Virtualization Server

[jinjuku]

Just need some eyeballs on a proposed VM Server build. Need to keep it at $1K and at least 16GB RAM and 960GB SSD. Not going to go with traditional spinner HD's.

Thx.

Qty. Image Product Description Unit Price Savings Total Price
1

Antec Three Hundred Two Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case with Upgraded 2 x USB 3.0
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MSI 970A-G43 AM3+ AMD 970 + SB950 6 x SATA 6Gb/s ports by AMD SB950 - Supports storage and data transfers at up to 6Gb/s ...
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PowerColor Radeon HD 5450 DirectX 11 AX5450 1GBK3-SHEV4 1GB 64-Bit DDR3 PCI Express 2.1 CrossFireX Support Low Profile Video ...
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CORSAIR CX series CX430M 430W ATX12V v2.3 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Modular Active PFC CP-9020058-NA Power Supply
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AMD FX-6300 Vishera 6-Core 3.5 GHz (4.1 GHz Turbo) Socket AM3+ 95W FD6300WMHKBOX Desktop Processor
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SanDisk Ultra II 2.5" 960GB SATA III Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) SDSSDHII-960G-G25
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G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1866 (PC3 14900) Desktop Memory Model F3-1866C9D-16GXM
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Subtotal: $1,012.91

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

sorry, but I completely don't understand the point of this pile of hardware. certainly not a good fit for a vm box.
I'd go with intel core i3 cpu, no need for video card, at least 32gb ram and redundant storage.
give me more details on your idea. what exactly are you going to be virtualizing?

 

[jinjuku]

This boils down to what architecture is going to be able to host more VM's comfortably going forward.

I'll need some form of output to setup the machine so hence the video card.

Is the i3 with 2 core really going to outperform a 6 core CPU even if it's an older architecture?

The goal is for it to be quick *SSD and 16GB RAM so it's not paging bound or IOPS bound.

The goal is redundancy (RAID 10 / Mirror).

I do have an alternate build with the Dell T110 II (at $229 for the barebones server)

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Lets try again, what TYPE of VMs are you planning to run and more importantly how many
Keep in mind CPU contention is rare, memory contention is much bigger issue

Bear in mind that I am VMWare Certified Professional on one of later 5.5 and I've been designing virtual systems for a while now

edit: Then I was wake up at 4am (crying baby) - I've missing the SSD quantity of 2 - sufficient for raid1

 

[jinjuku]

I have two Windows 2003 servers with a proprietary app that is no longer in production. Also the ability to add some VDI to it in the future if they go office-less.

So my thinking is along yours that most operations are Memory and Disk IO bound and not so much CPU.

Just trying to get them the most for their budget. I know the i3 is better Single threaded just don't know about multi-threaded. But I just did see the i3 is 2 core but has 4 Hyper Threads. I thought only the i5 and up did that.

Now the i3 starts looking like it makes more sense.

I also may just put them on MS's free 2012 Hyper-V 2012R2 hypervisor.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Imo this will be good deal to start building small server:
http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/poweredge-t110-2/pd?oc=bect12baffx&model_id=poweredge-t110-2&dgc=BF&cid=22740&lid=4279737&acd=12309198376456750&ven1=12255013-227502-goo_search_Dell Small Business_1205_9271&ven3=106202816190153082
at $340 you get almost everything but storage, OS and extra memory

Performance:
https://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare.php?cmp[]=1189&cmp[]=1781

For ram : Don't go looking for gaming ram - this one is ECC and it's worth the extra for more reliable system:
http://www.amazon.com/Crucial-DDR3L-1600MT-PC3-12800-CT2KIT102472BD160B-CT2CP102472BD160B/dp/B008EMA5VU/ref=sr_1_6?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1449328070&sr=1-6&keywords=8GB+DDR3+PC3-12800+Unbuffered+ECC+1.35V

and as for SSD, sorry but you just missed the boat on HUGE sale on the SanDisks
they were sold for puny $144 on recently - Set a price alert on https://thetracktor.com/detail/B00M8ABHVQ/us/ to get a good deal.

For hypervisor software - Free VMWare ESXi should do the trick - it's good, but lack many great options which exists only in paid product

Alternatively you might want to try Nutanix Acropolis Community Edition (free up to 4 nodes - servers) - it's very awesome product. Very comparable with paid vmware vSphere & vCenter combo.
I'd deployed in lab and was able to run both Windows and Linux VMs without much issues.
http://www.nutanix.com/products/community-edition/

If you with nutanix - it would be good idea to go with hybrid storage - one ssd (500gb for example) and two hard drives (1tb each - regular 7200 sata will do)

 

[jinjuku]

The i3 version of the T110 II is $229. It's a heckuva deal.

I'm hoping the SanDisk deals will come back around. My other thread from last week was about the Ultra II 960GB being $200 a pop!

For the Hypervisor I'm comfortable with the MS Hypervisor inside and out (clustering, HA, live migrations etc...) I don't want to go and try using this as a learning experience for another hypervisor product.

I need to find out if the T110 II has Intel AMT in BIOS.

 

[jinjuku]

Yowza, the 960GB was $144. Hopefully it will come back around. What an incredible deal.

 

[jinjuku]

Yep on the ECC RAM. Saw that on Amazon last night.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

For the Hypervisor I'm comfortable with the MS Hypervisor inside and out (clustering, HA, live migrations etc...) I don't want to go and try using this as a learning experience for another hypervisor product.

I need to find out if the T110 II has Intel AMT in BIOS.

If you prefer HyperV - go with it - I know - I wouldn't, but not going to try to convince you.
From what I've seen so far both free ESXi and Acropolis are 200% easier to manage, plus proper license for HyperV is quite expensive - far beyond you budget for hardware, unless you already licensed for it....

I don't think you'll find many Intel vPRO/AMT on Server platforms, since these are desktop technologies.
I think T110-2 does support basic remote managed through IPMI and BMC
It does support TPM is need it for some DRMed software

https://www.dell.com/downloads/global/products/pedge/T110_II_Spec_sheet.pdf

 

[jinjuku]

If the T110 II has IPMI then I am good to go. The only reason the T110 II is an option is that it isn't $700-800

Their current servers are 5 and 7 years old respectively. All Super Micro all IPMI. Been at them for ~2 years to proactively manage this and change up to fresh hardware. It's been a bear of a time convincing them that if the hardware crashes the $2500 I'm charging them all in is going to seem cheap in comparison to the alternative.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

that's where redundant cluster of compute should come in Ideally everything should be N+1 or better
I understand spending money is hard to do, but how much they could lose if business is halted for days due to failed server

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

If the T110 II has IPMI then I am good to go. The only reason the T110 II is an option is that it isn't $700-800

I know a good deal then I see one

 

[jinjuku]

that's where redundant cluster of compute should come in Ideally everything should be N+1 or better
I understand spending money is hard to do, but how much they could lose if business is halted for days due to failed server

I know a good deal then I see one

It is what it is. Now I'm just pushing them to get me the go ahead before the Pricing on the T110 II goes back up.

For my part on the MS Hypervisor. I know it's in and outs, I have management scripts already built in power shell to automate it.

The only heavy living is using diskpart to setup and mirror the HD's or if BIOS supports it do it there.

 

[jinjuku]

I have everything ordered. If I can count on Dell for anything it's a confusing configuration utility.

It wouldn't allow me to switch from the 4 3.5" drive cage to the 6 2.5" drive cage with out selecting both a PERC RAID controller and at least one drive. They don't even have any SSD options.

Thanks for the 2nd set of eyeballs.

 

[jinjuku]

HyperV is quite expensive - far beyond you budget for hardware, unless you already licensed for it....

MS has a full function free Hypervisor. It's not quite bare metal. It is their Core implementation however so I think they consider it bare metal.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

I have everything ordered. If I can count on Dell for anything it's a confusing configuration utility.

It wouldn't allow me to switch from the 4 3.5" drive cage to the 6 2.5" drive cage with out selecting both a PERC RAID controller and at least one drive. They don't even have any SSD options.

Thanks for the 2nd set of eyeballs.

Generally speaking, If you pick the phone to Dell biz sales, you can customise the order more than web site allows

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

MS has a full function free Hypervisor. It's not quite bare metal. It is their Core implementation however so I think they consider it bare metal.

I know you like to tinker so despite your undivided love for MS product, do sometime check out Nutanix CE. Just find some old PC. 1x SSD and 2x hds.
Believe me - it's really good product for what it is, especially they giving it away. Unlike HyperV, you get nice central management, local storage clustering (ala VSAN, but better), vmotion between hosts etc..

 

[jinjuku]

BTW I do hear you on ESXI. But my customer will be doing some base level maintenance and they are going to be most comfortable with an MS interface.

 

[jinjuku]

Generally speaking, If you pick the phone to Dell biz sales, you can customise the order more than web site allows

I spent 40 minutes on the phone with them. To no avail.