Anyone notice that 1080p looks so much better on a 4k tv?

AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Yeah, there are too many variables here.

This is analogous to comparing speakers purely based on memory, instead of side-by-side level-matching seconds apart.

All my Sony 4K TVs look great. But I don't think it's significantly better than a great 1080p source on a great 1080p TV.
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Warlord
Would you buy the Sony OLED even though the panel is LG?
LOL!

LG is strike #1!
Sony is strike #2!

2 brands that I personally avoid. ;)

Now, just maybe if it were a Panny OLED with an LG panel. To be fair, I haven't heard of OLED early failures yet, but I haven't gone looking for the failure rate yet either.
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Warlord
Factory calibration implies that one size fits all. The brightness and contrast you need and prefer in your home varies too much compared with what others want and need.
I agree with you. But, I also suspect that there is more part-to-part variation on TVs too.
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Warlord
LOL!

LG is strike #1!
Sony is strike #2!

2 brands that I personally avoid. ;)

Now, just maybe if it were a Panny OLED with an LG panel. To be fair, I haven't heard of OLED early failures yet, but I haven't gone looking for the failure rate yet either.
Yeah, I used to be very anti Sony and LG. LG just made expensive TVs that weren't that great. I was Panasonic all the way, but I'm not sure if they're going to try to get into OLED yet or not. They made some early OLED tvs, but they were LG panels and were around $20k or something like that.

Sony seems to be making quality stuff again for the first time (IMHO) since the Trinitron tube TVs. Took them long enough.
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Warlord
Yeah, I used to be very anti Sony and LG. LG just made expensive TVs that weren't that great. I was Panasonic all the way, but I'm not sure if they're going to try to get into OLED yet or not. They made some early OLED tvs, but they were LG panels and were around $20k or something like that.

Sony seems to be making quality stuff again for the first time (IMHO) since the Trinitron tube TVs. Took them long enough.
Sony has just burned me too many times over the years, I'll pass. Unless it's the Sony Playstation or the old-school Walkman, I'll pass.

I have never bought LG products, seems like I may have had an LG phone back in the days before smart phones. But, LG reliability scares me.

The fact that LG is really the only player for OLED is the only reason that I would consider LG.
 
2

2channel lover

Audioholic Field Marshall
I wouldn't even consider Vizio again. I tried them before I got my Samsung, had issues on three separate m-series models before I gave up on them. The first one had one of the dimming zones that was always brighter than the others, and a remote that would randomly stop responding, I'd have to unplug the tv for a half hour in order to get it to recognize the remote again. The second arrived with a shattered corner even though the box looked fine, not their fault I suspect. The third was ok at first, but after two weeks the issue with the remote not being recognized appeared again.
Can't blame you but Vizio is really about the the P series...M is just about moving boxes, marketshare.
 
2

2channel lover

Audioholic Field Marshall
Sony has just burned me too many times over the years, I'll pass. Unless it's the Sony Playstation or the old-school Walkman, I'll pass.

I have never bought LG products, seems like I may have had an LG phone back in the days before smart phones. But, LG reliability scares me.

The fact that LG is really the only player for OLED is the only reason that I would consider LG.
In LED...it's Samsung, or Sony...right now the android OS is better than Samsung, and motion engine imo is better...the picture is more subjective, but I prefer the more natural looking picture of Sony over Samsung. I have 2 Sony 4k sets.

That said, I have a Samsung plasma in my HT space and won't be changing it until it dies.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
I recently visited my in laws on vacation, they have a 1080p 55" tv. I recently purchased a cheap Vizio 55" M series 4k tv, and have mostly used it for 1080p Blu-ray playback using a Samsung upscaling bdp, which does a marvelous job in comparison to the internal scaler in the tv, or the scaler in my only TX NR 656.

Obviously, upscaling can't add detail that isn't already there, but what I did notice was a much more uniform and solid picture due to the increased pixel density. The whole image just looks more natural and sharper. With a 1080p display, I could very slightly make out the pixels, and the image just looked lower resolution.

With glasses I have 20/14 vision, so my ability to see a difference in pixel density is a bit better than someone with 20/20 vision. Both TVs we're viewed at a distance of about 9'. The Vizio M series is nothing special when it comes to color or contrast, so I'm pretty sure it wasn't just because it was a better display. It wasn't color, brightness, or contrast I noticed, just resolution. On the 55" 4k screen, I cannot make out the pixels until I am 5' away. On a 55" 1080p display, I have to sit almost 12' back to lose the ability to make out pixels.

My guess is that it looks better simply because it "depixelizes" the image.

Anyone who has used PC emulation software to play old SNES or N64 games at 1080p using scaling algorithms such a Super2xsai for texture upscaling, can attest to the fact that it looks 1000x better than the awful 256x224 native resolution, even though there isn't extra detail. It's a similar concept.

Anybody else with 4k TVs noticed a much better picture with upscaled 1080p content?

Sent from my 5065N using Tapatalk
It's because the TV up-converts the signal.
 
Y

yepimonfire

Audioholic Samurai
I keep waiting for them to become competitively priced! Maybe next year now that there are a few more players in the OLED field...
Just a year or two ago 4k was prohibitively expensive, now it's about the same as 1080p, and more and more manufacturers are trimming down 1080p TV's and 4k is becoming the new standard. I can only imagine oled will follow suit.

Sent from my 5065N using Tapatalk
 
Y

yepimonfire

Audioholic Samurai
It's because the TV up-converts the signal.
Yes. I still believe the difference is more than just better display tech. Like I said, there's not any more detail, but the image in general looks much more "solid" since the pixel density is so high. I also noticed back when I got my first HDTV that upconverted DVDs looked better, even though early HDTVs sucked compared to CRTs.

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highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
Yes. I still believe the difference is more than just better display tech. Like I said, there's not any more detail, but the image in general looks much more "solid" since the pixel density is so high. I also noticed back when I got my first HDTV that upconverted DVDs looked better, even though early HDTVs sucked compared to CRTs.

Sent from my 5065N using Tapatalk
Does it do 8 bit color, or 10 bit? That makes a big difference-10 bit color and brightness increments are much smaller, so it loses the halo effect in scenes with a single light source, like the Sun, Moon, street lights, etc.
 
NINaudio

NINaudio

Audioholic Samurai
Can't blame you but Vizio is really about the the P series...M is just about moving boxes, marketshare.
I would have thought the box mover was the e-series since that is their cheapest? Either way, it left a bad taste in my mouth and I'm not going back for fourths! lol
 
Y

yepimonfire

Audioholic Samurai
I'll say that HDR content looks better than my Panny, but regular 1080p has a lot of catching up to do. My sony 700D LCD is nice, but it was super cheap and I got it to see if my PC could play my games @4k resolution.

That and I wanted to play with HDR. I will say, this LCD is MUCH better than most I've seen in the past. The tech still sucks, but it has gotten MUCH better.

Having said that, Vizio may not be a top tier brand (LG, Samsung, Sony) but they do make a great TV for the money. The cheapo 70" looks very good for a $1200 TV. Warranty after purchase is what you have to worry about with Vizio. Not that they won't support it, just their conditions are (or used to be, I haven't kept up) a bit over the top when it comes to getting the TV serviced. I'd buy a vizio with an extended warranty in a heartbeat if I just wanted a TV somewhere.

I do love Android TV in my Sony though...
One thing I really like about the vizios is their full array local dimming.

Sent from my 5065N using Tapatalk
 
Y

yepimonfire

Audioholic Samurai
Does it do 8 bit color, or 10 bit? That makes a big difference-10 bit color and brightness increments are much smaller, so it loses the halo effect in scenes with a single light source, like the Sun, Moon, street lights, etc.
It does, but HDR only works with certain bluray players. I don't have an UHD BPD yet, my only source for 4k content is a roku, which will not recognize the TV as HDR compatible. It also doesn't have the nits required to fully display HDR, though it's better than a run of the mill 1080p TV.

Honestly, I just wanted a larger display, and got it on overstock for about $350, which wasn't much more than a similarly sized (55") 1080p TV on the same site, so I just grabbed it. I can definitely see a difference between 1080p and 4k, but I have yet to see how HDR and 10bit color looks on it.

I'm kind of waiting for the industry to fully adopt 4k as standard to really invest in a better TV, along with prices to go down. TV's are getting cheaper, UHD bdps are still pretty pricey in comparison, and there's way too much fake 4k releases.

I've always felt that the audio side of home theater was much more immersive than the video anyways, so that's where my funds have always gone towards.

Sent from my 5065N using Tapatalk
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
It does, but HDR only works with certain bluray players. I don't have an UHD BPD yet, my only source for 4k content is a roku, which will not recognize the TV as HDR compatible. It also doesn't have the nits required to fully display HDR, though it's better than a run of the mill 1080p TV.

Honestly, I just wanted a larger display, and got it on overstock for about $350, which wasn't much more than a similarly sized (55") 1080p TV on the same site, so I just grabbed it. I can definitely see a difference between 1080p and 4k, but I have yet to see how HDR and 10bit color looks on it.

I'm kind of waiting for the industry to fully adopt 4k as standard to really invest in a better TV, along with prices to go down. TV's are getting cheaper, UHD bdps are still pretty pricey in comparison, and there's way too much fake 4k releases.

I've always felt that the audio side of home theater was much more immersive than the video anyways, so that's where my funds have always gone towards.

Sent from my 5065N using Tapatalk

If you like it, keep it- that's really the only determining factor in any of this. Specs are for people who are designing, building, selling or buying something- once it's in place, the specs are academic.
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Slumlord
I've been reading about Android tv? Is that an app or is it an actual tv?
 
NINaudio

NINaudio

Audioholic Samurai
I've been reading about Android tv? Is that an app or is it an actual tv?
Neither? It can be implemented in a TV's software suite or in a standalone streamer like my Shield TV, but I don't believe you can download it to your phone.
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Slumlord
Neither? It can be implemented in a TV's software suite or in a standalone streamer like my Shield TV, but I don't believe you can download it to your phone.
Ahh... something I don't need. I gotcha. :p
 
NINaudio

NINaudio

Audioholic Samurai
Ahh... something I don't need. I gotcha. :p
I got my Shield TV so I could stream games from my pc to the big screen and audio system. You can install apps onto it, like pandora, spotify, netflix, etc. :) It has since become my go to hub when not watching something on cable. I just recently reripped my cd collection into FLAC and stored it on my shield for playback.

I still need to learn more about what I can do with it, I know there is a lot of functionality I'm not using. For example, it has plex built in, which I hear is an awesome thing...
 
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