Time to re-do my system - need your help

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davidbr55

Audioholic Intern
Hi folks,

You were all tremendously helpful when I set up my first HT system almost 10 years ago. The suggestions were so great that my system survived (and performed well) through a fairly hectic life (9 moves in those 10 years)! So, I'm back for round 2.

My trusted Onkyo SR506 died this weekend, so I went ahead and bought a new receiver (another Onkyo, this time the NR747). Researching that receiver has definitely brought the "audioholics bug" back for me and now I'm wondering if I should also update my speakers and subwoofer. I'd love your help here - would you upgrade the speakers and/or subwoofer? If so, what would you get? If not, why not?

Here's my current set up:

TV: Samsung 65 (UN65JS8500)
Receiver: Onkyo TX-NR747
Blu-Ray: PS4
Speakers: Mordaunt Short Premiere MS302 x4 + MS304 x1
Subwoofer: Dayton Audio SUB-80 8" HT Series 80 Watt Powered subwoofer

Room size: 15 x 10 (I hesitated on posting this part because this is likely my last rental and the next move will be to a larger house, so if I buy speakers, I'd rather they also work on a much larger TV room)

My budget for the speakers is ~$1,000. I very strongly prefer to stick to bookshelf speakers.

I think the best speaker option I found so far is the Elac debut B6 x4, and C5 x1.

Thanks in advance for the help!

Let me know if you need extra information.

David
 
BoredSysAdmin

BoredSysAdmin

Audioholic Slumlord
imo spend all of it on new sub - it's the weakest link by far in your current system.
After that - that auto room setup system - AccuEQ is not nearly as good Audyssey XT32.
Only way to fix that is to sell your avr and buy different one, but I don't think that should be your #1 priority.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
I agree with BSA in that your sub is the weakest link at this point and that you would have been better off with Yamaha/Denon/Marantz for the avr. In any case, with your budget I'd think about just getting three speakers, just use your MS302s for surrounds (there's little reason to match the surrounds to mains unless perhaps you're a multi-ch music fiend). I'd look at Ascend Acoustics' 170SE or 340SE models and with a slightly larger budget you could bundle them with a Rythmik sub (Ascend can bundle them together).
 
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davidbr55

Audioholic Intern
My Onkyo is still on its way to me, so it wouldn't be particularly difficult to return. The AVR-X2200W is only $100 more - worth it?
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
I'd rather have an even better Denon (one with Audyssey XT32 instead of just XT), but I'd take the Denon 2200 over the Onkyo without a second thought (and I own both brands, albeit an older Onkyo when they had Audyssey). Is your budget going up? :)
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Slumlord
Another vote for upgrading the sub. These guys talked me into it when I was set on something else and I was shocked at how much a truly good sub (or 2) improves your whole system. Might be cliché, but I heard things I'd not heard before in my music.
 
BoredSysAdmin

BoredSysAdmin

Audioholic Slumlord
Another vote for upgrading the sub. These guys talked me into it when I was set on something else and I was shocked at how much a truly good sub (or 2) improves your whole system. Might be cliché, but I heard things I'd not heard before in my music.
The point, it's not just about sub itself, it's about properly integrating one into the system. Which means using bass management to remove low frequencies from smaller speakers - this allows them to usually play cleaners and with less distortion. Selecting sub with smaller speakers, make sure to get one which could play flat all the way to 200hz or so (not all of them do)
My main budget towers rated to play down to mid 30hz, but adding a sub made huge difference in clarity of playback.
 
William Lemmerhirt

William Lemmerhirt

Audioholic Overlord
Couldn't agree more about the sub. 8" and subwoofer should not be said in the same sentence. How long until you move, and is it an apartment rental, or a house? Neighbors might not love a new 15" subwoofer as much as you do! Also the 3.5" drivers in your speakers will be useless in a larger room as mains, but maybe they could work as surrounds as HD said. Fwiw, I'm a believer in matching fronts and rears. You might be better to save until you move out and have a better direction when you find your house.
I'm all about spending somebody else's money, but you just might want to wait. How much was the onkyo?
Here's a good place to start.
http://www.accessories4less.com/
 
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davidbr55

Audioholic Intern
Message seems pretty clear - get a better sub. But, any recommendations for a specific one?
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
For subs I'd look at the usual culprits....SVS, Hsu, Rythmik, Power Sound Audio for starters.
 
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davidbr55

Audioholic Intern
You guys are bad influences. I will pony up the money for a XT32 receiver. My options:
1. Denon AVR-X3300W for $650
2. Denon AVR-X4200W for $800

The 3300 is obviously newer, so a couple of additions (dual band Wi-Fi, Audyssey phone app), but the 4200 outputs more power with lower losses (though I wonder if I can tell the difference between 0.08% and 0.05%).

Which would you buy?
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
LOL. The power difference is insignificant (less than 1dB). The THD difference isn't significant either and certainly wouldn't be audible. I'd go for the 3300 and hope that Chris K (main guy at Audyssey) gets that app out! I was on their FB page the other day and one of the regulars was needling him about the app still not being released....
 
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shadyJ

Speaker of the House
Staff member
I would upgrade the speakers, with plans to upgrade the subwoofer later. Those mordaunt short speakers might be good for a desktop PC system, but they are woefully underpowered for any other application. A 3.5" driver is not up to handling any bass frequencies. Those front three have to be the first thing to go, and that will have the biggest impact on the overall sound, so I would upgrade the front three speakers. I think the Elac speakers are fine, though I am not as smitten by them as some are. They should be a big improvement over the Mordaunt Short speakers. There is a good deal on Ascend Acoustics CMT-340s at the moment, I might be looking at those.
 
zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
You guys are bad influences. I will pony up the money for a XT32 receiver. My options:
1. Denon AVR-X3300W for $650
2. Denon AVR-X4200W for $800
Which would you buy?
I would not put the majority of my budget into a receiver -- The biggest difference in sound comes from the sub and speakers.
 
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davidbr55

Audioholic Intern
I've decided to buy the AVR-X3300W receiver, buy a nicer sub, and hold on to my current speakers until I move to a new place early next year.

Now, the question is: which receiver? Here are the options and net prices:

Def Tech Supercube 2000 - $360
SVS PB-1000 - $400

Def Tech Supercube 4000 - $480
Rythmik LV12R - $520
SVS SB-2000 - $560

I think there are two groups here, but I'd like to hear your thoughts on which group to pick, and then which sub within the group.

Thanks,
David
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Keep in mind that subwoofers are more specific to the total volume of the room (or rooms if an open floor plan), more so than speakers which are more about the distance between the speakers and your seat; your current room is relatively small but if you move into a bigger place a smaller sub may not be sufficient so I would go with the larger vented 12" Rythmik as first choice, the sealed 12" SVS SB2000 would be my second choice, the 10" ported SVS PB1000 after that. I would never buy a DefTec sub.
 

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