Still having trouble with Sub....

[mtbound10]

I am still having trouble with my sub and my receiver setup. I have a EMP 10 sub and a RX-V863 receiver. The built in volume on the Sub is currently set midway with the crossover maxed. I have EMP ECA compact speakers. The receiver is set to Small for all speakers, the crossover is set to 80. Speaker level for the sub is bumped up quite a bit and so is the speaker level for the rest of the speakers.

The biggest problem I seem to be having is the sub is not responding to the receiver. I know I have posted on this before and I am not trying to beat a dead horse but any ideas?

Is the bass being controlled by the receiver right now or the sub?

 

[pzaur]

When you say the sub is not responding, do you mean it doesn't automatically turn on or there is not enough bass for your liking?

From another page on this site, a recommended crossover for the compact EMP package is 120hz and not 80hz. Those little speakers cannot handle bass effectively.

-pat

 

[highfigh]

I am still having trouble with my sub and my receiver setup. I have a EMP 10 sub and a RX-V863 receiver. The built in volume on the Sub is currently set midway with the crossover maxed. I have EMP ECA compact speakers. The receiver is set to Small for all speakers, the crossover is set to 80. Speaker level for the sub is bumped up quite a bit and so is the speaker level for the rest of the speakers.

The biggest problem I seem to be having is the sub is not responding to the receiver. I know I have posted on this before and I am not trying to beat a dead horse but any ideas?

Is the bass being controlled by the receiver right now or the sub?

Where you connected the cable to the sub- was there one jack or two? If only one, you may have plugged it into the multi-channel input and not the subwoofer output. You will need to enable the subwoofer for the signal to be sent.

Do you hear anything from the sub?

 

[mtbound10]

When you say the sub is not responding, do you mean it doesn't automatically turn on or there is not enough bass for your liking?

From another page on this site, a recommended crossover for the compact EMP package is 120hz and not 80hz. Those little speakers cannot handle bass effectively.

-pat

Pat- When you mention setting the crossover to 120 is this 120 at the sub or 120 at the receiver?

In regards to your first response it is more so in terms of the sub not automatically turning on. For example, commercial or clip of some sort will be playing and then all of a sudden you can hear the sub kick in. There is a dramatic change in sound and appearance. Unfortunately I cannot get this to remain.

 

[mtbound10]

Where you connected the cable to the sub- was there one jack or two? If only one, you may have plugged it into the multi-channel input and not the subwoofer output. You will need to enable the subwoofer for the signal to be sent.

Do you hear anything from the sub?

My receiver has an LFE as does my sub which is how I am connected between the two. The sub has multiple connection options. There are L/R rca connections next to the LFE connection as well as speaker cable connections below that. I have a 20' LFE cable connecting my sub and receiver. It is a "rocketfish" cable.

 

[highfigh]

My receiver has an LFE as does my sub which is how I am connected between the two. The sub has multiple connection options. There are L/R rca connections next to the LFE connection as well as speaker cable connections below that. I have a 20' LFE cable connecting my sub and receiver. It is a "rocketfish" cable.

What audio mode are you using? Not all send the same info to LFE. Maybe you could try it in 5 ch stereo and if it turns on consistently that way, make sure you're using DTS or another mode that will work the same way. You could check the cable, too. If you have a long enough piece of coax and a pair of RCA-F adapters, it should work if the Rocketfish cable has a problem.

 

[pzaur]

Pat- When you mention setting the crossover to 120 is this 120 at the sub or 120 at the receiver?

Having the sub connected via RCA (LFE/Sub out) makes the receiver controlling the crossover setting. If the sub were connected by the high/low inputs (speaker wire) it would be controlled at the sub. The 120hz crossover needs to be set in the receiver. It sounds like you may risk damaging your speakers by having the crossover too low at the receiver.

In regards to your first response it is more so in terms of the sub not automatically turning on. For example, commercial or clip of some sort will be playing and then all of a sudden you can hear the sub kick in. There is a dramatic change in sound and appearance. Unfortunately I cannot get this to remain.

I would guess that the receiver is not sending a strong enough signal to turn the sub on at moments notice or there is a delay between receiving the signal and the amp turning on. The only way I can think of around this is to leave your sub on all the time. The auto on/off feature is adjustable on many subs.

-pat

 

[mtbound10]

If that is the case should I set the crossover on the sub to its maximum setting or its minimum setting? It goes up to 150 on the crossover.

As for the auto on, there is no adjustment that I see available. Supposedly it is activated by signal from the receiver.

I went in yesterday and set the crossover on the receiver to 120. Currently the crossover on the sub is still set to 150.

 

[mtbound10]

Pat-

How do you have your 663 set up? Are you running a Sub? does it run via RCA cable?

 

[mtbound10]

This is out of the book on my EMP 10 sub

"CROSSOVER FREQUENCY CONTROL"
The variable crossover frequency control allows you to set the crossover point of the subwoofer anywhere from 50-150 Hz. This control is only active with use of the "left and right" line level inputs. (#5 and #6 respectively) If using these inputs experiment with setting the crossover frequency control at the highest setting initially....


It then goes on to tell me that by using the "LFE" line level input that it bypasses the subs crossover control. And this is used when the reciever is controlling the bass.

It then goes on to say L/R LINE LEVEL INPUT " IF A FULL RANGE SIGNAL IS BEING SENT FROM THE RECIEVER OR PROCESSOR THEN THESE INPUTS SHOULD BE USED. IF THESE ARE USED THEN THE SUBS CROSSOVER IS ACTIVE."

Unfortunately I just don't know which to use... What is the benefit of using LFE over L/R Line level input.

P.S. That whole part in the middle came from an earlier post which I probably should have just pointed you too by way of a link now that I think about it!!!! Foolish me!

Thanks for stickin with me on this guys!

 

[sholling]

Question: What processing setting are you using on the receiver? The reason that I ask is that in "direct mode" some receivers will output 100% of stereo audio to the 2 mains and ignore the sub. Switch to "stereo mode" and see if that makes a difference.

 

[KEW]

You may need to get in touch with EMP.
It is not uncommon for the auto-on feature in subs to not be sensitive enough, but in most cases there is a switch to simply keep the sub on. It seems you do not have this option. It is beginning to sound like your's might be faulty.
On the bright side, this sub has been in production for a while and I'm sure EMP would have resolved any design issue by now. Your's might be faulty, but in any case they should be able to troubleshoot the issue quickly.
IME, it may take a couple of days before they respond to email, but once your number comes up, they'll take care of you.
Good luck.

BTW, how do you like the sound of those little speakers?

 

[pzaur]

Pat-

How do you have your 663 set up? Are you running a Sub? does it run via RCA cable?

Mine is connected via RCA cable and the crossover is set at 80hz in the receiver. I also have my settings set to send bass to both the sub and L/R fronts. My sub does not have an auto on/off feature so I've never had any response problems (aside from my sub being a POS...).

-pat

 

[mtbound10]

Question: What processing setting are you using on the receiver? The reason that I ask is that in "direct mode" some receivers will output 100% of stereo audio to the 2 mains and ignore the sub. Switch to "stereo mode" and see if that makes a difference.

Pure direct mode, and don't quote me on this is for pure 2 channel listening. It eliminates all other fields and sends all sound directly to the front two channels without any processing. I believe that mode on my receiver is for music only. I can actually listen to TV in pure direct but I lose video and only get sound through my front two speakers... and although I am proud of my two small EMP compacts, they are nothing worth listening to on their own.

 

[mtbound10]

KEW~

I was going to get in touch with EMP today, just did not have the time. I think that is a good idea. It does sound like there could be a problem with the switch.

I did some digging back to some old posts. One intelligent electrician took a jumper and bridged the low voltage posts and negated the auto on/off switch. Now I have no intention of doing this to my sub but it seemed to work for him.

Adam also mentioned in an older post bumping up the db level to the sub @ the receiver to get a better signal out to the sub and offset it by turning down the volume to the sub but it seemed like I would only be treating the symptom and not really fixing the problem.

I will get in touch with EMP tomorrow and see what they have to say.

 

[sholling]

Pure direct mode, and don't quote me on this is for pure 2 channel listening. It eliminates all other fields and sends all sound directly to the front two channels without any processing. I believe that mode on my receiver is for music only. I can actually listen to TV in pure direct but I lose video and only get sound through my front two speakers... and although I am proud of my two small EMP compacts, they are nothing worth listening to on their own.

Pure direct removes the sub from the equation as well (at least with an Onkyo). All of the sound goes to the mains. In stereo mode the sub is added back into the picture with no other processing.

On my receiver direct mode handles different inputs in different ways. 2ch --> direct = 2.0 channel stereo without the sub. 2ch --> stereo = 2.1 output obviously using the sub.

 

[pzaur]

Pure Direct - As little digital processing as possible from the receiver. Signals are not rerouted or changed. Video processing is shut off. No bass management. All tone controls are bypassed. (pg. 51-52 of RX-V863 manual).

Straight Mode - As the source is with bass management. This could be a 2, 5, or 7 channel source.

Pro Logic IIx - Routes 2 channel sources into however many speakers are attached and does nothing to multichannel sources.

Pure Direct should only be used when your front L/R speakers can be run full range with no issues. Otherwise you'll end up missing something or damaging equipment (possibly).

BTW - the ".1" actually stands for the LFE channel and not the subwoofer.
This is a distinct channel created for movie special effects. The subwoofer does not have it's own designation. It's use is determined by crossover settings as well as the LFE channel. Having ".0" does not mean the sub is bypassed.

-pat

 

[sholling]

BTW - the ".1" actually stands for the LFE channel and not the subwoofer.
This is a distinct channel created for movie special effects. The subwoofer does not have it's own designation. It's use is determined by crossover settings as well as the LFE channel. Having ".0" does not mean the sub is bypassed.

-pat

While you are technically correct the use of a .1 or .0 comes in very handy when trying to explain what is happening. Especially in this day and age when full range towers are out of fashion and so many rely on their subwoofers to fill in the lows in music.

 

[mtbound10]

Scholling-

I do understand what you are getting at, my point is that most of my issues and problems with my sub come during times while I am watching movies and or tv so the pure direct mode is a non-issue. I would not be watching in pure direct mode unless it was a spoken word movie with no video if you catch my drift

 

[KEW]

The fact that the sub does become active during commercials (which usuually are recorded as loudly as possible) establishes that the the pre-pro settings are not the issue IMHO.
But then, this could be my very first mistake for 2010 !