Linux Guys

[haraldo]

Here we get the story of how Linux came up and why Linus started up.....

I find it very interesting, check-it-out guys

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Speaking of linux how well are proficient in it? I have an issue with home box (ubuntu 13.x server) and need help of someone to help me compile intel nic driver

 

[haraldo]

Speaking of linux how well are proficient in it? I have an issue with home box (ubuntu 13.x server) and need help of someone to help me compile intel nic driver

Been there, done that, but it sure as h##¤ is not so easy.... I was going through a lots of pain in Suse Linux Enterprise Desktop of compiling drivers for broadcom wireless and AMD Radeon video driver, not so easy to get it working.... then when SLED upgraded to SP1, it did't work, every time there was a Kernel update I had to recompile all drivers and make the stock driver onto black-list.... phew.....

I had really great help from some very clever guys at the suse forums with these things

As Linus points out in the video this trouble is not due to issues with Linux, but rather H/W vendors that simply are troublesome and don't cooperate at all...

Wish I could help you but I can't .... try Ubuntu Forums

By the way my home music server/provider for ages has been a headless Suse Linux Enterprise server appliance running squeezeboxserver and samba to serve as file server.
It never needs a reboot and only stops when I want it to..... windows just doesn't work that way.

Microsoft guys, listen to what Linus says: An operating system should be invisible to the end user
I don't call windows update invidible to the end user, no.......

 

[Hocky]

By the way my home music server/provider for ages has been a headless Suse Linux Enterprise server appliance running squeezeboxserver and samba to serve as file server.
It never needs a reboot and only stops when I want it to..... windows just doesn't work that way.

Yes, it does. You're just doing it wrong.

 

[haraldo]

Yes, it does. You're just doing it wrong.

Why?

It was running 1.5 years perfectly fine without rebooting, and then I had to stop it because I had to disconnect power .... it can run for 5 years as long as there is power ....

Or are you referring to something else?

When it comes to operating systems, I don't do things wrong

 

[Hocky]

My point was that Windows can do the same thing. I have at least 1 machine with multi year uptime, but like your example it is a special case in that it is effectively an appliance that doesn't "need" patching. My Linux machines have to be taken down as regularly as the Windows machines and it is much more frequent that something is majorly hosed from a patch or something random.

 

[haraldo]

My point was that Windows can do the same thing. I have at least 1 machine with multi year uptime, but like your example it is a special case in that it is effectively an appliance that doesn't "need" patching. My Linux machines have to be taken down as regularly as the Windows machines and it is much more frequent that something is majorly hosed from a patch or something random.

We had a windows server at work with 5.5 years uptime ... you can make Windows really long running if you know what you're doing and make it simple, minimal amount of services and stay away from Windows 7 or 8.x, but stick with Windows Server ... I actually always preferred windows server to the client version of windows, even on laptop machines

But to make the stability of long-running stable systems is probably easier to get with Linux. One big advantage with Linux is 'init 3' and 'init 5' so you can choose to run with or without the graphical gui. Windows has the same now but you can't change between the base version and the full version with gui as that requires a reinstall of windows, so it's not the same practical.

But I like the idea of running without the graphical subsystem for the server as it's a real cpu and memory hog

 

[Hocky]

That is incorrect - you can run without the GUI and then turn it back on at will if you decide you need it for something.

 

[haraldo]

That is incorrect - you can run without the GUI and then turn it back on at will if you decide you need it for something.

Aha, so they changed it now with windows server 2012?

 

[avnetguy]

I always bug my friend to stop using that server (linux) as a desktop.

I play in both camps but mainly use windows for desktop and linux for my servers/gateways.

 

[haraldo]

Well I'm stuck with windows at work mostly .....
It's been more than 10 years though since I used windows client on my personal work machine......

Jumped onto windows advanced server 2000 on the laptop when that arrived and were going steady with windows server until about 2006 when I transferred to SUSE Linux Enterprise Desktop and ran Windows Server virtualized

later version of SUSE Enterprise had driver issues with the AMD video card and wireless so then I swicthed to Ubuntu still running windows server and client virtualized whenever I need it, with an Intel core i7 8 core CPU and 8GB memory (which is max in the Dell XPS 1645) it runs quite ok, but you also need SSD to make this work

I see this as a more stable platform than running windows 7 ot 8 as the host system

If I could run Windows Server on the laptop I would consider this but I had somedriver issues with wireless lately, and well Windows Server is not exactly targeted at laptops, but for a developer/architect it's better to go with Windows Server than Windows Client platform, if you ask me

When I'm at a client, they normally provide me with the lastest in hi-performance Windows systems (custom setup for their own environment), latest I had to carry around an 8lbs HP brick.... it's just too much/heavy..... Hi-specced windows machines are in general much much heavier than macbooks.....
So I'm Looking/hoping to go to Macbook Pro when the opportunity comes up

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

I am a 98% windows guy and unfortunately I see all the signs of windows dying quickly on the servers side (web/app servers) and on the client side (mobile client)
What I have considered a running joke two years ago - "The Cloud" is becoming a reality much faster than I anticipated. That also means all of our IT jobs are in danger...
Window/Linux wont matter soon - it would be proven and running platforms delivering services.

I'm talking about Amazon, Azure, OpenStack. For smaller private/hybrid clouds Joylent provides some mind blowing solution... This stuff is the future - forget about fighting which one is best - windows vs linux - it simply wont matter soon

 

[haraldo]

I am a 98% windows guy and unfortunately I see all the signs of windows dying quickly on the servers side (web/app servers) and on the client side (mobile client)
What I have considered a running joke two years ago - "The Cloud" is becoming a reality much faster than I anticipated. That also means all of our IT jobs are in danger...
Window/Linux wont matter soon - it would be proven and running platforms delivering services.

I'm talking about Amazon, Azure, OpenStack. For smaller private/hybrid clouds Joylent provides some mind blowing solution... This stuff is the future - forget about fighting which one is best - windows vs linux - it simply wont matter soon

IT Jobs don't disappear with the cloud focus we see now more and more, they will just change, and we will and must adapt.... there's still a lot of challenges, like integrating all these systems, you won't integrate within the boundaries of your own enterprise, but in the cloud, but the cloud based applications must still be integrated. Some organizations like US defence probably is not gonna put their core mission critical data out anywhere on a public cloud.....

There will still be a job for you guys, the world just changes and we get more challenging and interesting jobs

I believe, and I hope Windows Server doesn't go away...... and I don't see it happerning really

Windows/Linux/OS X/IOS will still matter

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

IT Jobs don't disappear with the cloud focus we see now more and more, they will just change, and we will and must adapt.... there's still a lot of challenges, like integrating all these systems, you won't integrate within the boundaries of your own enterprise, but in the cloud, but the cloud based applications must still be integrated. Some organizations like US defence probably is not gonna put their core mission critical data out anywhere on a public cloud.....

There will still be a job for you guys, the world just changes and we get more challenging and interesting jobs

I believe, and I hope Windows Server doesn't go away...... and I don't see it happerning really

Windows/Linux/OS X/IOS will still matter

I didn't mean that IT jobs disappear all together - but the point is there will will be need to have onsite guys - but these will low paid jobs and the developers/architects of the cloud systems - these would be high paid jobs, but very unlikely to be populated by IT guys, but programmers instead. What we need is indeed adapt, but the BIG question is to what?

No all clouds are public - private cloud is still a cloud.

 

[avnetguy]

What I have considered a running joke two years ago - "The Cloud" is becoming a reality much faster than I anticipated. That also means all of our IT jobs are in danger...
Window/Linux wont matter soon - it would be proven and running platforms delivering services.

Not sure if this will really occur, cloud replacing local servers. Sure, there will probably be a move towards it by the pencil pushes until offsite (cloud) weaknesses are realized ... mainly security, connectivity and bandwidth costs.

For some things having data cloud based makes sense but not for all things IMO.

 

[Irvrobinson]

I am a 98% windows guy and unfortunately I see all the signs of windows dying quickly on the servers side (web/app servers) and on the client side (mobile client)
What I have considered a running joke two years ago - "The Cloud" is becoming a reality much faster than I anticipated. That also means all of our IT jobs are in danger...
Window/Linux wont matter soon - it would be proven and running platforms delivering services.

I'm talking about Amazon, Azure, OpenStack. For smaller private/hybrid clouds Joylent provides some mind blowing solution... This stuff is the future - forget about fighting which one is best - windows vs linux - it simply wont matter soon

We are polar opposites regarding cloud computing, in that I always saw it as inevitable, but we do agree that the sun is setting on client computing for enterprises as we know it, powerful clients running Windows with local files. I'm watching the US government deploy Citrix products to put client desktops in their private cloud, and I usually think of them as a trailing indicator. The problem is that enterprise clients really are an administrative and security nightmare, and there are thousands of CIOs running as quickly as they can to close those holes. So we agree, for enterprise clients it won't be Windows versus Linux that matters. The only OS that really matters any more in an enterprise is the VMM, and that's why VMWare's P/E is 45. Nonetheless, I think the tail of the deployment curve will be long, so unless you actually work for a company deploying cloud desktops your job is probably secure for a while.

 

[haraldo]

I didn't mean that IT jobs disappear all together - but the point is there will will be need to have onsite guys - but these will low paid jobs and the developers/architects of the cloud systems - these would be high paid jobs, but very unlikely to be populated by IT guys, but programmers instead. What we need is indeed adapt, but the BIG question is to what?

No all clouds are public - private cloud is still a cloud.

Yes, clouds are clouds..... but private cloud is not public, there's different security mechanisms implications for a private cloud !

It's why I'm being an architect
I believe there will be lots of demand for Senior Infrastructure Architects, you should fit right in there, yes

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Not sure if this will really occur, cloud replacing local servers. Sure, there will probably be a move towards it by the pencil pushes until offsite (cloud) weaknesses are realized ... mainly security, connectivity and bandwidth costs.

For some things having data cloud based makes sense but not for all things IMO.

Trust me - it's happening indeed even in such slow to adopt new tech sector as financial. It's still far cry from 100% but the signs are there.
The deadly combination of cloud technology actually getting mature enough, fast Telco is getting cheaper and easily could be made redundant and very reliable and most importantly weaker economy....

Companies now are much more willing to accept minor loss of SLA in return for significant cost reductions.

What I am really surprised by is all the recent NSA leaks regarding how prone to US GOV surveillance technology sector is really is no one even trying to reverse the cloud trend.

and Yes, not everything could be placed in the cloud, but this list is getting smaller and smaller every day.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

We are polar opposites regarding cloud computing, in that I always saw it as inevitable, but we do agree that the sun is setting on client computing for enterprises as we know it, powerful clients running Windows with local files. I'm watching the US government deploy Citrix products to put client desktops in their private cloud, and I usually think of them as a trailing indicator. The problem is that enterprise clients really are an administrative and security nightmare, and there are thousands of CIOs running as quickly as they can to close those holes. So we agree, for enterprise clients it won't be Windows versus Linux that matters. The only OS that really matters any more in an enterprise is the VMM, and that's why VMWare's P/E is 45. Nonetheless, I think the tail of the deployment curve will be long, so unless you actually work for a company deploying cloud desktops your job is probably secure for a while.

I'm happens to be a VCP and I do know thing or two about VMWare Yes VMware right now are the big dogs, but even they might not be the big winner in the long run unless they also adopt (and they do look in the future - VMware Vs. KVM: OpenStack Hypervisor Race Heats Up - InformationWeek )

 

[Irvrobinson]

I'm happens to be a VCP and I do know thing or two about VMWare Yes VMware right now are the big dogs, but even they might not be the big winner in the long run unless they also adopt (and they do look in the future - VMware Vs. KVM: OpenStack Hypervisor Race Heats Up - InformationWeek )

Sorry, I know that you know this stuff, and I didn't mean to sound like I was lecturing. VMW's greatest strength and worst weakness is the same as Microsoft's used to be, that it is a commercial product and costs money. For VMW's sake I hope they do better at leveraging the advantage side of things than Microsoft did.