Emotiva Customer Service is Horrible!

[fuzz092888]

VanPT, glad everything worked out. You're 100% correct that it should not have come to this. I wonder if someone from Emo was watching this thread.

As much as it's awesome that they made things right in the end, you have to wonder why it takes making some noise out on various forums to get the kind of treatment he deserved in the first place. If you only prioritize people after they go out and share their story, what happens why 10-20-50 people catch on and do the same?

I'm happy for the OP since it's his satisfaction with the transaction that is the most important thing in the matter, but it just makes me more wary of the company. YMMV.

 

[ImcLoud]

I sent an email with a link so IM sure someone was watching it, got a reply saying "taken care of"..... I said I am worried about cs, since they know me and my brother and know we have spent 15K in the last couple years... I love their products, and I like their prices, I have had great luck, and will continue to do business with them, like i said I met Dan and dealt with them personally a few times, I was always treated with respect and consideration, I think they are a great family company and I am sure they will be around a long time and will deal with any issues anyone has, but like everything else where there is room for it there will be error...

 

[fuzz092888]

I sent an email with a link so IM sure someone was watching it, got a reply saying "taken care of"..... I said I am worried about cs, since they know me and my brother and know we have spent 15K in the last couple years... I love their products, and I like their prices, I have had great luck, and will continue to do business with them, like i said I met Dan and dealt with them personally a few times, I was always treated with respect and consideration, I think they are a great family company and I am sure they will be around a long time and will deal with any issues anyone has, but like everything else where there is room for it there will be error...

To me, this makes it worse not better. To me this says they took care of it to keep you happy and has nothing to do with the OP. Since you've spent so much money with them and probably will continue to in the future, along with bringing them more business with your enthusiasm for the brand, they did this to take care of a customer they deem "more important" than just a regular guy who needed some help.

Again, it's good you could help the OP, but still. The message Emo sent is pretty clear from where I'm sitting and it's not one of "Every customer is important to us." To be clear, this can be said about a lot of companies. Heck, I'm one of seemingly very few who walked away from Outlaw swearing I'd never buy anything from them. It just seems odd that a smaller company would put out this kind of message where it's not exactly a stretch to read between the lines, especially with this new information.

 

[ImcLoud]

I don't know they are pretty solid with cs from most things I hear, Irv on here had issues with his cd player {that I bought from him} and they fixed it without issue, plus a few others I spoke to , I honestly think this was just an issue with bad timing bad communication and with a lot of business it is bound to happen, just one of them things, EMO is a good company I think NEVER have any second thoughts about recommending them on this forum and to friends and family, even good people and companies make mistakes, and like I said in my other posts I am sure they will take care of the OP, and they did and now went above and beyond to make it rite, the op admits he wans't being a squeeky wheel, and me being a business owner can tell you first hand the noisey wheel gets attention before the others, it is just how it is, sure all the wheels will get greased but the niosey ones are first......... others should learn from this and Im sure this is a pretty isolated incident, we don't get many of these anti emo topics on this board, and I have noticed admin doesnt get too involved even though they are sponsors, other boards can not say the same...

 

[VanPT]

Well this thread and the one on Emo's forums in which I posted a link to this thread...;-). Like I mentioned I was mighty ticked off so I resorted to somewhat nasty measures but it got the response I was hoping for and more. The feedback was terrific and I too learned something through this whole process.

 

[sharkman]

To me, this makes it worse not better. To me this says they took care of it to keep you happy and has nothing to do with the OP. Since you've spent so much money with them and probably will continue to in the future, along with bringing them more business with your enthusiasm for the brand, they did this to take care of a customer they deem "more important" than just a regular guy who needed some help.

Again, it's good you could help the OP, but still. The message Emo sent is pretty clear from where I'm sitting and it's not one of "Every customer is important to us." To be clear, this can be said about a lot of companies. Heck, I'm one of seemingly very few who walked away from Outlaw swearing I'd never buy anything from them. It just seems odd that a smaller company would put out this kind of message where it's not exactly a stretch to read between the lines, especially with this new information.

I concur.

This also says there are some customers that they kind of shrug their shoulders at. And some others who get preferential treatment over them because they started a thread. All customers should be treated the same, end of story. There are too many threads like this for there not to be a problem. They are becoming the Onkyo of separates.

 

[ImcLoud]

They are becoming the Onkyo of separates.

thats a little extreme, I searched and only found a few unsatisfied customers, out of thousands upon thousands of customers isn't bad for a family owned company most likely working beyond their ability at times, which helps to keep their products affordable, after all if they hire more people to take care of CS that money has to come from somewhere, and it will end up getting prices raised..... I think they did a decent job with this customer, end result is he is happy, which is the end result in 99% of the cases I read, they get what they deserve in the end, I think the only person I know of that is truly unhappy and never got satisfaction was Adam, and like I said I don't know the entire story, it was before my time....

If you can't forgive a company for a >1% "unhappy" customer base, then I don't know where to send you for equipment... To compare them with Onkyo may be a little off base, I dealt with both companies and believe me, Onkyo is in a league of their own, you can call emo and leave a message for Dan and get a call back from the owner, they throw Emofest for their customers, the make products affordable to those of us that do not want to spend $4000 on an amplifier, I hate to see them demonized for 1 issue, that I knew the entire time would be remedied. They aren't a company that will just turn their back and send you back your equipment un-repaired or just not at all....
I had an issue with a sony PC that I spent $3800 on inside the warranty period and they said it was "physical damage" not a scratch on it, never got wet, and never in a cold or hot invironment, it was 2 weeks old and the power supply burnt through the case, they said I left it on the charger too long!!!! My local computer repair company was shocked, they sent it back unrepaired and he fixed it for $320 included repairing the burnt case, he said there is NO way this is broken at your fault and Sony didn't care, they sent me a 5% off coupon on a new PC, lol.... So there is always worse...

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I know this thread has been hijacked a bit and I'm totally ok with that... but I just thought I'd give an update as to what has transpired in the last few days:

The customer service department called me first thing yesterday morning and explained that my unit was ready. He apologized and corrected himself from the previous conversation we had had on Thursday/Friday saying that the techs actually had looked at my unit but did not make any notes. He also said that it was ready to ship and wanted to know where I wanted it shipped to. Now, it may sound a bit convenient that it was suddenly fixed but considering the time he called me at I have a hard time not believing him. Either way, he was very apologetic and concerned (which is all I was asking for) about the confusion and wanted to make it right.

Originally he told me I would have to pay for shipping back to Canada but not Point Roberts, WA just over the border. I would have insisted on getting it sent to my house here but was not sure about border issues at Canada Post etc. Well I didn't need to be as he called back today and insisted they pay for shipping back to my house and advised there would be no issues with customs (listed as repair unit, etc).

So, as some had predicted Emo has bounced back and made sure everything is taken care of. I stand by my previous statement that it should not have come to these measures to get this service but they could have dismissed it and not done anything. They didn't, and it takes character to admit a mistake and apologize, both which they have done.

In terms of the unit itself, it turns out it was the headphone jack on the front of the unit. It appears it was sending a signal or the unit thought the headphones were plugged in, hence no sound out of the speakers. Not sure why it corrected it self after 10 mins but I'm no techy so who knows.

Thanks for everyone's input, concern and help here. Again, glad that Emo has rebounded from the many errors and hopefully my experiences with any future customer service issues, should there be any, goes smoother.

And that's why you posted here on AH, didn't you?

Glad we were able to help you out.

If only Adam had done the same thing and posted on AH a few years ago when he had EMO trouble.

 

[fuzz092888]

I don't necessarily agree with that last statement either. However, there are some obvious flaws in your argument, logic and your math symbols.

thats a little extreme, I searched and only found a few unsatisfied customers, out of thousands upon thousands of customers isn't bad for a family owned company most likely working beyond their ability at times, which helps to keep their products affordable, after all if they hire more people to take care of CS that money has to come from somewhere, and it will end up getting prices raised..... I think they did a decent job with this customer, end result is he is happy, which is the end result in 99% of the cases I read, they get what they deserve in the end, I think the only person I know of that is truly unhappy and never got satisfaction was Adam, and like I said I don't know the entire story, it was before my time....

If you can't forgive a company for a >1% "unhappy" customer base, then I don't know where to send you for equipment... To compare them with Onkyo may be a little off base, I dealt with both companies and believe me, Onkyo is in a league of their own, you can call emo and leave a message for Dan and get a call back from the owner, they throw Emofest for their customers, the make products affordable to those of us that do not want to spend $4000 on an amplifier, I hate to see them demonized for 1 issue, that I knew the entire time would be remedied. They aren't a company that will just turn their back and send you back your equipment un-repaired or just not at all....
I had an issue with a sony PC that I spent $3800 on inside the warranty period and they said it was "physical damage" not a scratch on it, never got wet, and never in a cold or hot invironment, it was 2 weeks old and the power supply burnt through the case, they said I left it on the charger too long!!!! My local computer repair company was shocked, they sent it back unrepaired and he fixed it for $320 included repairing the burnt case, he said there is NO way this is broken at your fault and Sony didn't care, they sent me a 5% off coupon on a new PC, lol.... So there is always worse...

 

[sharkman]

thats a little extreme, I searched and only found a few unsatisfied customers, out of thousands upon thousands of customers isn't bad for a family owned company most likely working beyond their ability at times, which helps to keep their products affordable, after all if they hire more people to take care of CS that money has to come from somewhere, and it will end up getting prices raised..... I think they did a decent job with this customer, end result is he is happy, which is the end result in 99% of the cases I read, they get what they deserve in the end, I think the only person I know of that is truly unhappy and never got satisfaction was Adam, and like I said I don't know the entire story, it was before my time....

If you can't forgive a company for a >1% "unhappy" customer base, then I don't know where to send you for equipment... To compare them with Onkyo may be a little off base, I dealt with both companies and believe me, Onkyo is in a league of their own, you can call emo and leave a message for Dan and get a call back from the owner, they throw Emofest for their customers, the make products affordable to those of us that do not want to spend $4000 on an amplifier, I hate to see them demonized for 1 issue, that I knew the entire time would be remedied. They aren't a company that will just turn their back and send you back your equipment un-repaired or just not at all....
I had an issue with a sony PC that I spent $3800 on inside the warranty period and they said it was "physical damage" not a scratch on it, never got wet, and never in a cold or hot invironment, it was 2 weeks old and the power supply burnt through the case, they said I left it on the charger too long!!!! My local computer repair company was shocked, they sent it back unrepaired and he fixed it for $320 included repairing the burnt case, he said there is NO way this is broken at your fault and Sony didn't care, they sent me a 5% off coupon on a new PC, lol.... So there is always worse...

I appreciate your response, but you are doing the same thing you accuse me of. If you can only find a few unsatisfied customers, you are not looking around much in this forum alone. And then you over state the 'thousands and thousands of happy customers'. How do you know how many thousands of customers there are? How many are like me with an Emotiva component packed away because over time it simply underwhelmed you. How many Europeans have phoned with issues to only find out very little could be done without shipping to the US and it's high costs they must spend for a faulty product that was faulty out of the box when Emotiva claims they personally test every exported order.

The last three processors they released had at least a rough start with bugs. They dropped a cable/speaker wire line because the quality was just not there. they've strung on waiting customers for months and years with promises of new components jus over the next rainbow. They've bought and failed with three electronics companies. I think the vision Dan had is a long way off from the reality of today.

Their product line is somewhat of a mess with products released and dropped for stated reasons that are obviously wrong. Dan claims his XPR amps are 2 ohm stable and double the wattage at 4 ohms. He is on record as saying they didn't want to advertise this amazing feat because customers can be challenged by it and crank it up to check it out and damage can ensue. First company with such an accomplishment who won't use it as advertising. Or maybe it doesn't really meet those specs but does pretty well. They publish the numbers conservatively instead, he says.

Hey, don't get me wrong, buy and support whomever you please, but at least be willing to admit the less than stellar product gaffs and failures. Every year as Christmas production ramps up at the factory a new issue arises with the XPA amps. The last couple years it's been faulty 12 volt triggers and LED lights. What will it be this year.

 

[gene]

Their product line is somewhat of a mess with products released and dropped for stated reasons that are obviously wrong. Dan claims his XPR amps are 2 ohm stable and double the wattage at 4 ohms. He is on record as saying they didn't want to advertise this amazing feat because customers can be challenged by it and crank it up to check it out and damage can ensue. First company with such an accomplishment who won't use it as advertising. Or maybe it doesn't really meet those specs but does pretty well. They publish the numbers conservatively instead, he says.

Perhaps you didn't see my measurements in my review:
XPR-1 Mono-block Reference Power Amplifier | Review by Audioholics.com – Emotiva Audio News

or the fact that I drive the snot out of these amps with my $50k reference speakers that dip well into 2 ohms and have no issues with driving them to ear shattering levels in my 6,000ft^3 reference room. The amps don't even get more than warm to the touch.

Emotiva deserves to brag about such a feat with these monstrously affordable amps IMO.

The fact of the matter is most people don't have enough wall power to drive these amps at full power into a 4 ohm load let alone a 2 ohm one. Tough it would be ridiculous to expect these amps to double down power into 2 ohm loads, especially since in the XPR-1 case, the output stages are bridged thus each seeing 1/2 the actual load impedance.

 

[Adam]

If only Adam had done the same thing and posted on AH a few years ago when he had EMO trouble.

Maybe it would have worked, maybe not - but my general philosophy is that I want to engage with people that do the right thing because it's the right thing to do...not just because they think it will help them out. Ethics is what you do when no one is looking. If a company chooses to make things right for one customer to save PR face, they aren't doing it because they want to have good customer service - they're doing it because they want to have good sales. And that doesn't pay off for any customers that don't make a big public deal out of getting bad service. Just giving people the run around until they go away or force their hand - not a company that I'll ever buy from again.

 

[Adam]

Btw, Van - that's great news for you! My experiences aside, I am truly happy for those that get good products and service. I'm glad that it's working out for you, and I hope that you get it all up and running soon.

 

[ImcLoud]

I appreciate your response, but you are doing the same thing you accuse me of. If you can only find a few unsatisfied customers, you are not looking around much in this forum alone. And then you over state the 'thousands and thousands of happy customers'. How do you know how many thousands of customers there are? How many are like me with an Emotiva component packed away because over time it simply underwhelmed you. How many Europeans have phoned with issues to only find out very little could be done without shipping to the US and it's high costs they must spend for a faulty product that was faulty out of the box when Emotiva claims they personally test every exported order.

The last three processors they released had at least a rough start with bugs. They dropped a cable/speaker wire line because the quality was just not there. they've strung on waiting customers for months and years with promises of new components jus over the next rainbow. They've bought and failed with three electronics companies. I think the vision Dan had is a long way off from the reality of today.

Their product line is somewhat of a mess with products released and dropped for stated reasons that are obviously wrong. Dan claims his XPR amps are 2 ohm stable and double the wattage at 4 ohms. He is on record as saying they didn't want to advertise this amazing feat because customers can be challenged by it and crank it up to check it out and damage can ensue. First company with such an accomplishment who won't use it as advertising. Or maybe it doesn't really meet those specs but does pretty well. They publish the numbers conservatively instead, he says.

Hey, don't get me wrong, buy and support whomever you please, but at least be willing to admit the less than stellar product gaffs and failures. Every year as Christmas production ramps up at the factory a new issue arises with the XPA amps. The last couple years it's been faulty 12 volt triggers and LED lights. What will it be this year.

Shark, what product do you have? I don't recall the posts... I can't understand why with a 5 year warranty anyone would just give up. I know the processors have their issues but I havent seen them, I owned the umc1 and 200 and both did what they were supposed to... I have had a lot of the xpa amps and love them, when I compare the performance, the price, and the customer service to my other amps {BK, Onkyo, marantz, yamaha, ect} Emotiva is way above the rest.. A local guy has an xpa5 that hurt a channel and he called emo for service, so he didn't have to send it back they sent him the channel, a lot of companies wont do that and I like the option...
I guess until I have a bad experience with them I am going to continue to support them, I also own Outlaw parasound and other amps and processors but emo seems to be the best value and that is what I look for when buying gear..

I guess my thinking is when you do a large volume of business you increase your chances of having "issues" and I understand that, when I ran my company with 2 trucks {me personally running on of them} doing $100K in sales, I never had a complaint now with 8 trucks and almost a million per year in sales there are a lot more "issues"... Volume breeds cracks that customers can fall into, its not rite but it is the truth. If you don't want to take the chance, buy a handmade usa assembled amp and don't bother with a company like emo, but you are goiong to PAY for what you get, and chances are they wont be 100% issue free either...

I guess what I am saying is I am thankful for the emo products because I would not spend $3K on a 2 channel 600 watt amp...

 

[PENG]

Maybe it would have worked, maybe not - but my general philosophy is that I want to engage with people that do the right thing because it's the right thing to do...not just because they think it will help them out. Ethics is what you do when no one is looking. If a company chooses to make things right for one customer to save PR face, they aren't doing it because they want to have good customer service - they're doing it because they want to have good sales. And that doesn't pay off for any customers that don't make a big public deal out of getting bad service. Just giving people the run around until they go away or force their hand - not a company that I'll ever buy from again.

I fully agree, in theory. In practice though, few will do that sort of things. Bryston comes to mind but then a) you pay extra (built-in one way or another) for their 20 year warranty and b) you paid more regardess, like at least 4 to 6 times more than you would pay for EMO, to have the same power on hand.

OTOH, I also have to agree with Imc, people should cut Emo some slack if they disappoint once in a while, given the value they offer and it seems that if you have a case and fought hard enough, they would still fix it for you in the end.

 

[slipperybidness]

I had an issue with a sony PC that I spent $3800 on inside the warranty period and they said it was "physical damage" not a scratch on it, never got wet, and never in a cold or hot invironment, it was 2 weeks old and the power supply burnt through the case, they said I left it on the charger too long!!!! My local computer repair company was shocked, they sent it back unrepaired and he fixed it for $320 included repairing the burnt case, he said there is NO way this is broken at your fault and Sony didn't care, they sent me a 5% off coupon on a new PC, lol.... So there is always worse...

There is always worse, unless it is Sony.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Just buy an AVR (or any components) from your local Best Buy store (online price-match) and extended warranty and you won't have to worry about it.

 

[RichB]

OTOH, I also have to agree with Imc, people should cut Emo some slack if they disappoint once in a while, given the value they offer and it seems that if you have a case and fought hard enough, they would still fix it for you in the end.

I suspect that the ball got dropped on this one.
Going public usually permits the those with authority to get things expedited and do things like pay for shipping, etc.
Better issue tracking and escalations could deal with these problems internally.
Unfortunately, the current process seems to include a public shaming

ATI and Outlaw both handled my issues well and I do not believe posting was required to obtain excellent service.

- Rich

 

[darien87]

I never had an issue with either of the Emo amps I've had. Nothing but praise for them.

The UMC-1 I used to have, now that's another issue. I had problems with that thing for as long as I had it.

But the 2 times I've had problems with their products, (1. an XPA-5 that a local installer cranked up too high and blew up and 2. The UMC-1 that suddenly belched smoke out the top and shut down), they were both fixed quickly and with no hassle.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I never had an issue with either of the Emo amps I've had. Nothing but praise for them.

The UMC-1 I used to have, now that's another issue. I had problems with that thing for as long as I had it.

But the 2 times I've had problems with their products, (1. an XPA-5 that a local installer cranked up too high and blew up and 2. The UMC-1 that suddenly belched smoke out the top and shut down), they were both fixed quickly and with no hassle.

Well, you're AH Ninja, though. I mean c'mon. They knew better.

If I ever buy EMO, I would let them know that I am the AH Overlord ADTG and not to be messed with.

I would also show them a picture of my room.