Why is there never any test data?

[Buckle-meister]

...and Heaven is not a place...

Sure it is. Just pop across to Skye and you'll see for yourself.

There is still so much we don't understand - about astrology, cures for diseases, science, our spouses , and religion.

Don't forget...Hi-Fi/Home Theater.

...we are insignificant in the whole scheme of things.

Yet immeasureably precious.

The universe if a vast place, and who are we to think we are the supreme beings.

It is not that we think we are supreme beings at all.

Why should we be saved and not that spider you just stepped on near the cat litter?

I don't step on spiders , except by accident , in which case I am excused.

IMHO, people use faith out of fear moreso than being brainwashed.

You imply that the majority who follow a faith do so for the wrong reasons. I do not agree.

Regards

 

[Nick250]

IMHO, people use faith out of fear moreso than being brainwashed. There's always that "what if I were wrong and didn't believe?" How bad would it $uck to be eternally stuck in pergatory while the wife, kids, family, friends, the cactus plant, and Fido are hanging out in Heaven, sippen on Molsen watching re-runs of Seinfield/ Had to throw in a little humor.

I identify with Blaise Pascal (sp?) who said "I do not believe in a God, but I live my life as though there were one in case I am wrong" (or words to that effect). In other words, I am hopeful about an after life. Also, I like having a moral compass and ideas from religions (mostly Christianity) help me with that.

 

[miklorsmith]

Re: Believers in religion vs. audio. I am definitely a non-believer in religion, and mark that on your calendar because Mtry and I agree for once. However, my grandmother is faithful and it brings her peace and happiness, which I wouldn't take from anyone. Now, world domination based on those ideas is another matter. . .

But, I've found these same demands of proof impractical in seeking better sound. I want to believe, and am always looking to improve. But, I don't go out buying any magic chips either. This quest has led me to extraordinary low-power sound that would have been impossible with a strict "prove it" mentality.

 

[jaxvon]

I think the general problem with the whole "tweak" market is that companies charge exorbitant amounts of money for products that probably don't make a difference. I understand that audio is a personal endeavor that is all about satisfying ones own wants and tastes. Some people find that what they like is tubes and high-efficiency speakers. Other love big, power hungry planars with kilowatt amps. Whatever you do to get "The Sound" is your own decision. But when companies start marketing products at 1000% markup and justify the cost with bad science, it tends to make people like me a little sore.

 

[Spiffyfast]

I think the general problem with the whole "tweak" market is that companies charge exorbitant amounts of money for products that probably don't make a difference. I understand that audio is a personal endeavor that is all about satisfying ones own wants and tastes. Some people find that what they like is tubes and high-efficiency speakers. Other love big, power hungry planars with kilowatt amps. Whatever you do to get "The Sound" is your own decision. But when companies start marketing products at 1000% markup and justify the cost with bad science, it tends to make people like me a little sore.

But if people have enough money to buy something and enough ppl want it I say good job to those who get away with selling the stuff, they did something right to make a sale for something that probably has absolutely no value at all.

 

[miklorsmith]

Value - Beholder

If somebody pays $350 for a wooden volume knob and says it improves their $5k preamp sufficiently to justify the price, who are we to say it doen't have value? The concept of value is in the ear of the beholder. Many people worldwide would be in disbelief with ANY of our systems and how much they cost. They'd perceive the value of some metal gadgetry vs. their need for food as zero, unless they could sell it.

Granted, that's not our reality, and our society allows for such niceties without sacrificing food or shelter. But, the question of Value is one that is entirely personal and situational. Does this sentence make sense: "That item has no value to you"? No.

You won't convice the knob-owner he's wrong, nor will he ever make you believe there's a difference. The discussion (if there is one with this person) is doomed from the start, much like religious or political discussions that never convince the other side. This comes down to the gaping yaw mentioned earlier.

Where a particular "believer" or nonbeliever draws the line is their personal choice. I doubt there are many of us that believes every single [fill in blank] is beneficial and suspect very few of us (not here, but generally) doubt every single [fill in blank] is immaterial.

Again - discussions of probable merit are valid, slamming customers as dumb or gullible is pointless. It's their hobby too, and they get to decide how to enjoy it, as Jaxvon said. They aren't spending your money and you don't have to live with their system, so give these folks a break.

 

[Buckle-meister]

...if people have enough money to buy something and enough ppl want it I say good job to those who get away with selling the stuff, they did something right to make a sale for something that probably has absolutely no value at all.

Value, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder.

Regards

EDIT: Micklorsmith, it seems we think alike!

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

Education and research helps thwart out misinformation (and snake oil). The better educated one is, and the more she researches a topic, the better her final decision will be. I still believe "a fool and his money are soon parted." That's what makes this a great site. As irritating as some of us are, it raises that eyebrow and makes us think for a moment. The longer one spends at this site, the more information they gain into making a great decision on those A/V purchases.

As far as value goes, value has many different meanings. For instance, I value my family's health over my set of golf clubs or Denon receiver. How do you put a price on health? (Ask an actuarial professional ) The keys to my car may not have that great of value (less than $10), but should I lose them and the spare set, they have great value. Then there's the time value of money. If I spend 2 months and countless hours trying to save $75 on a set of $800 speakers, did I really save anything? What could I have been doing had I just bit the bullet and paid the extra $75? Worked a little OT and bought the next line up? Some items have perceived value, as opposed to real value. A life insurance policy is a bad investment until one's family needs it. The peace of mind it gives may be enough value in itself.

 

[mtrycrafts]

I am definitely a non-believer in religion, and mark that on your calendar because Mtry and I agree for once.

Yep so noted
We discuss enough that by chance we will agree on a number of different ideas

However, my grandmother is faithful and it brings her peace and happiness, which I wouldn't take from anyone.

Me neither
And, it is hard to keep quiet when it comes up in conversation at home, at friends places. Get in trouble, hard to let it pass

 

[mtrycrafts]

Been a while since you posted. Get back in here and start posting.
We need your thoughts on issues