A warning to anyone considering Emotiva products

[UrdnotWrex]

Unless I'm mistaken, none of their products have any of those listings. That was always a big issue with DS-21 about products not carrying safety certification. With the exploding cap, it would seem that his issue about insurance policies not covering damages due to the cause being an uncertified device is more relevant than ever with Emotiva.

This is excellent information--I wish I had known this at the time :-/

 

[TLS Guy]

If I were an amp manufacturer, and I heard from a customer he had a smoothing cap explode, I would be really nice to him. I would have the unit shipped back to me at my expense. I would look carefully for the cause. If there was more than a very outside chance this would happen again, I would notify my insurer. On a second occurrence I would make every attempt to locate those units and have them shipped back.

 

[itschris]

My UMC-200 would not update initially either, and after a few "work arounds", I was able to get it fully updated. I had a minor problem with my amp right out of the box as well; one that I did not consider serious, but they still replaced it. I do see the growing pains there also and it is kind of disheartening, but the gear that I have from them is working fine for me currently.

This is has been one my chief complaints...having consumers debug their products...that and a history of late or never arriving arrivals.

 

[herbu]

If I were an amp manufacturer, and I heard from a customer he had a smoothing cap explode, I would be really nice to him. I would have the unit shipped back to me at my expense. I would look carefully for the cause. If there was more than a very outside chance this would happen again, I would notify my insurer. On a second occurrence I would make every attempt to locate those units and have them shipped back.

There are only 2 kinds of product failures: Safety and Non-Safety. Safety failures should get IMMEDIATE priority from any company because every Safety failure has 2 potential costs to the company: Damages and Punitive. Damages is simply replacement of stuff. Punitive is when it can be proven the company knew about the safety exposure and did not do due diligence to address. The nature of "punitive" is that it's big enough to hurt the company. So it is just good business to address these quickly and seriously.

The sting of bad quality remains long after the satisfaction of a low price is forgotten.
Somebody much smarter than me said words to that effect.

 

[UrdnotWrex]

If I were an amp manufacturer, and I heard from a customer he had a smoothing cap explode, I would be really nice to him. I would have the unit shipped back to me at my expense. I would look carefully for the cause. If there was more than a very outside chance this would happen again, I would notify my insurer. On a second occurrence I would make every attempt to locate those units and have them shipped back.

No kidding--you should have seen this thing go. It seriously sounded like Baghdad in my living room. Could have easily started a fire, as well.

 

[TLS Guy]

There are only 2 kinds of product failures: Safety and Non-Safety. Safety failures should get IMMEDIATE priority from any company because every Safety failure has 2 potential costs to the company: Damages and Punitive. Damages is simply replacement of stuff. Punitive is when it can be proven the company knew about the safety exposure and did not do due diligence to address. The nature of "punitive" is that it's big enough to hurt the company. So it is just good business to address these quickly and seriously.

The sting of bad quality remains long after the satisfaction of a low price is forgotten.
Somebody much smarter than me said words to that effect.

Very well put.

Instead of censoring their forums, Emotiva should have acknowledged this cap explosion and asked to be notified immediately of any others. They should have stated their commitment to their products and safety and state that they would take remedial action to remove all offending capacitors if there was another explosion. Now this is in the public domain, there had better not be concealing any more episodes. If there is an injury, they could be facing criminal as well as punitive damages.

By the way, I think they need to get appropriate safety certifications for their units.

And they are making things much worse for themselves censoring their forums. That is pure lunacy. If they can't defend that they follow their warranty policies, and show how professional their customer relations are on their own forums, they don't deserve to stay in business and they won't.

 

[Alex2507]

Well, this should set some record lows for the bids on Adam's amps.

 

[Adam]

Well, this should set some record lows for the bids on Adam's amps.

That would be pretty amazing. The lowest that I remember from before was something like $0.25...including shipping. Makes me wish that I would have jumped on that offer from Steve for an order of lentil chips.

 

[mike c]

what amps are you sitting on? they're not working?

 

[Adam]

what amps are you sitting on? they're not working?

The IPS-1 hums pretty loudly. The RPA-1 isn't as bad, but it's gotten louder over the years. It's the toroidal transformers that are humming (so, not through the speakers, but the amps themselves), and they do it in standby mode or when powered up. The audio quality is fine, but the ambient noise from the amps is annoying enough that I just packed them up.

 

[mike c]

ooh. thought that you packed them up just because you didn't want to see the emo products (i do the same to brands i don't like) and i figured i could have bid 30cents. but humming? 20cents. shipped.

 

[PENG]

The IPS-1 hums pretty loudly. The RPA-1 isn't as bad, but it's gotten louder over the years. It's the toroidal transformers that are humming (so, not through the speakers, but the amps themselves), and they do it in standby mode or when powered up. The audio quality is fine, but the ambient noise from the amps is annoying enough that I just packed them up.

Stupid question, why not just replace the transformer if that's the only issue? Would Emo sell them to you and diy?

 

[sawzalot]

I decided to visit the EMO forum this morning, whilst enjoying my java, looking for more info regarding faulty units and such but the place will not let me login no matter what I do, any and every other site is working just fine. I guess they are experiencing technical problems in all areas, sheez.

 

[Adam]

ooh. thought that you packed them up just because you didn't want to see the emo products (i do the same to brands i don't like) and i figured i could have bid 30cents. but humming? 20cents. shipped.

The RPA-1 was kind of in that boat, but it was getting louder and louder, and it didn't offer any real sonic improvement over my receiver...so, while it held out longer than the IPS-1, it ended up next to it in the garage.

Stupid question, why not just replace the transformer if that's the only issue? Would Emo sell them to you and diy?

I thought about it, but the IPS-1 has seven larger transformers (probably $50-$75/each based on similar ones that I saw) and one smaller one. I looked online for some, but it never occurred to me to ask Emo. I suppose they'd actually respond to that inquiry, as it meant more money for them, but I'm not giving Emo any more money. None. Why would I? I could order another few hundred dollars in parts, have them show up, put them in, listen to the hum, and then have Emo ignore me...again. And again. And again. Uggg, I'm actually getting upset again. Time to daydream about what I'd do with 20 cents in my pocket.

 

[ImcLoud]

Why not throw them amps on ebay and be done with it, you will probably get most of what you paid back...

 

[UrdnotWrex]

Hello all--I don't see a way to update my original post, but I wanted to update this thread. After raising hell with Emotiva, I've received a response from their customer service and they've agreed to provide a replacement UMC-200. They will also generate a shipping label so that I will not have to pay to return the defective unit.

 

[TLS Guy]

Why not throw them amps on ebay and be done with it, you will probably get most of what you paid back...

He would have to disclose the transformer hum. I think people are really cautious about buying gear that is not working properly. I pay little for gear with faults. I figure my time is worth something.

I once bought a Quad 34 preamp that was not working and it was not disclosed. When I got the unit I noted attempts at repair. I fixed the unit and charge the seller my full service rates. Ebay made the charges stick on the seller.

So be careful about selling gear with problems and disclosure is essential.

 

[3db]

He would have to disclose the transformer hum. I think people are really cautious about buying gear that is not working properly. I pay little for gear with faults. I figure my time is worth something.

I once bought a Quad 34 preamp that was not working and it was not disclosed. When I got the unit I noted attempts at repair. I fixed the unit and charge the seller my full service rates. Ebay made the charges stick on the seller.

So be careful about selling gear with problems and disclosure is essential.

Good for you. I applaud your effort in calling out the rif-raf on selling defective products. Personally, I think its despicable and shows poor moral character.

 

[gene]

Good for you. I applaud your effort in calling out the rif-raf on selling defective products. Personally, I think its despicable and shows poor moral character.

Let's not jump the gun here. Emotiva is a solid company that has demonstrated their willingness to support their products over the years. They have grown by leaps and bounds and perhaps their customer service hasn't been able to quite keep up on occasion as a result. As for moral character, I've had personal dealings with most of, if not ALL of the primary folks at Emotiva and they have all been stand up people. Their products offer great value and are snake oil free.

I'm glad yet another customer service issue has been resolved but I don't like our forum to be used for company bashing anytime an issue like this occurs for them or any brand for that matter.

 

[3db]

Let's not jump the gun here. Emotiva is a solid company that has demonstrated their willingness to support their products over the years. They have grown by leaps and bounds and perhaps their customer service hasn't been able to quite keep up on occasion as a result. As for moral character, I've had personal dealings with most of, if not ALL of the primary folks at Emotiva and they have all been stand up people. Their products offer great value and are snake oil free.

I'm glad yet another customer service issue has been resolved but I don't like our forum to be used for company bashing anytime an issue like this occurs for them or any brand for that matter.

Gene, you misunderstood my point. I wasn't calling out Emotiva at all. I was calling out people who sell defective products on EBAY to try and recoop from a loss. I hope this clarifies things.