Suggestion on a DAC

AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
you must not be enlightened because that just doesn't make sense, why would companies sell them for thousands of dollars if they didnt sound BETTER? What are you going to say next? That Audioquest K2's or everests sound the same as Blue jeans cables for $19,589 less? Lunacy.....
Good point. More money means better sound. Duh, what was I thinking? :D

Just can't defy the law of logic. :D
 
N

Nestor

Senior Audioholic
Upgrading an already competently designed DAC is a waste of money, whether one has $5K speakers or $50K speakers.


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cpp

cpp

Audioholic Ninja
I think the DAC inside the AVR or pre-pro sound as good as any external DAC.
I do know My Denon 4311 (HDMI connection used) which uses AKM DACs (AK4358) sounds different when bypassed using a analog connection with my OPPO 105 which has ESS 9018 dacs. The OPPO has more detail, wider soundstage and better bass. Same speakers and music (Yo-Yo Ma Bach: Cello Suites Nos. 1, 5 & 6 CD ) used on both

And my OPPO105 ESS 9018 sounds more detailed than my Rega Apollo R CD player which uses Wolfsen wm8742 chips. The Rega has a bit of warmth.

The OPPO105 to my ears has a lot better sound than the Denon4311. PS; Blue Jeans Cables are used.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
IThe OPPO has more detail, wider soundstage and better bass. Same speakers and music.
Probably because when you output from the Oppo, it has gone through some sort of DEQ. For example, when I use DEQ on the Denon, the sound seems more lively, dynamic, fuller, and with much punchier tighter " musical" bass, yet the midrange and treble are still crystal clear and detailed.

Oppo seems very smart to do that. Get people the sound that is better than FLAT or neutral. :D

So you don't even need a pre-pro or AVR. Just hook the Oppo straight to the amp. The Oppo already has it's own Dynamic EQ to transform the flat, boring, lifeless sound into dynamic better-than-life sound.

But you could do the same with Audyssey DEQ and some adjustment.
 
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cpp

cpp

Audioholic Ninja
Probably because when you output from the Oppo, it has gone through some sort of DEQ. For example, when I use DEQ on the Denon, the sound seems more lively, dynamic, fuller, and with much punchier tighter " musical" bass, yet the midrange and treble are still crystal clear and detailed.

Oppo seems very smart to do that. Get people the sound that is better than FLAT or neutral. :D

So you don't even need a pre-pro or AVR. Just hook the Oppo straight to the amp. The Oppo already has it's own Dynamic EQ to transform the flat, boring, lifeless sound into dynamic better-than-life sound.

But you could do the same with Audyssey DEQ and some adjustment.
I was thinking about doing that and getting me a ATI 2005 and feed it right from the OPPO. Hum I wonder if I can just add 3 amp channel modules to my 2002 ?
 
mtrycrafts

mtrycrafts

Seriously, I have no life.
Hello everyone, I'm looking to get a new DAC, I was aiming for the Benchmark DAC2. But I don't use DSD much at all and it doesn't look like it'll receive widespread use, of course that's always fickle...Anyways What's everyone's opinion of a good neutral PCM only DAC? My only requirement is that it accepts 24/192 over USB. Of course Emotiva DC-1 has been getting pretty good reviews, but what are my other choices? I'd like to spend less than $1600. Thanks a lot for everyone's opinions.
I would suggest looking at this from another view.
It sounds like you are not happy with what you are hearing.
The most responsible in that end is the recorded sound quality, the loudspeakers and your room. this is what makes the biggest differences. The rest is hardly worth looking at.
 
Alex2507

Alex2507

Audioholic Slumlord
The thing to remember with DACs is that once you get up to the $3,000 price point the sound quality just goes through the roof. Real audio advancements in that price range are often overlooked by the more pedestrian listeners because of their financial limitations and general low class status ... sh!t, a lot of those guys live in Jersey for Pete sakes. :D
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
I was thinking about doing that and getting me a ATI 2005 and feed it right from the OPPO. Hum I wonder if I can just add 3 amp channel modules to my 2002 ?
$450 per channel. You have to ship to ATI in CA.
 
GranteedEV

GranteedEV

Audioholic Ninja
I'm sure you're right about that, but it just seems to me that it's much easier to upgrade the electronics first, and get a system I'm happy with and won't need an upgrade until technology renders them obsolete, and then worry about speakers.
When your TV is showing poor picture quality, does buying a $500 remote control to address the issue seem sensible?

Because that's the sort of ridiculous thing you're approaching.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
You mean the infamous Placebo logic????????????
Human nature. :D

$20K must sound better than $2K 100% of the time. Unequivocal. No question about it. No doubt about it. ;)
 
ImcLoud

ImcLoud

Audioholic Ninja
The only thing money can tell you is how much something costs, not what it is worth... I was in Boston at a decent restaurant, ordered a steak {12oz ny strip med rare} $56 it was terrible, edible but just not what I expected for the place, its reviews, the price, ect... About a week later Im back in bost try another place, 50 feet from the first place, I order a steak {14oz ny strip medium rare} $29 it was incredible, cut it with a thin fork, tender, all kinds of flavor, cooked perfectly, one of the best steaks I ever had in my life... Now heres the thing, both times I was with a friend of mine, {a good friend, great guy, we were out there a few weekends in a row pricing some work, he does masonary and we were installing 1200 feet of heated walkways} he raved about the steak at the first place even though I could see him having to chew the sh!t out of it to get it down the entire time watching his forearm flexors struggle to cut off bite size pieces, the steak at the cheaper place he said was "OK"..

Now maybe he likes chewy, flavorless, red meat or his experience was pre-dictated when he looked at the menu and seen the prices... This happens often, my sister bought a mercedes for $50K her friend bought a 5 liter hyundai genesis 5 for $30K, the hyundai has more miles on it, drives great and looks nice my sister has had nothing but issues with her car, roadside assistance at least 4 times in 2 years, been back to the dealer an average of 4 times a year, just a troublesome vehicle, but she is going to buy another one next year and cant understand why here friend buys such "cheap" cars...
 
Irvrobinson

Irvrobinson

Audioholic Spartan
This happens often, my sister bought a mercedes for $50K her friend bought a 5 liter hyundai genesis 5 for $30K, the hyundai has more miles on it, drives great and looks nice my sister has had nothing but issues with her car, roadside assistance at least 4 times in 2 years, been back to the dealer an average of 4 times a year, just a troublesome vehicle, but she is going to buy another one next year and cant understand why here friend buys such "cheap" cars...
Irv, there's a lot more to cars, at least for some of us, than some data points about two individuals' experiences regarding reliability. I've driven a Genesis 5, and I wouldn't own it if someone gave me one. The latest Mercedes aren't my taste, frankly, but I completely understand her perspective. The Mercedes (a C-class, I assume, for $50K) is a much more satisfying drive. Most people don't have problems with them. We all have different priorities and are more discerning in some areas than others. For some people cars are appliances, and I think that's fine for them, but not for me. Cars aren't status symbols either; I don't care what anyone thinks, but I am discerning about handling and feel. Or is your sister just a status-seeker?

It is the same with Emotiva. With the exception of their basic amps I wouldn't own them. Not because they don't perform, they do, but my experience with my own CD player, a friend's DAC, and another's pre-pro, is that I'd rather pay a lot more to have better ergonomics and parts choices. I despise cheaply-made products of any kind.
 
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AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
I'm sure our tastes in automobiles is as diversified as our tastes in speakers, subs, amps, and processors. :D

Quality and reliability are salient factors. But brand, pride of ownership, and aesthetics are also very important. Where they are made is also important to many people.
 
Irvrobinson

Irvrobinson

Audioholic Spartan
In that price range, i'm pretty sure you could swing a CLA 45 AMG too... Fantastic car although the suspension's a tad too "luxury-soft" for my taste.
Mercedes just aren't my taste anymore. Here in the Bay Area they are everywhere. Like Subarus in Oregon.
 
Irvrobinson

Irvrobinson

Audioholic Spartan
I'm sure our tastes in automobiles is as diversified as our tastes in speakers, subs, amps, and processors. :D

Quality and reliability are salient factors. But brand, pride of ownership, and aesthetics are also very important. Where they are made is also important to many people.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but you dream about a Lexus. Well, at least your taste in audio equipment seems better. ;)
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but you dream about a Lexus. Well, at least your taste in audio equipment seems better. ;)
OMG, Lexus is awesome! :eek:

Reliable. Safe. Quality. Ergonomics. Service. Resale. Dead silent. Styling is not as cool as Land Rover, Mercedes, BMW, Porsche, etc.

Pretty much kind of like ATI & RBH - the aesthetic isn't the greatest or most exotic (although certainly not the worst), but it's got them where it counts. :D
 
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