What will I be missing if I use only floorstanders and the center channel for my setup?

[wannabelean]

Setting up a HT For my parents. They hate the booms from the sub woofer. They are saying they are not interested in surround sound too. All they say they want is basic sound(sometimes loud) and a big picture.

Anybody attempted a setup like this?

 

[fuzz092888]

Setting up a HT For my parents. They hate the booms from the sub woofer. They are saying they are not interested in surround sound too. All they say they want is basic sound(sometimes loud) and a big picture.

Anybody attempted a setup like this?

A common misconception is that subwoofers are boomy and that's because the average person hasn't hear a real subwoofer that's been dialed in. The problem is that without a subwoofer you need your front L/R towers to be able to play down to about 30-40hz, which can be difficult depending on the budget, but is definitely doable. What is the budget and what do they need? You can really get by with a pair of towers and a receiver, this way you can max out the speaker part of the budget and just run a phantom center. You are asking a lot of the towers in a setup like this though.

 

[Adam]

I'll add this - I have bookshelf speakers that are rated down to 53Hz at -3dB, so they definitely don't troll the depths. However, for a lot of things, they sound great without a sub. I do have a sub (two, actually), but I wanted to throw in my two cents that you could definitely put together an enjoyable setup with just two front towers. Sometimes I'll choose to listen to music without the sub on. In fact, sometimes I've forgotten to turn the sub back on, and I'll watch TV and movies for a couple of days before I realize it. So, in a way, I have tried out a setup like that.

Fuzz is right about the boominess. That's often setup related, unless your parents actually just don't like the lower frequencies to be very loud.

 

[Irvrobinson]

I don't use surrounds, a sub, or a center for my video system, and I find it adequate for most dramas, which are our movies of choice. The speakers are above and behind the monitor, so we don't even need a center, and it's only a 40" monitor anyway. For action films you miss a lot if you leave off surrounds and a sub, especially a sub, but if they don't want all of that stuff why push it on them? For a large monitor, like anything larger than 60", a center might be advantageous, unless they always sit midway between the mains. If you choose reasonably good floor standing mains and set the AVR to "large" during the mains speaker set-up, you'll get adequate bass for most non-action-thriller movies.

I recently advised a friend on his HT system, and he went with only main speakers so they he could maximize his budget on the most important components. More interestingly, he found a used set of B&W 802 Matrix speakers in perfect condition locally for about $1200, and he thinks he's in HT heaven on the cheap. I haven't heard his system, he doesn't live near me, but the point is there are a lot of people who do HT with just two speakers.

 

[Pyrrho]

As others have said, you can do a 3 channel or 2 channel system and it can work well. For a long time, I used a 2 channel system with my TV. Surround is better, but it adds cost and complexity, plus there is the issue of the speaker placement and wires. Frankly, I think most people should consider converting an extra bedroom (or other such extra room) into a home theater instead of doing it in the living room, as it isn't generally esthetically pleasing, but it does matter for the sound.

As for a subwoofer being "boomy," as fuzz092888 observes above, if one has a quality subwoofer that is properly adjusted, it will not be boomy. It will just add depth to the bass performance that one gets. Many people, however, do set their subwoofers too loud for a natural sound, and they have boomy sound. But that is their choice, not something inherent to having a subwoofer.

For the money, I generally think that getting bookshelf speakers and a subwoofer is the best way to go, because the main speakers do not need to reproduce deep bass if one has a decent subwoofer. And I like using an identical bookshelf speaker for the center channel (oriented vertically, like the front right and left speakers), as it then gives perfect voice matching, instead of something that is only similar in sound. But what people should get always depends on budget and the particular goals the people have.

 

[ImcLoud]

I really like having my center channel and surrounds with sub... I have to agree with Fuzz a properly sized, tuned and placed sub will not give the boomy output that some people think of when they think "subwoofer", I find undersized subs pushed past their limits sound terrible and would be better off turned way down or shut off..

But you can make a really nice system with just 2 channels, set the avr to phantom center, and get some towers that dig deep... Play with the room and settings and if you start with the rite stuff you will have good results...

What does their budget look like?

I would personally talk them into a subwoofer, a simple pair of Ascend Sierra 1 bookshelfs, an HSU VTF2, and pioneer 1222K receiver, tuned rite would be decent...

But I would say if I wasn't going to run a sub I would use a pair of Tekton Lores or even Mini Lores and a a good AVR... My lores sound really good playing TV, and if they are ever going to listen loud, them are the speakers to have for sure... Plus they are very easy to drive, you can pick any avr on the market to drive them effortlessly, I use a 20x20w amp for mine and they can go so loud you wouldn't want to be in the room..

If they are OK with used I remember a friend of mine had a 3ch system no sub he had Mirage OM {maybe 5 or 9, can't remember] and they sounded great with no sub, you can get them used on ebay for $600 a pair...

 

[wannabelean]

A common misconception is that subwoofers are boomy and that's because the average person hasn't hear a real subwoofer that's been dialed in. The problem is that without a subwoofer you need your front L/R towers to be able to play down to about 30-40hz, which can be difficult depending on the budget, but is definitely doable. What is the budget and what do they need? You can really get by with a pair of towers and a receiver, this way you can max out the speaker part of the budget and just run a phantom center. You are asking a lot of the towers in a setup like this though.

That's great! Budget for the speaker plus receiver is about $5k. The available brands around our location are :

Denon
Marantz
Yamaha
Polk
Monitor Audio
KEF

I'm looking at Polk Audio's LSIM 707

 

[lsiberian]

Give them the best pair of speakers they can get and don't worry about subs. For 5k you can get amazing speakers.

KEF is the best speaker brand you listed. You might check out Salks. Dennis Murphy knows his speakers.

 

[fuzz092888]

Give them the best pair of speakers they can get and don't worry about subs. For 5k you can get amazing speakers.

KEF is the best speaker brand you listed. You might check out Salks. Dennis Murphy knows his speakers.

I completely agree. For that kind of money you can get floorstanders that will play full range and won't leave you missing a subwoofer. Out of what you listed I would pick Kef. As far as internet direct brands (where you can usually maximize the money you spend) I would suggest:

http://www.philharmonicaudio.comsalksound.com
SalkSound home page
Sierra Tower Bamboo Loudspeaker
Ultra Tower - SVS
Floor speakers
http://vonschweikertaudio.com/products/

There are a ton of excellent options out there all around your price point.

 

[wannabelean]

Give them the best pair of speakers they can get and don't worry about subs. For 5k you can get amazing speakers.

KEF is the best speaker brand you listed. You might check out Salks. Dennis Murphy knows his speakers.

Thanks. As a minimum is the center channel too required? Or should I just the best floorstanders for my budget ?

 

[fuzz092888]

Thanks. As a minimum is the center channel too required? Or should I just the best floorstanders for my budget ?

Center channel is not an absolute requirement. Running a phantom center (just the two towers) sounds fine in most situations. Whether or not you need a center is usually personal preference. If, however, you or they are worried about it, simply purchase a pair of towers for somewhere around 2/3's to 3/4's of the budget, which should leave you more than enough for a center if they feel they need it.

 

[Adam]

A center channel is most valuable if you set off-axis, away from the center line of the two main speakers. If people tend to sit near that center line, it can be difficult to tell between running a phantom center and actually having a center. If you sit off to the side, it's easier to tell.

 

[Pyrrho]

Thanks. As a minimum is the center channel too required? Or should I just the best floorstanders for my budget ?

If they are going to just use them for TV sound, and not for music generally, you can place the speakers right next to the TV on either side, and then a center channel will not be terribly important. The main reason to have a center channel speaker is to anchor the dialog to the screęn, but if the right and left speakers are practically touching either side, the dialog is going to be decently anchored to the screęn regardless of whether one has a center channel speaker or not. I suppose if they have a really huge screęn from having a great front projęctor, then they might want a center channel speaker even so, but it would not be essential.

If you have your own home theater, I recommend that you experiment with it, shutting off your center speaker, and judge how it sounds that way. And think about how far your right and left speakers are from your screęn, perhaps trying them up next to your TV, without the center channel speaker. Obviously, this will all involve reconfiguring your system to do the tests, and then putting everything back as it is now.

 

[psbfan9]

Another option to consider would be powered speakers. You plug them in to the tv and there's no receiver for your parents to figure out how to set up. May be a simple option if they don't want to mess with having another remote and just want decent sound.

These have excellent reviews and well within their budget. Okay, they are well under the budget. Don't let the price fool you, these are very good speakers.

Vanatoo | Technology Serving Art

 

[wannabelean]

Thank you all for the advice. The projector is Panny AE8000. They just want it to be a media/hangout room. When they watch movies, they say a theatre experience is not required but they would like to hear everything clearly and loud.

I'm going to see the KEF 203/2 tomo. How is Polk's LSIM series?

 

[fuzz092888]

It's not supposed to be bad, pretty good actually. Just not the best you can do for the money.

 

[fmw]

Thanks. As a minimum is the center channel too required? Or should I just the best floorstanders for my budget ?

The center channel carries mostly dialogue. If you don't activate the center channel, the dialog will come from both main speakers. My bedroom system has just two floor standers. I get no surround sound and having the dialogue come from the two sides doesn't seem to be bothersome. The floor standers (10" woofers) produce enough bass to get most of the LFE. It isn't as exciting as the subwoofer in the family room but it is there. In a nutshell, if I had to compromise the quality of the floorstanders in order get a center channel, I would forego the center channel. Others may disagree.

 

[Irvrobinson]

Thank you all for the advice. The projector is Panny AE8000. They just want it to be a media/hangout room. When they watch movies, they say a theatre experience is not required but they would like to hear everything clearly and loud.

I'm going to see the KEF 203/2 tomo. How is Polk's LSIM series?

If they'll be using a projector I'm assuming the screen is pretty big; a center speaker would be more likely to be a good idea.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Setting up a HT For my parents. They hate the booms from the sub woofer. They are saying they are not interested in surround sound too. All they say they want is basic sound(sometimes loud) and a big picture.

Anybody attempted a setup like this?

Parents. They still just don't understand.

Just get them five NHT SuperZero on sale for $60 each (MSRP $120 each), so $300 total delivered.

SuperZero 2.0 | Bookshelf Speakers | Premium Audio Equipment

If they don't really care for a lot of bass, then just get them a little $350 NHT sub to have full sound.

Super 8 Powered Subwoofer | Home Theater | Premium Audio Equipment

I mean, come on, $650 total delivered for a nice little 5.1 setup.

Parents. Please.

 

[Adam]

Parents. They still just don't understand.

The Fresh Prince, ladies and gentlemen.