Pioneer Andrew Jones SP-PK52FS review

A

alphaiii

Audioholic General
Jim,

Nice review of the BS22 and FS52.

I have to agree with the treble sounding a little emphasized on the FS52, and in comparison to the C22, the FS52 sounds a little lean when running Audyssey test tones.

From what I recall, the C22 and BS22 sound very similar... and the FS52 sounds a a little treble happy in comparison (but some might say the C22/BS22 sound laid back in comparison). While I think the FS52 has cleaner bass, the C22/BS22 seem to have more relative to the rest of the audio spectrum - just not as tight/clean. I'd dare say they might be a little more balanced to my ears than the FS52 though.

That said, when I tried out the BS22 as mains... while they were impressive for their price, I don't remember the soundstage/imaging being as good was what I've heard with the FS52... but without comparing them directly it's hard to say.

I've demo'd the stock S30 a couple times, and while good for the money, they never really did it for me. The midrange is good, and the bass tight, but the upper mids/low treble seemed a little glaring to me... and I felt the tweeter was just a touch hissy sounding. This is me nit-picking of course. I could see how one would pick the S30 over the FS52... but I might take the Pioneer (again, hard to say without directly comparing). With Dennis' magic touch on the S30, I might like it better... but haven't heard it.

Either way, it's nice to have these options in the $200ish range.

I still want to A/B compare the Three and FS52... just for fun. If I thought I'd actually still have power, I would've already done it so far. I expected the power to be out awhile ago...
 
zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
That said, when I tried out the BS22 as mains... while they were impressive for their price, I don't remember the soundstage/imaging being as good was what I've heard with the FS52... but without comparing them directly it's hard to say.

I've demo'd the stock S30 a couple times, and while good for the money, they never really did it for me. The midrange is good, and the bass tight, but the upper mids/low treble seemed a little glaring to me... and I felt the tweeter was just a touch hissy sounding. This is me nit-picking of course. I could see how one would pick the S30 over the FS52... but I might take the Pioneer (again, hard to say without directly comparing). With Dennis' magic touch on the S30, I might like it better... but haven't heard it.
My impression of the imaging and soundstage of the 52 and 22,
is overall close - however not a match. The waveguides are the
same - however overall, seemed to be designed a little different.
Due to the treble flavoring -- the 22 will sound more laid-back or
a little closed-in, compared to the 52. I do not walk around much.
I am going to demo them in a bigger room - I think.

Well something made you go back to the S30 a second time.:):D
No speakers are really perfect, there are more expensive speakers
with more faults than a $220 pair of S30's.:)

I did give you a chance to buy the modded S30.:)
 
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zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
Do you know of any better (but priced reasonably) speakers that mimic this effect? I am dumbfounded that they got that sound out of an inexpensive soft dome.
No real budget ones at this time - the former more expensive
Boston E60 and VS260 - do a good job with the vivid and the
resolution.
The Cambridge overall has a vivid mimic >> however not the
shine in the tweeter like the FS52 towers.
 
zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
I still want to A/B compare the Three and FS52... just for fun. If I thought I'd actually still have power, I would've already done it so far. I expected the power to be out awhile ago...
Well, I may compare them against the Boston VS260 and the
Snell K7.:)

I am not really knocking the FS52 - they are some really nice
cheap towers, without cheap sound. The designer did a solid
job, with compromises chosen. There now seems to be more
budget choices for the tight budgets.
 
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A

alphaiii

Audioholic General
Well something made you go back to the S30 a second time.:):D
No speakers are really perfect, there are more expensive speakers
with more faults than a $220 pair of S30's.:)

I did give you a chance to buy the modded S30.:)
Very true... they are nice for the money. Demo #1 was to try them as mains... demo #2 was to try them as desktop speakers, full-range without a sub...since the only listening I did with them on my desk during demo #1 was with them crossed at 100Hz and sub handling the bass.

I did think about buying the modded S30, even if I knew they wouldn't stay... just to hear them. By that point, I knew either the VS260 or NHT Three was staying in my main room, and the S30 wasn't the right fit (literally) for my desk, even if the mod improved the sound.

I have yet to find my perfect speaker... but if I could make a Frankenstein of the VS260 and NHT Three, I'd have something damn close.
 
A

alphaiii

Audioholic General
Well, I may compare them against the Boston VS260 and the
Snell K7.:)

I am not really knocking the FS52 - they are some really nice
cheap towers, without cheap sound. The designer did a solid
job, with compromises chosen. ThERE now seems to be more
budget choices for the tight budgets.
Might be a fun comparison...

I miss the VS260 already... :(
 
zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
BTW, what are the mods on your Cambridges? What benefit do you feel you gained. You probably posted about it, but I missed it.
By Zieglj01 post #180
And I will have maybeone or two more links to follow.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I believe we may be the only 2 owners.
This is for info only, and not a big push for anything >>

Another owner's remarks, about the modded S30
Almost got floored by Cambridge S30
 
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C

crzycuyler

Audioholic Intern
Do we still love the 52s? lol. I can spend more money, but my ears tend to hear value. If I spend more, I need to hear it or i will regret the purchase. I also have to make it past a certain level of quality before I can listen for value.
I am coming from Bowers and wilkins 685s. Do the pioneers WOW at this price? I am interested in purchasing the whole set for both HT and music. (mostly HT). They will be powered by an AVR3312(overkill). I really don't know what direction to go. I want an awesome surround sound at an awesome value. Recommendations thus far, make me believe in this set. Keep making me believe, guys. lol
 
zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
Do we still love the 52s? lol. I can spend more money, but my ears tend to hear value. If I spend more, I need to hear it or i will regret the purchase. I also have to make it past a certain level of quality before I can listen for value.
I am coming from Bowers and wilkins 685s. Do the pioneers WOW at this price? I am interested in purchasing the whole set for both HT and music. (mostly HT). They will be powered by an AVR3312(overkill). I really don't know what direction to go. I want an awesome surround sound at an awesome value. Recommendations thus far, make me believe in this set. Keep making me believe, guys. lol
You will get real good sound, at a crazy price.

As I stated, they are solid speakers for the price, and play above
the entry level market >>> my nit-picking was not to down-grade
their value. The Pioneer's are not cheap sounding, there are some
so-called higher level speakers, that need to go back for a factory
re-design.:)
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Do we still love the 52s? lol. I can spend more money, but my ears tend to hear value. If I spend more, I need to hear it or i will regret the purchase. I also have to make it past a certain level of quality before I can listen for value.
I am coming from Bowers and wilkins 685s. Do the pioneers WOW at this price? I am interested in purchasing the whole set for both HT and music. (mostly HT). They will be powered by an AVR3312(overkill). I really don't know what direction to go. I want an awesome surround sound at an awesome value. Recommendations thus far, make me believe in this set. Keep making me believe, guys. lol
That is the problem with thoroughly reviewing an item isn't it? A review that says they are great without defining where the speaker start to lose to others really isn't very useful, but, as soon as its limits are identified, those limits begin to wholly define the speaker in our minds! We people are inherently conflicted! :)

Focusing on the mid and upper range, Jim and I have different opinions on the 52's vs 22's, which does not help.

You can feel assured that you are unlikely to find better BS speakers than the BS22's for under $200/pr (I read on other forums as well and I believe Jim (Zieglj01) has judiciously auditioned more speakers in this category than anyone!). Understand that this is comparing the BS22's against the very best among $200 speakers.

For budget floorstanders, the Infinity P363 has been the standard for some time, consistently beating speaker above its price point. It retails at $400/pr, occasionally seeing $260/pair discounted, and most recently (since the Pioneers have established themselves?) $200/pair discounted.
The FS52 which retails for $260/pr and discounts at $200/pr is, very much superior to the Infinities (to my ear). Additionally, it is, IMHO, a nicer looking speaker with the curved cabinet (also, I have never been a fan of how the Infinity grill wraps over the top edge). I don't know what pair of floorstanders would be next in line above the FS52's, but feel pretty comfortable saying you are looking at a minimum cost of $500/pr speakers.

Will you be running a sub with these? If so, you may want to bring home both the 52's and the 22's and return what you do not like. The difference between the two is subtle, but it is there, and I can appreciate Jim's preference of the 22's.

To answer your question from another angle, what type of music do you listen to:
Listening to Steely Dan, there is no contest, the 52's win convincingly every time. The shine/vividness of the 52's is fully realized and any shortcomings are obscured. For mainstream rock with male voices, the 52's are fantastic.
Listening to Jazz recordings (I play in a jazz band, so use this for my auditions), the 52's win when the band is in full swing, but many solos sound slightly stronger (better) on the B22's.
I think the worst case scenario for the 52's was playing female vocals which use the upper range of the human voice (Dido, Edie Brickell, Rickie Lee Jones, etc). If you listen to this type of music, use it to listen to the FS52's (preferably at home).
This is the best litmus for these speakers I can offer.

If you bring home both and listen to something like Steely Dan, then Dido, I believe you will quickly appreciate the differences between these two speakers (both how small of a difference it is and what you consider the better option).
As a general rule, floor standers offer some advantages over bookshelf - more bass, higher efficiency, and higher max SPL (though the bookshelf is strong). Bookshelf speakers usually have less cabinet resonance (though I did not hear any issues with the 52's).

If you can, bring home the new speakers before you lose the B&W's so you can do a head to head comparison. I don't think you will be disappointed.
 
C

crzycuyler

Audioholic Intern
That is the problem with thoroughly reviewing an item isn't it? A review that says they are great without defining where the speaker start to lose to others really isn't very useful, but, as soon as its limits are identified, those limits begin to wholly define the speaker in our minds! We people are inherently conflicted! :)

Focusing on the mid and upper range, Jim and I have different opinions on the 52's vs 22's, which does not help.

You can feel assured that you are unlikely to find better BS speakers than the BS22's for under $200/pr (I read on other forums as well and I believe Jim (Zieglj01) has judiciously auditioned more speakers in this category than anyone!). Understand that this is comparing the BS22's against the very best among $200 speakers.

For budget floorstanders, the Infinity P363 has been the standard for some time, consistently beating speaker above its price point. It retails at $400/pr, occasionally seeing $260/pair discounted, and most recently (since the Pioneers have established themselves?) $200/pair discounted.
The FS52 which retails for $260/pr and discounts at $200/pr is, very much superior to the Infinities (to my ear). Additionally, it is, IMHO, a nicer looking speaker with the curved cabinet (also, I have never been a fan of how the Infinity grill wraps over the top edge). I don't know what pair of floorstanders would be next in line above the FS52's, but feel pretty comfortable saying you are looking at a minimum cost of $500/pr speakers.

Will you be running a sub with these? If so, you may want to bring home both the 52's and the 22's and return what you do not like. The difference between the two is subtle, but it is there, and I can appreciate Jim's preference of the 22's.

To answer your question from another angle, what type of music do you listen to:
Listening to Steely Dan, there is no contest, the 52's win convincingly every time. The shine/vividness of the 52's is fully realized and any shortcomings are obscured. For mainstream rock with male voices, the 52's are fantastic.
Listening to Jazz recordings (I play in a jazz band, so use this for my auditions), the 52's win when the band is in full swing, but many solos sound slightly stronger (better) on the B22's.
I think the worst case scenario for the 52's was playing female vocals which use the upper range of the human voice (Dido, Edie Brickell, Rickie Lee Jones, etc). If you listen to this type of music, use it to listen to the FS52's (preferably at home).
This is the best litmus for these speakers I can offer.

If you bring home both and listen to something like Steely Dan, then Dido, I believe you will quickly appreciate the differences between these two speakers (both how small of a difference it is and what you consider the better option).
As a general rule, floor standers offer some advantages over bookshelf - more bass, higher efficiency, and higher max SPL (though the bookshelf is strong). Bookshelf speakers usually have less cabinet resonance (though I did not hear any issues with the 52's).

If you can, bring home the new speakers before you lose the B&W's so you can do a head to head comparison. I don't think you will be disappointed.
Wow. Thanks for the reply. I don't have the B&W any longer. I think I've got a problem with just wanting floor standers. I live in a fairly small apartment and to place the B&W off the wall a bit and on stands felt unstable, even though I am very careful. It just wasn't a good feeling for my fairly busy room. A pair of towers will feel more commanding in their position.

Music I listen to consists of stuff like Radiohead, Punch Brothers, Jesca Hoop, and The Civil Wars, and genres like Progressive Classical, Progressive Bluegrass, Blues, Alternative, and Acoustic.

I fear that I just want to like the floorstanders and won't make this decision reasonably. You still like the 52's over any other floorstander, though, right? If that's the case, with my employee discount at Best Buy, I can be getting a steal. I actually plan on getting both the 52's and the 22's for HT anyway, so I might as well compare them. I just have to settle on this decision, and if I want to pay a chunk more with other options, or go here. I was recently considering Sonus Faber Venere series, lol. So you see, I am all over the place.
 
zieglj01

zieglj01

Audioholic Spartan
That is the problem with thoroughly reviewing an item isn't it? A review that says they are great without defining where the speaker start to lose to others really isn't very useful, but, as soon as its limits are identified, those limits begin to wholly define the speaker in our minds! We people are inherently conflicted! :)

Focusing on the mid and upper range, Jim and I have different opinions on the 52's vs 22's, which does not help.

You can feel assured that you are unlikely to find better BS speakers than the BS22's for under $200/pr (I read on other forums as well and I believe Jim (Zieglj01) has judiciously auditioned more speakers in this category than anyone!). Understand that this is comparing the BS22's against the very best among $200 speakers.
I am going to do some more listening today. You never know, I may
feel different today. Like I said, I may be on an island by myself.:)
I am a big fan of instruments and female vocals.

However I agree that most people will chose the towers, the so-called
{shine} or {vivid} character, can be addictive.

If people listen to a lot of heavy metal, hard rock, rap - then the towers
are the ones to go for, mainly for the bass and power handling.

I also find the Primus series, lacking in the music department.

With a good quality sub and the good tweeters on both Pioneers, they
will also be good for home theater. For more home theater sound over
music - the towers would be ideal for fronts, the BS22 for surrounds.

For under $200 list price (not sales or deals or close-out pricing) > the
BS22 and HTD Level Two, are the ones that I favor. >> I for sure also
understand, that some people would not chose either one, and would
prefer something else. >> For a little over $200 list price, most people
know my preference.

All in all, I prefer my higher-end speakers over my budget favorites.

With everything said, everyone should audition in home - when trying
to make a final decision.
 
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panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Warlord
Wow. Lots of information/reviews since I last checked the thread. I have an opinion question for you guys. I plan to use this series in a 80%HT/20%music room that is a dedicated HT room. The plan was to use three 52's behind the screen and get 22's for surround duty.

So, for you guys that have demoed for HT duty what are your impressions? Would you go with nothing but 22's and a good sub, or the front 3 52's and the rest 22's?
 
ahblaza

ahblaza

Audioholic Field Marshall
Wow. Lots of information/reviews since I last checked the thread. I have an opinion question for you guys. I plan to use this series in a 80%HT/20%music room that is a dedicated HT room. The plan was to use three 52's behind the screen and get 22's for surround duty.

So, for you guys that have demoed for HT duty what are your impressions? Would you go with nothing but 22's and a good sub, or the front 3 52's and the rest 22's?
If you have the room and it seems like you do, 3 52's up front and 22's for sides is a very good option. I used one 52 as a center and was very pleased with the results, good crisp and clear dialog with excellent vertical and horizontal dispersion. I think 3 52's would make for an excellent front stage (LCR). :)
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Warlord
Thanks guys. I may be going to best buy this afternoon. :D
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Wow. Lots of information/reviews since I last checked the thread. I have an opinion question for you guys. I plan to use this series in a 80%HT/20%music room that is a dedicated HT room. The plan was to use three 52's behind the screen and get 22's for surround duty.

So, for you guys that have demoed for HT duty what are your impressions? Would you go with nothing but 22's and a good sub, or the front 3 52's and the rest 22's?
I vote for five identical 52's all around and dual subs. :D
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Warlord
I vote for five identical 52's all around and dual subs. :D
Believe me, if I had the room in the back it would happen. Dual subs? No brainer on that one. Actually thinking about quad subs. That's for another discussion. :D
 
ahblaza

ahblaza

Audioholic Field Marshall
Excellent Suggestion

Believe me, if I had the room in the back it would happen. Dual subs? No brainer on that one. Actually thinking about quad subs. That's for another discussion. :D
Make room, put the side 52's on stands well above ear level angled down toward LP or facing the front of room. :D:D
I going to do just that soon and watch WOTW BD..;) to be continued.:D
ADTG is crazy, but he brings order to choas...The Borg..Star Trek......:D
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Believe me, if I had the room in the back it would happen. Dual subs? No brainer on that one. Actually thinking about quad subs. That's for another discussion. :D
Make room, put the side 52's on stands well above ear level angled down toward LP or facing the front of room. :D:D
I going to do just that soon and watch WOTW BD..;) to be continued.:D
ADTG is crazy, but he brings order to choas...The Borg..Star Trek......:D
Where there's a will, there's a way. :eek:
 

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