Yamaha Pro Amps

[sgtpepper9]

So I've been reading up on amps and I've read quite a few recommendations on Yamaha Pro amps. Specifically the P2500s, I see that they are like $450 for a 2 channel amp (correct?), which is significantly cheaper and while offering more power than Emotiva, Outlaw, NAD, etc. which are generally considered to be good bang for buck amps. I'm wondering what gives? Is it aesthetics? I think the pro amps look pretty cool. Is there something I'm missing? (cue for wmax to come drop some knowledge on me )

 

[sgtpepper9]

No one? Really?

 

[JerryLove]

Don't know what to tell you. I've got a pile and they work great.

The Emotiva are pretty close (125Wx2 = $299, less on sale). But it would not be surprising at all that the much higher sales rate, and price pressure, of the Yammy Pro-amps help keep their costs down.

May be the class of amp as well (I believe Yammys are Class D).

 

[mike c]

except for the connections and input signal differences ... you're not missing anything.

fire when ready

 

[KEW]

So I've been reading up on amps and I've read quite a few recommendations on Yamaha Pro amps. Specifically the P2500s, I see that they are like $450 for a 2 channel amp (correct?), which is significantly cheaper and while offering more power than Emotiva, Outlaw, NAD, etc. which are generally considered to be good bang for buck amps. I'm wondering what gives? Is it aesthetics? I think the pro amps look pretty cool. Is there something I'm missing? (cue for wmax to come drop some knowledge on me )

My impression is that fundamentally, pro amps have developed under the practical attitude of "what works" to produce the sound quality that the musicians/engineers are happy with. If they see the shiny finish of a thick aluminum plate, they see wasted money.

Yamaha is on the short list of pro amps that tend to run quiet (fan noise) and has a relatively finished look (many others look like some type of low profile space heater). Nonetheless, the Yamahas will not blend in with the typical black or silver audio gear the way an audiophile amp will, but they give great bang for the buck.

As Jerry Love pointed out, they are class D (Yamaha calls it EEEngine, but it is simply a variant of class D). The short of this is that they are very efficient compared to the other common types of amps.

 

[lsiberian]

It's a very good amp and probably a safer bet than an Emotiva, but it isn't pretty and doesn't have any 12v triggers. Wmax uses these amps and I think that fact pretty much sums it up. They are powerful, quiet and reliable.

I will tell you that lifting a pro-amp to put it in your rack is a very adrenaline filled experience the first time.

 

[mike c]

i don't know what kind of amp it is, but it's hilariously heavy for a class d amp.

 

[WmAx]

They are not class D. They have AB class output stages, just like 99% of audiophile amps. The power supply is infinitely variable to the supply rails, and this is what lowers heat and increases efficiency. It is similar to class H (a common pro amp type), which has class AB output stages and 2 supply rail voltages that switch according to the output level required at any given time. The Yamaha simply takes the same concept and further increases efficiency by using a continuously infinite variable supply rail voltage.

-Chris

 

[WmAx]

So I've been reading up on amps and I've read quite a few recommendations on Yamaha Pro amps. Specifically the P2500s, I see that they are like $450 for a 2 channel amp (correct?), which is significantly cheaper and while offering more power than Emotiva, Outlaw, NAD, etc. which are generally considered to be good bang for buck amps. I'm wondering what gives? Is it aesthetics? I think the pro amps look pretty cool. Is there something I'm missing? (cue for wmax to come drop some knowledge on me )

The Yamaha amps are also made better and more rugged than most home amps. They have fans like most pro amps, but the fans will not come on unless you overheat them, and then, it's a variable speed fan. I have tested these under strenuous real world conditions in order to try to get the fans to come on and I could not succeed.

The Yamaha amps, pay attention, are rated 20Hz-20,000Hz, both channels driven. Most amps are rated at 1kHz, which produces a higher 'watt' rating. So, the 250 x 2 (8 Ohm) P2500S would be equivalent to a common 280-300 watt x 2 amp that uses a 1kHz rating. Just a FYI.

BTW, the rack mount ears on the side of the amp come off for installation in a regular consumer stereo rack/shelf if so desired.

If feeding the Yamaha pro amps from a RCA pre-out, you need to use an adapter to change the line level voltage to the ideal level for the pro amp, or you may experience noise(hiss) or possibly not be able to use the full power of the pro amp. The Samson S-Convert is a good unit to consider. Using the S-Convert, you don't need any special adapter cables. It has RCA in/out and XLR in/out. You simply feed it with your standard RCA patch cables and use standard XLR patch cables on the output side to feed the amp.

-Chris

 

[JerryLove]

The Yamaha amps are also made better and more rugged than most home amps. They have fans like most pro amps, but the fans will not come on unless you overheat them, and then, it's a variable speed fan. I have tested these under strenuous real world conditions in order to try to get the fans to come on and I could not succeed.

I'll second that. They are completely quiet in every operation I've managed to challenge them with.

 

[KEW]

They are not class D. They have AB class output stages, just like 99% of audiophile amps. The power supply is infinitely variable to the supply rails, and this is what lowers heat and increases efficiency. It is similar to class H (a common pro amp type), which has class AB output stages and 2 supply rail voltages that switch according to the output level required at any given time. The Yamaha simply takes the same concept and further increases efficiency by using a continuously infinite variable supply rail voltage.

-Chris

I'm sorry. I was mistaken.
I had understood that any class designation of D or higher was essentially a variation of class D technology.
Thanks for the explanation. That is much clearer than Yamaha's explanation of EEEngine.

 

[sgtpepper9]

Thanks for the replies everyone. Especially the information on the necessary adapters for the hook ups. I honestly could care less about the aesthetics, it's just gonna be sitting on my equipment rack in the corner of the room. I think this will be the route I go whenever I get around (save up some money) to getting more power. They just seem like to be a beast for what you pay for. Again, thanks for all the info.

 

[Hi Ho]

I haven't used it in a home setting but I own a Yamaha P5000S which I use for live sound. It is one awesome amp. It runs cool. I don't recall the fans ever coming on even after 4-5 hours of continuous hard use.

The only drawback I can imagine when using one of these amps in a home theater is that there is no remote power on/off capability.

 

[chris357]

would these use less electricty?

 

[WaynePflughaupt]

Another amp in the P2500’s price range that might be worth considering, that doesn’t stick out like a sore thumb in a home audio system, is the Carvin DCM-1000L or 1540L. The latter is priced comparably to the P2500 and has 425 wpc @8 ohms and 750 @ 4 ohms. The 1000 is cheaper than the 2500, albeit with a bit less power.

I picked up a 1540 last year to replace an Adcom GFA-555II that I was using to drive my subs. The Carvin is half the size and twice the power of the Adcom, and quieter to boot. At a mere 14 lbs, it’s half the weight as well. To give you an idea of just how light that is, the last cassette deck I had in my system, a higher-end Pioneer model, weighed 13 lbs.

The Carvins have good sensitivity for pro amps and shouldn’t require an S-convert. My Yamaha receiver has a fairly typical 1V maximum signal from its main-channel outputs, and I was able to gain-match its internal amplifier to the DCM with the latter’s gain controls in the 12-o’clock position.

A couple of potential caveats, I haven’t tried it with my main channels, so I can’t say if its sonics are pristine enough for that. And there is a bit of fan noise, but it’s barely audible with the system muted at our listening position 12 feet away from the equipment. Unmuted, I don't even notice it.

The only drawback I can imagine when using one of these amps in a home theater is that there is no remote power on/off capability.

I use a vintage sequencing Adcom ACE-515 for switching. I think Panamax makes a similar unit.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[MidnightSensi]

would these use less electricty?

For pro-amps, the consideration for effeciency is generally to allow you to run more power amps on a given breaker size. So, I'm not sure how that translates into cost of electricity, but I imagine a more efficient amp would be more efficient on your wallet.

 

[zman1974]

Does anyone know how long the power cord is that is attached to the Yamaha pro amps? Weird they didn't have a detachable receptacle...

 

[WmAx]

Does anyone know how long the power cord is that is attached to the Yamaha pro amps? Weird they didn't have a detachable receptacle...

????????

I believe at least 6' if I remember correctly.

-Chris

 

[zman1974]

????????

I believe at least 6' if I remember correctly.

-Chris

Thanks. I thought it was non-detachable, but I couldn't find the length anywhere.

 

[Seth=L]

Weird they didn't have a detachable receptacle...

Yeah, pro-amps and the exotic power cord market don't exactly mix.