Anything Better Than This??

[EIPtuningR32]

I am about to pull the trigger on the Audioengine A5+ speakers and Audioengine D1 DAC. Their primary use will be listening to high quality music (DSD/SACD/24-96/FLAC) files on my computer. My biggest enjoyment is sitting down and immersing myself in the music, listening to all of the details and enjoying the clarity. My question is, are there better options out there for speakers and DACs? I am thinking about saving up and buying a sub later on, so i would like to have really natural bass with the monitors. I am looking to spend ~$500 on speakers,DAC (or whatever device is recommended), and wiring. Any suggestions or am I on the right path to musical heaven?

 

[fmw]

I would skip the DAC, assuming your computer has a DAC already on its mainboard or sound card. I would take that money and put it into speakers. I have no experience with the speakers you mention but I don't see much to gain with an external DAC.

 

[shadyJ]

Many computer's built in audio jacks are awful, so I wouldn't use onboard sound. I would get an audio interface, something like these Behringers will do very nicely and are a lot less expensive than those Audioengines. If you want to get fancier than those barebones Behringers, check out this Lexicon interface. It is still a lot less expensive than that Audioengine interface, and it has more features. That audioengine DAC just isn't a very good value, it is depending on the consumer's ignorance of pro-audio interfaces for any sale.

The Audioengine speakers are fine, but they still aren't my first choice, although they are not a rip like their DAC. If you want an easy natural bass, you will end up having to get something with big woofers, there is no way around this. Even if you get a sub, it will still be better to get a speaker with larger woofers so the crossover point is can be lower for less localization. In my experience, localization is a bigger problem with near-field setups, so I would try to go for as low of a crossover point as you can get. One of my favorite budget monitors for this is the Mackie MR8mk2. The Rokit 8s are not bad either. Either will give you solid powerful bass down to the 50 to 60 hz range. They will be a lot more dynamic than the Audioengine speakers. The Audioengine speakers will sound tinny and thin compared to these, especially as you turn the volume up. If there is a pro-audio store around you like a Guitar Center, go there and demo some of their monitors. You will hear the difference for yourself.

 

[slipperybidness]

Many computer's built in audio jacks are awful, so I wouldn't use onboard sound. I would get an audio interface, something like these Behringers will do very nicely and are a lot less expensive than those Audioengines. If you want to get fancier than those barebones Behringers, check out this Lexicon interface. It is still a lot less expensive than that Audioengine interface, and it has more features. That audioengine DAC just isn't a very good value, it is depending on the consumer's ignorance of pro-audio interfaces for any sale.

The Audioengine speakers are fine, but they still aren't my first choice, although they are not a rip like their DAC. If you want an easy natural bass, you will end up having to get something with big woofers, there is no way around this. Even if you get a sub, it will still be better to get a speaker with larger woofers so the crossover point is can be lower for less localization. In my experience, localization is a bigger problem with near-field setups, so I would try to go for as low of a crossover point as you can get. One of my favorite budget monitors for this is the Mackie MR8mk2. The Rokit 8s are not bad either. Either will give you solid powerful bass down to the 50 to 60 hz range. They will be a lot more dynamic than the Audioengine speakers. The Audioengine speakers will sound tinny and thin compared to these, especially as you turn the volume up. If there is a pro-audio store around you like a Guitar Center, go there and demo some of their monitors. You will hear the difference for yourself.

+1 on the poor audio from onboard mobo DACs. Avoid that scenario.

I have also been considering the Emotiva Airmotive 5s and the JBL LSR series.

 

[psbfan9]

You should try these before getting the A5's

Vanatoo

 

[EIPtuningR32]

Those are both two interesting suggestions. I have not heard of Vanatoo or Mackie. I will have to look into them. I definitely do not want to stick to the internal sound card on my computer. I would like a good interface that will allow be to use the speakers to their full potential. I do not need a recording interface like the Lexicon Alfa. What would you guys consider one of the best bang for your buck audio interfaces for high quality music listening?

 

[slipperybidness]

Those are both two interesting suggestions. I have not heard of Vanatoo or Mackie. I will have to look into them. I definitely do not want to stick to the internal sound card on my computer. I would like a good interface that will allow be to use the speakers to their full potential. I do not need a recording interface like the Lexicon Alfa. What would you guys consider one of the best bang for your buck audio interfaces for high quality music listening?

I've been pleased with this one. I got it on clearance for $200. It does have a couple of limitations.

Emotiva XDA 1 DAC | eBay

The replacement XDA-2 fixed those limitations and it is on sale now for $339.
XDA-2 USB DAC/Digital Preamp/Headphone Amp | Emotiva Audio Corporation | Emotiva Audio | High-end audio components for audiophiles and videophiles, spanning 2-channel music systems, as well as 5.1 and 7.1 home theaters. Products include multichannel

 

[shadyJ]

Those are both two interesting suggestions. I have not heard of Vanatoo or Mackie. I will have to look into them. I definitely do not want to stick to the internal sound card on my computer. I would like a good interface that will allow be to use the speakers to their full potential. I do not need a recording interface like the Lexicon Alfa. What would you guys consider one of the best bang for your buck audio interfaces for high quality music listening?

Go for the Behringers, they are simple, cheap, and have proven good output jacks and good digital to analogue conversion. The Lexicon offers the same clean output, but has frontal volume control knobs and has two analogue output along with a headphone jack. The extra set of RCA jacks can come in handy when you want to add the subwoofer. The mastermix knob might also let you control the volume of the RCA and TRS output independently so you could control the sub's loudness independently when it's hooked up. If those features appeal to you, it is twice the price of the Behringer, but still very cheap at $60. Pro-audio is where the best bang for the buck is at.

 

[EIPtuningR32]

I've been pleased with this one. I got it on clearance for $200. It does have a couple of limitations.

Emotiva XDA 1 DAC | eBay

The replacement XDA-2 fixed those limitations and it is on sale now for $339.
XDA-2 USB DAC/Digital Preamp/Headphone Amp | Emotiva Audio Corporation | Emotiva Audio | High-end audio components for audiophiles and videophiles, spanning 2-channel music systems, as well as 5.1 and 7.1 home theaters. Products include multichannel

What are it's limitations? I was looking at the JBL LSR's, but in reading up on the Mackie MR8MK2's, it sounds like the Mackie's are the better option.

 

[slipperybidness]

What are it's limitations? I was looking at the JBL LSR's, but in reading up on the Mackie MR8MK2's, it sounds like the Mackie's are the better option.

1) The volume is implemented in the digital domain. At anything less than 100%, you actually lose resolution. This means you don't particularly want to use it as a preamp. Just leave volume maxed out on DAC and control it with preamp etc.

2) USB input "only" does 16 bits/48 KHz. Better specs on other inputs, in real-world listening this is quite possibly a moot point.

Like I said, the XDA-2 fixes these 2 items and throws in a headphone amp to boot.

What is it that makes you prefer the Mackies that you mentioned?

 

[EIPtuningR32]

I've been reading that the Mackie's are a very warm and true speaker (I love listening to female vocals in jazz music. although I am a huge pink Floyd fan). At the price point of the XDA-2 ($399) do you think it's the best option? That is a little high in price for me.

 

[shadyJ]

Why would you want a pre-amp? Unless there is a particular feature on it you want, it isn't going to do anything special for you since it sounds like you are only connecting your computer. And if you aren't using a digital audio out going from the computer to the pre-amp, it will sound awful- the pre-amp can't make bad audio jacks sound good. Any onboard analogue audio jacks in your computer are going to be crappy. You need a good sound interface if you are going to use analogue outs. And even if you are using a digital output, getting an Emotiva pre-amp is a very expensive and inefficient way of digital to analogue conversion for you. It would be far better to just use a pro-audio interface on your computer in that regard as well.

Also the Mackies are pretty neutral in sound, to be honest they sound a lot like the JBL LSR speakers. Guitar Center carries both lines of speaker, and some of their store locations have both up and ready to demo. If there is a Guitar Center near you, call it up and ask to speak to their pro-audio dept, and ask what speakers ready for demo. Any studio monitors that have anything other than a neutral sound are poorly designed. If you really want a high fidelity system, rely on the recording for warmth, not the speakers. You can not have speakers that are both warm and true.

 

[EIPtuningR32]

That does make sense. Now about the pro audio interface, is there anything better than the Lexicon Alfa? I could budget around $150-$200 for an audio interface.

 

[slipperybidness]

That does make sense. Now about the pro audio interface, is there anything better than the Lexicon Alfa? I could budget around $150-$200 for an audio interface.

ShadyJ is pointing you in the right direction, he is on point with all his advice. I was just mentioning another option on the DAC. I didn't tell him to buy a preamp, I just mentioned it as part of the limitations of the XDA-1, on powered monitors the input stage is basically a preamp (volume control anyway).

I have experience with the XDA but not with the interfaces that he has mentioned, but at those prices I certainly think it is worth a shot to see if it works out for you. i think you could also find a used XDA-1 and it would work out fine, but cost you more $ than the options he gave you.

 

[shadyJ]

That does make sense. Now about the pro audio interface, is there anything better than the Lexicon Alfa? I could budget around $150-$200 for an audio interface.

The Lexicon would be good, and of course there are better as the price goes higher, but, for the purposes of simple music playback, even the Lexicon is a bit overkill. It probably won't sound any better than the Behringer UCAs, it just has a couple more features that are a bit more convenient. The sound on any of these is going to be better than what human hearing can discern, so don't worry about sound quality. I would take that extra money and put it into the speakers, because that is what is going to determine the sound quality after you have a clean source. JBL LSRs, Mackies, both are very good. KRK is also a very good affordable brand. Although I haven't heard them, the Emotiva Airmotivs look good too, but I would want the 6s at the very least in that series, and those have a $100 discount at the moment. I like Adam and Genelec too for studio monitors, but they are pretty expensive, probably out of your budget.

 

[EIPtuningR32]

The Lexicon would be good, and of course there are better as the price goes higher, but, for the purposes of simple music playback, even the Lexicon is a bit overkill. It probably won't sound any better than the Behringer UCAs, it just has a couple more features that are a bit more convenient. The sound on any of these is going to be better than what human hearing can discern, so don't worry about sound quality. I would take that extra money and put it into the speakers, because that is what is going to determine the sound quality after you have a clean source. JBL LSRs, Mackies, both are very good. KRK is also a very good affordable brand. Although I haven't heard them, the Emotiva Airmotivs look good too, but I would want the 6s at the very least in that series, and those have a $100 discount at the moment. I like Adam and Genelec too for studio monitors, but they are pretty expensive, probably out of your budget.

I had also been looking at the Adam F7 speakers. However, they are slightly more expensive and the Guitar Center near me does not carry them. (They only carry the Mackie MR8MK2 and the LSR's). Are the Adam F7's worth the extra penny? I know they take great pride in their tweeter design. The F-series has paper woofers with a carbon coating (sounds like they spared expenses there). As for the Emotiva Airmotiv's, they sound like a speaker that is designed around high frequency clarity. I find myself preferring a speaker with upper-mid to lower-mid level clarity.

 

[markw]

"Warm" and "true" seem to be contradictory terms for a speaker. Now, "accurate" and "true", maybe, but "warm" implies an intentionsl softening of some frequencies, not unlike "mellow" or "subdued".

 

[EIPtuningR32]

"Warm" and "true" seem to be contradictory terms for a speaker. Now, "accurate" and "true", maybe, but "warm" implies an intentionsl softening of some frequencies, not unlike "mellow" or "subdued".

I guess I meant to say I would like a speaker to be accurate and as warm as possible. I don't want it to sound like it's playing behind a small puddle of water. I want female vocals in jazz music to give me goosebumps, all the while being able to accurately play SACD versions of Pink Floyd's animals, wish you were here, and dark side of the moon albums.

 

[shadyJ]

I had also been looking at the Adam F7 speakers. However, they are slightly more expensive and the Guitar Center near me does not carry them. (They only carry the Mackie MR8MK2 and the LSR's). Are the Adam F7's worth the extra penny? I know they take great pride in their tweeter design. The F-series has paper woofers with a carbon coating (sounds like they spared expenses there). As for the Emotiva Airmotiv's, they sound like a speaker that is designed around high frequency clarity. I find myself preferring a speaker with upper-mid to lower-mid level clarity.

The Adams I have heard are very good, I think they do have just a bit more detailed highs than the LSRs and Mackies, however they are twice as expensive. I am talking about the A models though, I haven't heard the F models. I would say the A ones have maybe something like ten percent better treble, but whether that is worth twice the price is up to you. Also, I wouldn't want a monitor designed around any particular frequency band, because if it is, it would make for a poor monitor. No studio monitor should have any range either emphasized or understated. It should be as neutral as possible.

 

[EIPtuningR32]

which do you think is a better choice: lsr2328p or the Mackie MR8MK2?