U.S. Abandons Eastern European Missle Shield

[Davemcc]

the occupation of Arab land (Palestine, Golan Heights and for some hardliners East Jerusalem) should stop and you don't need a road map for this.

Perhaps you are unaware that Israel occupied these lands at the conclusion of wars in which they were attacked. These lands are strategic in the sense that they are used to stage and launch attacks on Israel, particularly the Golan Heights. Israel continues to hold those lands to prevent them from being used against them in the future. Israel has no obligation to give up that territory without assurance that it won't be used to attack them again in the future.

 

[Jeepers]

Perhaps you are unaware that Israel occupied these lands at the conclusion of wars in which they were attacked. These lands are strategic in the sense that they are used to stage and launch attacks on Israel, particularly the Golan Heights. Israel continues to hold those lands to prevent them from being used against them in the future. Israel has no obligation to give up that territory without assurance that it won't be used to attack them again in the future.

I am very well aware of this and I completely agree with you. Didn't president Assad (the father of the current one) offer a full peace to Israel for a complete return of the Golan Heights ? I know we shouldn't be too naive but a solution can only be achieved with a conference including all involved parties whereby all Arab/Muslim states of the region should accept the existence of Israel and its right to defend itself and Israel (and the US) to accept a withdrawel to the situation of 1967 and the existence of a Palestinian state. Anything else will in my view not lead to any peace.

 

[Davemcc]

I am very well aware of this and I completely agree with you. Didn't president Assad (the father of the current one) offer a full peace to Israel for a complete return of the Golan Heights ? I know we shouldn't be too naive but a solution can only be achieved with a conference including all involved parties whereby all Arab/Muslim states of the region should accept the existence of Israel and its right to defend itself and Israel (and the US) to accept a withdrawel to the situation of 1967 and the existence of a Palestinian state. Anything else will in my view not lead to any peace.

Oh, I think I found the problem with that plan.

 

[Jeepers]

Oh, I think I found the problem with that plan.

I know and the same applies to Israel not willing to withdraw completely. Nobody says it will be easy. By the way, what's your plan for the Middle East problems ?

 

[rnatalli]

Here's my plan. Get the country off Middle-East oil and leave them to kill each other.

 

[Rickster71]

Here's my plan. Get the country off Middle-East oil and leave them to kill each other.

Agreed.^
It's been a very, very expensive relationship. With the US being on the losing end.

 

[Davemcc]

By the way, what's your plan for the Middle East problems ?

A plan??? Having a plan implies that you're dealing with rational people that can follow a previously agreed course of action.

Until we can count on rational and peaceful behavior from Israel's Arab neighbors, the plan is to continue the status quo. That is, support Israel as a modern, peaceful democracy until it's neighbors fully join the ranks of peaceful, tolerant nations and fully recognize Israel's right to exist.

 

[Jeepers]

A plan??? Having a plan implies that you're dealing with rational people that can follow a previously agreed course of action.

Until we can count on rational and peaceful behavior from Israel's Arab neighbors, the plan is to continue the status quo. That is, support Israel as a modern, peaceful democracy until it's neighbors fully join the ranks of peaceful, tolerant nations and fully recognize Israel's right to exist.

Peaceful ? Sure ... expanding settlements on occupied terrority is a perfect example of a peaceful tolerant democracy. So let's go to the hypothetical phase; what if (if that would indeed ever happen) Israel's Arab neighbours would recognize Israel's right to exist; would you agree that Israel should withdraw completely from the territories occupied in 1967 and if not; why not ?

 

[Davemcc]

So let's go to the hypothetical phase; what if (if that would indeed ever happen) Israel's Arab neighbours would recognize Israel's right to exist; would you agree that Israel should withdraw completely from the territories occupied in 1967 and if not; why not ?

Sure, if you want to completely ignore the course of modern history, the absence on reason by the leadership of the local fundamentalist Islamic republics and the unpredictability of human nature, I would say that if Israel's borders were secure from it's enemies and it's population safe from violent assaults, then Israel should most definitely give up those territories. However, in the world of experience and reality, those territories should not be given up until Israel's legitimate security concerns are allayed.

 

[Jeepers]

Sure, if you want to completely ignore the course of modern history, the absence on reason by the leadership of the local fundamentalist Islamic republics and the unpredictability of human nature, I would say that if Israel's borders were secure from it's enemies and it's population safe from violent assaults, then Israel should most definitely give up those territories. However, in the world of experience and reality, those territories should not be given up until Israel's legitimate security concerns are allayed.

I agree with this.

 

[lsiberian]

Here's my plan. Get the country off Middle-East oil and leave them to kill each other.

While we are at it we should get our country off Foreign Bananas!!!

We get are oil from OPEC not just the middle east. This includes Africa, South America, Russia and other places.

Furthermore Oil isn't the main issue anyway. We were involved long before the Oil problems came about. We are trying to prevent genocide in the region. The Jewish community is a very large and powerful voting block.

 

[rnatalli]

http://washingtontimes.com/news/2009/sep/24/obama-russia-may-bless-iran-sanctions/?feat=home_themes_tab2_list

And it begins...

 

[lsiberian]

http://washingtontimes.com/news/2009/sep/24/obama-russia-may-bless-iran-sanctions/?feat=home_themes_tab2_list

And it begins...

Just shoot this guy. His own people don't even want him.

 

[Jeepers]

Just shoot this guy. His own people don't even want him.

Remember your post 245 from the thread 'Man vs God' ?

"We can all read Galatians 5:22-23 where the fruit of the Spirit (the identifying traits of a believer) are unconditional love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness and self-control. If you see claimed Christian acting outside these bounds do me a favor and ask them why they don't act like Galatians 5.

Despite my appeared tone at times I want you all to know you're truly welcome at my place or even on pm at anytime. I also invite anyone to call me out when you think I act outside those bounds. That is the code I seek to live by everyday and it's that lifestyle that is truly Christian. Not crusading, condemning, hating, burning, and violence. Jesus was the one who coined the golden rule and said to love your enemies. This is an uphill battle for us all, but what we should aim for in all things.

I realize I got a bit preachy, but I'm training to be a preacher so suit somebody."


You're herewith called out.

 

[rnatalli]

http://www.reuters.com/article/GCA-Iran/idUSTRE58O45720090925

More news from Russia.

 

[rnatalli]

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/22/world/europe/22biden.html

Poland still getting interceptor missiles.