Home theatre - Plasma or LED better? Which is more suitable for my setup?

[sevenz]

hi everyone, currently i'm using a 40" LCD and upgrading to a bigger TV for better HTS enjoyment. Most of my usage are for movies and concerts, no gaming and no soccer. For HTS, I have read and seems like plasma is better than LED TV for HTS? Have a few queries below...... :

1) Can someone help to share a little further what are the adv for plasma over LED? My current understanding is plasma is better in PQ, naturalism of colors and refresh rate, but LED is better in terms of power consumption and aesthetics, and no reflection?

2) My setup is uncontrolled (as in my setup is in living room), and my TV console is kind of beside my window (with curtains), plus there are some lightings in the living room. I have attached layout and pictures below for better illustration. If i get plasma, would reflection be a problem in my setup? What are the potential issues that I will likely face in the day and night?

Photo 1:

Photo 2:

 

[TheWarrior]

I would say get a plasma and rotate your entire living room clockwise. Those speakers are way too nice to be sitting that close to glass. If you position it all in the corner (or just to the right of the corner) you'll be able to enjoy your outdoor view, indoor view, and have a cleaner high frequency response from your speakers.

 

[ParadigmDawg]

This is the response I gave to one of my wife's friends. It is a collection of a bunch of responses I got from here.

Almost every single solid review you read will state, flat out, that LED is
great, but a good plasma will provide about the best image you can possibly
achieve. They like the Elite Sharp LCDs, but beyond that, most of them are
'really good' at best.

Plasma still has inherent qualities that LCD (whether LED or traditionally lit)
can't match. Mostly this is because of the emissive technology and the real
world refresh rates, which create smoother motion, better off-axis viewing, and
better black levels.

LCD gets brighter and doesn't have much in the way of image retention issues,
but if you've lived with a plasma for a while, then that isn't an issue for you.

The ST/GT series from Panasonic offers one of the best images you will obtain
for the money right now. A nice balance of image quality to price. The 7000/8000
series from Samsung is also a good place to be looking.

I would simply not be buying an LED if I was after the best image quality. LCD
is great for secondary display locations, but not something I would recommend in
the primary location to most people.

If the room is dark or you have good control, then there is no reason at all you
shouldn't use a plasma.

LCD has issues. Higher refresh rates help deal with some of them, but they still
have some small issues. Image uniformity, black levels, angle of viewing issues,
blurring.

The soap opera effect can be turned off on ALL LCD TVs so I don't consider that
something to worry about. If you like it, use it, if you hate it, turn it off.
The soap opera effect is the use of creative frame interpolation (CFI) or Motion
Flow or a dozen different names by manufacturers. CFI converts a 60hz source
(ALL TELEVSION!) and deblurs the image and inserts new frames between them. A
120hz display can convert a 60hz image (60 frames) into 120hz (120 frames). A
240hz display may be capable of delivering 240 frames
But, at the end of the day, if you've done your homework then you should be
aware that plasma produces a more natural image from all viewing angles with
better black levels and a smoother image. This is just a natural aspect of the
technology being used. The active light engine of plasma really delivers a
better image.

But, LCD is more 'versatile' when it comes to brighter rooms and rooms with lots
of windows.

But, any room that you want the best possible image in really asks to have a
plasma in it. Just for reference, I have 3 plasma's even one in my bright living
room. It works great but it has a louver filter that controls overhead lighting.

 

[Adam]

I own a plasma, but a lot of my shopping experience is dated from 2009 when I bought mine. However, there are two things that I'd like to pitch in:

1. The difference in power consumption between LED LCD and plasma TVs really isn't that high. You can check the specs online for different TVs to see just how much difference there will be in the models that interest you. You're probably looking at ~$20 more a year in electricity to go with plasma.

2. Regarding reflections, that's a function of the specific TV model and not the choice of technology (LCD versus plasma). I have a lot of ambient light in my living room like you do, so this was also important to me. One of the reasons that I chose my plasma TV (a Panasonic TC-P50G10) was because of it's anti-reflective coating. Back then, a lot of LCD TVs had glossy finishes on the screens - those give better color reproduction, but they have a LOT more reflection. Some LCD TVs had mat finishes, which reduced the reflections a lot, and some plasmas had glossy screens. So, it just depended on the model of the TV. Shopping for image quality at places like Best Buy can be tricky because the TVs often have different video settings applied to them in the store, but going to the store can help you very easily see how reflective the TV screens are.

 

[westcott]

I agree that the room should be rotated to sit in the long direction.

But i disagree about the plasma recommendation.

I have a Panasonic Plasma and I thought it was the cat's meow but after acquiring a new LED for Christmas, there just is no comparison, especially when it comes to contrast. The LED is just superior on this cornerstone of quality video reproduction. It is CRT good!!! The details that are revealed with the awesome contrast an LED can provide can not be touched by a plasma IMO.

But, if you do not believe me, do a comparison for yourself. Just make sure that you know what you are looking for. A dead giveaway is when the bars on top and bottom of widescreen formats are not truly black. A dark room will help to reveal this disparity in contrast when a display is properly calibrated. On an LED, they are black. I have watched Harry Potter over again this holiday season and I know these films inside and out and I have to admit that I have seen details this week that I never new were possible on a flat panel. It is as good as my old CRT!!!

 

[Adam]

A dead giveaway is when the bars on top and bottom of widescreen formats are not truly black. A dark room will help to reveal this disparity in contrast when a display is properly calibrated. On an LED, they are black.

I'm in no position to compare LED to plasma, but I can add this. Newer model year Panasonic plasmas have improved the black levels, and...and this does annoy me...at least 2009 and 2010 Panasonic plasmas increased the underlying brightness after a certain number of hours of use (it was in the firmware and was done in the past to counteract something that no longer existed in the newer panels, if memory serves). I don't know if the 2012 models fixed that issue. I can say that the black level on my 2009 Panasonic is not as black as it was when I first bought it, surely due to the firmware issue.

 

[BMXTRIX]

I feel like I was quoted above somewhere...

Plasma will give a better image, but LED/LCD is certainly no slouch. The headache for some is that within a more limited budget you can get the ST series from Panasonic and have about the best image you can imagine for the money.

You have to really go with the 8000 series from Samsung (IMO) to get as good as it gets with LED/LCD and it won't be as good as the ST Panasonic, but it will still be very, very good.

Very, very good - is a lot better than most people have. If you simply want the 'best', then you go with a VT Panasonic, and you fix the room to make it look the best.

If you just want to live with some daytime 'less than perfection' issues, and enjoy the best image at night, on a good price scale - get a ST series from Panasonic.

If you want an all-around really good image that deals with daylight brilliantly and still looks solid at night, then the 8000 series from Samsung is where to go.

I regularly install both LCD and plasma for my clients. I strongly believe they both are top shelf and my clients ALWAYS have been happy with their TV regardless of the technology. It is simply small differences which set these displays apart.

I personally keep a plasma (64" 7000 series Samsung) as my main family room display. It will stay there until I finish my basement and move it down there into a more critical viewing room. Then, the family room will get a 80" (or larger) LED/LCD display. The wife and kids will use that and I can finally enjoy my damn TV for once!

It isn't much of an answer, but I think when it's your money, you just need to be informed of the differences, then go with what you feel will make you happiest in the long run.

 

[sevenz]

Thanks warrior and westcott! Yes rotating it would make sense for the SQ. But unfortunately due to cosmetic and wife reasons, I guess the existing layout has to stay. And I have to make the best out of it.

I would say get a plasma and rotate your entire living room clockwise. Those speakers are way too nice to be sitting that close to glass. If you position it all in the corner (or just to the right of the corner) you'll be able to enjoy your outdoor view, indoor view, and have a cleaner high frequency response from your speakers.

I agree that the room should be rotated to sit in the long direction.

 

[sevenz]

Oh.... Are there plasmas with anti-reflective coating? Sorry for asking this basic question cos all along I thought plasma were all reflective panels. If it is then it would be good for me! haha

2. Regarding reflections, that's a function of the specific TV model and not the choice of technology (LCD versus plasma). I have a lot of ambient light in my living room like you do, so this was also important to me. One of the reasons that I chose my plasma TV (a Panasonic TC-P50G10) was because of it's anti-reflective coating.

 

[sevenz]

Thanks BMXTRIX!

Could you help to elaborate more on the "daytime 'less than perfection' issues" that I would potentially face based on my layout? Are you referring to the light and reflection from the windows that I would potentially see on my plasma? But say for e.g. if im seated in the sweet spot on my sofa, square to the TV and centre speaker, would there still be potential reflection since I am not at an angle?

You have to really go with the 8000 series from Samsung (IMO) to get as good as it gets with LED/LCD and it won't be as good as the ST Panasonic, but it will still be very, very good.

If you just want to live with some daytime 'less than perfection' issues, and enjoy the best image at night, on a good price scale - get a ST series from Panasonic.

 

[ParadigmDawg]

I feel like I was quoted above somewhere...

.

Sorry brother.....

 

[BMXTRIX]

Thanks BMXTRIX!

Could you help to elaborate more on the "daytime 'less than perfection' issues" that I would potentially face based on my layout? Are you referring to the light and reflection from the windows that I would potentially see on my plasma? But say for e.g. if im seated in the sweet spot on my sofa, square to the TV and centre speaker, would there still be potential reflection since I am not at an angle?

There are hits and misses with both plasma and LCD, but with plasma it is the issue of bright rooms and reflections that cause the most issues I believe.

First, plasmas just aren't as bright as LCDs. They have better contrast, better black levels, and produce a better overall image, but when you are in a really bright room, they will never look as punch as a LED/LCD with the brightness turned up. They don't look bad, they just aren't as bright. They look a LOT better than rear projection which can't compete with daylight rooms at all. But, we don't really have rear projection anymore... So, it is plasma which is the 'weaker' display when it comes to brightness in a lit room.

Second, plasmas all have a glass screen. Some do come with an anti-reflective coating. This is a direct reflection issue. You sit to the left of your TV and there are windows right behind it, you will see those windows reflecting off the TV screen. The anti-reflective coating helps, but doesn't get rid of the glass which is still there. It just helps. We have windows to the right of our plasma and when I sit in the seats to the left I get reflections. I either move or ignore them. Likewise, at night, lights in the room can reflect off the glass.

It's a bit annoying, but I can turn lights off and I can move if I am really irritated (sometimes I am, so I do move).

I tend to recommend LED/LCD from the Samsung 8000 series a bit more often than plasma. Not because it looks better, but because it produces a solid image and viewers aren't overly critical of the image quality. Based on your room, I would probably be looking at a better LED/LCD before plasma, even though plasma delivers the better image, you still have to live with the shortfalls in the room you currently have available. I got a plasma because I KNOW I will be moving it to my basement at some point.

 

[PENG]

Currently available LED TVs are really just LED back light LCD TVs. I do have experience with a Pioneer Elite Pro-111 plasma and a Pansonic ST plasma. The Panasonic will have trouble during day time in a very bright room unless you close the curtains. The Pioneer seems bright enough for me that day time watching is no a problem. Aside from that, I do not find either one suffer from glare/reflections, not any more than LCD and CRT ones. From what I read, some Samsung has plasma models that are brighter, more comparable to that of LCDs.

I find LCD/LED backlight panels look more like videos whereas plasma panels look more like movies. Overall I think plasma panels look better but only you will know which one you prefer.

 

[sevenz]

Thanks my friend, that was helpful for me to understand. Have 3 quick queries:

1) Would plasmas with anti-reflective coating help to overcome the reflection issue as well as getting a LED/LCD? Understand that some models do have this. With the anti-reflection, my worry is that this would also mean a decrease in PQ and brightness, and hence may negate the advantages of getting a plasma?

2) I understand there is also the Samsung plasma 8 series e.g. PN51D8000, PN51E8000? Would they have the same issues as the Panny plasmas? And would they be brighter than the pannies?

3) Assuming you have my current layout, with the windows to be always a constant constraint there, and more often than not, my family dont close the curtains completely when watching concerts/movies (maybe half), would u personally choose a LED over a plasma?

Thanks for sharing

I tend to recommend LED/LCD from the Samsung 8000 series a bit more often than plasma. Not because it looks better, but because it produces a solid image and viewers aren't overly critical of the image quality. Based on your room, I would probably be looking at a better LED/LCD before plasma, even though plasma delivers the better image, you still have to live with the shortfalls in the room you currently have available.

 

[PENG]

Thanks my friend, that was helpful for me to understand. Have 3 quick queries:

1) Would plasmas with anti-reflective coating help to overcome the reflection issue as well as getting a LED/LCD? Understand that some models do have this. With the anti-reflection, my worry is that this would also mean a decrease in PQ and brightness, and hence may negate the advantages of getting a plasma?

I am impressed with both the Pioneer and Panny's PQ, best I have seen including LCD/LEDs, but of course the LCD/LEDs are more suited to bright rooms.

2) I understand there is also the Samsung plasma 8 series e.g. PN51D8000, PN51E8000? Would they have the same issues as the Panny plasmas? And would they be brighter than the pannies?

I think within the same price range they may be brighter but you should double check that by reading reviews that include measurements.

3) Assuming you have my current layout, with the windows to be always a constant constraint there, and more often than not, my family dont close the curtains completely when watching concerts/movies (maybe half), would u personally choose a LED over a plasma?

In that case, if you do a lot of day time watching, go with the LCD/LED backlight ones.

By the way, HTM has quite a few reviews on both, following is what one has to say about the Panasonic V series:

"But the Panasonic wasn’t far behind the Sharp Elite in its measured blacks and equally good or perhaps even slightly better—as memory serves—in shadow detail. Apart from the darkest scenes, the black bars on widescreen films very nearly disappeared from the TCP65VT50 in a darkened room (although they were slightly more visible with 3D material). Mixed light and dark scenes popped convincingly, and darker scenes never descended into a foggy mist.

While the Sharp Elite was not on hand for a direct comparison, my 60-inch Pioneer Kuro PRO141FD was. The darkest scenes on the Panasonic weren’t quite as enticingly rich, a result confirmed by the two sets’ measured black levels (0.001 foot-lamberts on the Kuro after three years of use; 0.002 ft-L on the Panasonic after an estimated 200 hours of operation). But keeping in mind that this Kuro’s MSRP (the top model in the Kuro lineup) was roughly twice the list price of the TC-P65VT50, Panasonic’s achievement here shouldn’t be underestimated. On Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Part 2, a film with more than its fair share of dimly lit, challenging video, the Panasonic held its own. The main difference between the two sets was a slightly smoother transition into the darkest region of the brightness range on the Pioneer. The Panasonic had a trace of black crush on a few shots; the Pioneer did not. But it was a very close call. The Panasonic looked very slightly sharper than the Pioneer, but that too was very material dependent."

 

[sevenz]

is it true that the newer Panny plasmas have anti burn-in panels as compared to Samsung plasmas? Some sales person told me this and I was a bit doubtful

 

[Bun-Bun]

100% plasma if you are not gaming. I bought a 8000 series samsung a year ago and it is far superior to any LCD/LED I have seen to date. Picture quality does not compare not to mention the far superior response and lag.

The only issue I have with it is image retention when playing some games. But if you are not gaming that is a non issue.

LCD is better when you need the brightness, but most of the time I find they are far to bright to begin with.

LED has potential to be the better technology but until manufactures pull their head of their asses and start manufacturing real displays instead of over hyped/marketed BS then plasma will continue to be the best.

EDIT: And my samsung has a anti-glare coating that is not too harsh so it is not super reflective like some displays but still leaves a nice clear image. I hate glossy TV's and I love my plasma.

 

[PENG]

is it true that the newer Panny plasmas have anti burn-in panels as compared to Samsung plasmas? Some sales person told me this and I was a bit doubtful

I think they all do, at least the higher end models I would imagine. I am not sure if the technology has advanced enough for that to work perfectly but I can tell you I have that feature in use in my Pioneer Elite and if I left it on the BNN channel long enough I could still see some minor image retention. That is not exactly the same as "burn-in" because it will eventually disppear whereas "burn-in" is permanent but I am guessing. It really does not bother me in any case because I have to really look for it in order to see it. In other words, no issues at all for normal (99.99%?) non AVholic/AVphiliac people. Again, the latest model may be bettter in that sense as I do not recall noticing even slight retention on the Panny ST50 but I never did look for it either.

 

[sevenz]

Hi guys! thanks for the useful advice, have decided to go for a plasma! Any plasma set would be a big upgrade from my Samsung LCD LA40B530. Any recommendations for budget of $1200?

I dont live in the US, so locally, i hv the following options, more exp compared to US online shops. Prices include delivery.
1) 50ST30 - $1k
2) 55ST30 - $1.4k
3) 50ST50 - no stock, extremely expensive at the moment at $2k
4) 50UT50 - $1.3k
5) Ship 55ST50 from Amazon, buy a step up transformer but risk having the panel being damaged during shipping. (i can get it shipped for 170 to Singapore)
6) Or shld I just wait around for a good used set from 2010/2011 since any plasma would be a improvement from my Samsung LCD?

 

[panteragstk]

When I sold TV's (2009) samsung made decent plasmas. Lg made decent plasmas, but panasonic made fantastic plasmas. LG, and samsung had burn in issues on the lower end models, but the higher end had no problems. I have a 2009 panasonic that I've been using as a computer monitor for the last 3 years and it works great. No burn in, no image retention. I play games on it all the time without issue.

When I sold them, to prove a point we left a static image on a panasonic for 2 days straight to see if we could burn it in. There was image retention, but after running the "magic eraser" it was gone. No issues.

One thing nobody ever mentions with LCD (LED backlit or CFL backlit) is that some people see the "screen door" effect no matter what sort of frame interpolation is in place. I can't watch LCD's for this reason. Fast motion makes my eyes strain and makes my head hurt. LCD projectors are no different. I don't know anyone else that has this problem, but it makes LCD's a no buy for me. I can barely use LCD's as a computer monitor (hence the plasma for my monitor) and that is only if there is no fast motion. It may be because I was around TV's for 8+ hours a day for years, but I can't help but pick apart a display when it isn't as close to perfect as possible. Drives my wife crazy