobiles, "OK" isn't going to be satisfactory. I want a car that makes me smile every time I get behind the wheel. If it doesn't, it's not worth its price.

You think German cars are overrated? So don't buy one. Whatever is most important to you in a car, find it and buy it. Meanwhile, I'll continue buying and lusting after German cars.

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