Crossovers

[bruin62]

On a 11.2 setup should all the crossovers be set to 80 and just left there?

 

[lovinthehd]

There's no book on it. Depends on your speakers/subs and preferences....

 

[bruin62]

So so my front towers are 3way powered speakers and the frequency response is 36Hz-20kHz what would you set them at? Or is it best just to let audessey pick the cross overs?

 

[lovinthehd]

So so my front towers are 3way powered speakers and the frequency response is 36Hz-20kHz what would you set them at? Or is it best just to let audessey pick the cross overs?

Audyssey may set such speakers as full range depending on how it measures their in-room f3, but if you're using subs I'd change them to small/using crossover, and a good starting point is 80 but experiment above and below that as well. Is that 36hz an f3 (-3dB point)? My towers have an f6 of 36Hz but I usually set crossover somewhere between 100-120 (but have four subs around the room, localization hasn't been an issue).

 

[bruin62]

I reran Audyssey and it set every speaker to 60Hz but for some reason Audyssey always says I have some speakers out of phase. I've gone through every connection, Marantz said it could be the room size or noise from my projector. Not sure if this has anything to do with it

 

[PENG]

I reran Audyssey and it set every speaker to 60Hz but for some reason Audyssey always says I have some speakers out of phase. I've gone through every connection, Marantz said it could be the room size or noise from my projector. Not sure if this has anything to do with it

If you have a very capable subwoofer, I would set it to 80 Hz to take more load off the mains and lowering the chance of cancellation. I know there are non believers but I have done enough measurements to know that bass management can in fact help off load the main, to a point of course.

It is possible surround speakers placement in your room could appear to be out of phase to Audyssey but it shouldn't happen to the mains (L/C/R). It is also possible that one of the speaker is internal wired out of phase too. I would investigate this further, there are tests you can do to find out if the speaker is wired in phase with the others.

 

[lovinthehd]

I reran Audyssey and it set every speaker to 60Hz but for some reason Audyssey always says I have some speakers out of phase. I've gone through every connection, Marantz said it could be the room size or noise from my projector. Not sure if this has anything to do with it

Do they sound out of phase? There are THX Optimizers on many dvd/bluray movies that have a phase test....

 

[j_garcia]

Ignore it when it says they are out of phase (once you have confirmed your connections). Mine did that before and I found that it was incorrect. It is an anomaly.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

It can be possible to have a speaker wired internally wrong. Jump the terminals with a 9v battery and see which way the driver moves. Probably other, better tests I'm sure. That's just an easy one without pulling the drivers to verify. As jGarcia said, could be an anomaly. HD mentioned phase tests, and many dvd's have thx optimizers on them. I have an old sound and vision disk with all kinds of tests on it, and the Disney WOW disk I think has speaker tests too.

 

[j_garcia]

The speakers may actually be wired in a way that causes the mic to detect them as out of phase, or just because of the room acoustics it detects that. I ran my current speakers 4 or 5 times with my UMC-200 previously and it called them out of phase twice without me making any changes, so I knew it was not the speakers.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Iirc, I've read that some speaker designs used a technique that intentionally wired one driver in the speaker backwards internally. Can't remember why, but it was basically a crutch for overcoming baffle step issues or something like that.

 

[lovinthehd]

I had a Pioneer avr with MCACC that would frequently come up with a phase error and only once did I find that I had hooked up a speaker out of phase, the rest of the time it was false alarms. I haven't had the experience with Audyssey tho.

ps I have now had the experience with Audyssey on a used Denon 3808 I picked up.

 

[bruin62]

I had the SR5008 in a 7.2 setup before the SR7010 11.2 setup and when I ran the setup it never said out of phase.watching movies sound fine not sure what out of phase speakers would sound like. I find this crossover settings kinda confusing. My sub set at 80Hz so should I leave the speakers at 60Hz like the setup put them at? Also my two front towers have 8in subs in them so there set to large?

 

[lovinthehd]

I had the SR5008 in a 7.2 setup before the SR7010 11.2 setup and when I ran the setup it never said out of phase.watching movies sound fine not sure what out of phase speakers would sound like. I find this crossover settings kinda confusing. My sub set at 80Hz so should I leave the speakers at 60Hz like the setup put them at? Also my two front towers have 8in subs in them so there set to large?

There's just one crossover, that between speaker and sub; a crossover is a combination of a low pass filter for the sub combined with a high pass filter for the speaker(s). When you say 80 for the sub is that the avr's LPF of LFE setting or the low pass filter on the sub itself? Normal setting of the LPF of LFE is 120hz; the LPF on the sub itself should be turned to max setting if the LlFE setting on the sub didn't already do that.

 

[bruin62]

In the receiver settings it is set on LFE+Main at120Hz and on the sub the crossover at 80Hz and phase knob turned all the way up

 

[yepimonfire]

If you've checked the phase, just ignore it. Some speakers have tweeters intentionally wired out of phase and audessy could pick up on that. Audyssey does not determine crossover frequency, it simply reports the f3 to the receiver and it picks large or small, and the crossover frequency.

In the majority of circumstances, it best to have all of the low end routed to the sub, the sub can be optimally placed for the best low end response, whereas speakers cannot and the response is going to vary considerably throughout the room. This is not a rule however, in some rooms, I've found it get better response with lower crossover points.

You should definitely disable the LFE + Mains setting unless you want bloated bass and cancellations.

The other thing to consider is that forcing a single driver to cover multiple octaves introduces intermodulation distortion. If you play a 40hz tone and a 800hz tone at the same time with your speakers set to full range, raising and lowering the volume you may notice some warbling of the 800hz tone. Thats IM distortion. Ideally each driver should cover no more than 3 octaves. From 20hz to 80hz, that's about 3 octaves. Let the sub handle that.

Sent from my SM-G360T1 using Tapatalk

 

[lovinthehd]

In addition to what yep says, particularly about LFE + Main, turn the low pass filter on the sub(s) to their max value and let the avr handle the low and high pass filters (your subs may do that anyways if they have an LFE input or setting).

Why did you turn the phase knob(s) to max? Did you do this on both subs? Do the sub(s) have variable phase setting or a choice of 0 or 180 degrees?

Curious, how did you determine sub locations of the right side wall and the back of the couch (if I'm seeing your current setup in the pic in your signature). Sub crawl? Aesthetics?

 

[bruin62]

That's a old pic when it was a 7.2 setup the sub behind the couch seized so it's gone. So right now I have the one big sub up front and using bass shakers in the other sub out Jack till I pick up another sub. The setup is 11 speakers. So LFE+main is the wrong setting even with powered subs in your front speakers? As for the phase on the sub turned all the way up I read this online somewhere

 

[lovinthehd]

That's a old pic when it was a 7.2 setup the sub behind the couch seized so it's gone. So right now I have the one big sub up front and using bass shakers in the other sub out Jack till I pick up another sub. The setup is 11 speakers. So LFE+main is the wrong setting even with powered subs in your front speakers? As for the phase on the sub turned all the way up I read this online somewhere

What speakers and how are they connected?

 

[bruin62]

They are soundstage the two fronts have 8 inch subs, so the two fronts,center an both side surrounds are going to a NAD power amp and the front presence speakers and both front wide and the surround back speakers are going to the receiver. All are connected with banana plugs