Tour de france

[billy p]

or should it be "farce" Floyd Landis tests positive

 

[rr2465]

Disappointment

or should it be "farce" Floyd Landis tests positive

I'm totally disappointed if these results for Landis stand.

Then again we're watching juiced players in MLB everyday, right?

 

[billy p]

Not Only Mlb

but just before the start of the tour several guys were DQ for guilty by assocation scandal. I guess it's the win at all cost attitude in todays society to blame!! Even with a drug policy in place!

 

[Audioholics]

I thought that France just naturally claimed doping every time an American wins?

 

[Bryce_H]

During the tour they did an interesting comparison of different sports drug policies. The results are something like:

Cycling - 1st offense, 2 year ban; 2nd offense LIFE ban

Football - 1st offense, 4 game suspension; 2nd offense 6 game suspension, 3rd, 1 year suspension (2003 penalties)

MLB - 1st offense, 50 game suspended, 2nd offense 100 game suspended, 3rd offense life (but they can appeal after 2 years) (2005 data)

Cycling is also very random testing, where most of the other sports are either scheduled or players are given advance warning (MLB is mostly random).

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

There's a second sample, and the UCI doesn't require testing it. Landis asked that it be tested. His mother said Landis may be taking medication to treat his hip - but I'm not aware testosterone has one up on anti-inflamatories. It will be a sad day for the US, as well as Lance if this sample tests positive. I'm sure he's a bit disappointed in the initial test.

 

[Audioholics]

During the tour they did an interesting comparison of different sports drug policies. The results are something like:

Rugby: 1st - teammates laugh that you got caught. 2nd - teammates secretly replace testosterone drugs with estrogen.

Soccer: nobody tests for drugs because soccer is too important

Nascar: 1st - team captain goes online to see what the heck steroids are. 2nd - major steroid company sponsors the car.

 

[billy p]

Roflmao

its nice to have a bit of humour.

 

[racquetman]

Rugby: 1st - teammates laugh that you got caught. 2nd - teammates secretly replace testosterone drugs with estrogen.

Soccer: nobody tests for drugs because soccer is too important

Nascar: 1st - team captain goes online to see what the heck steroids are. 2nd - major steroid company sponsors the car.

Not bad, Clint. Now watch me tick everyone off by pointing out that Nascar isn't a sport and therefore doesn't qualify for this discussion.

By the way, TENNIS PLAYERS have it the worst by far!! A player was banned for 7 years on his first offense a couple years ago. That may as well be a lifetime term in tennis years - most players careers are over in 7 years!!!

 

[j_garcia]

Not bad, Clint. Now watch me tick everyone off by pointing out that Nascar isn't a sport and therefore doesn't qualify for this discussion.

Try it sometime, then tell me if it is worthy (race fan, not necessarily Nascar fan). LOL though.

What's next? Randomly testing Tiger Woods?

Tennis, bah. Anyone actually watch tennis? Talk about boring...

All these sports - they pay them MILLIONS of dollars. What the hell do you think they're going to do?? They can afford some fresh designer blood and a little pick-me-up, and they'll do it to keep making that kind of money and notoriety.

 

[racquetman]

Tennis, bah. Anyone actually watch tennis? Talk about boring...

It's funny how people have different perspectives about things - perspective being the key word. You think racing qualifies as a sport, probably because you have an interest and you probably know something about what it takes to participate in a racing format. Because of this, you probably find racing fun to watch. I personally would rather watch paint dry than watch vehicles go around a track a thousand times (the very definition of monotonous!!). You apparently have no perspective when it comes to tennis. Probably because you don't have what it takes to play the sport. I've never met anyone who is remotely good at tennis that said they don't like it. You need to be able to play it at a somewhat of a competitive level to be able to appreciate what a tennis pro can do. If you had that perspective, and you tuned in to watch a genius like Roger Federer, I guarantee the last word you would use to describe it is boring. I can honestly say that watching him and some others play inspires me to perform better when I play myself. I doubt anyone can say that about a racing event (unless it inspires you to bump into the a-holes riding next to you during your morning commute ).

Anyway, my point is that if you can't appreciate something you are more than likely going to rip on it like you have with tennis (and I with racing). Maybe you should spend 10 minutes watching a tennis match and then go out and try to do what they do - good luck by the way!!

To get back to the thread, I also am amazed when watching the Tour. Those cyclists have incredible skill and endurance - a perspective no one on this forum will ever completely know (unless you've participated in the race yourself).

Oh ya, does anyone watch tennis? Stop by the U.S. Open in a couple weeks and see if anyone is in the stands - or if you can't make it to New York, watch a night match on USA. Pay attention to the crowd and how into the matches they become. It's quite a spectacle.

 

[j_garcia]

You are correct sir. I'm sure I could learn tennis, but I have absolutely no desire to. It does nothing for me, thus it gives me no interest whatsoever to watch it either. Wow, we can smack a ball back and forth real fast. Exciting.... I DO realize it takes skill and a level of athleticism to do this, but that doesn't change the fact that I can't HIT anyone (intentionally or unintentionally) while doing it Soccer and hockey for me, with maybe a little rugby once in a while.

I don't particularly find watching racing all that fun either, especially oval events. I'm interested in road course events where they turn more than one direction... I prefer the lower series, the BMW, Porsche and ALMS type racing that is a bit more competetive. Getting a turn just right and knowing when and how to pass someone really takes a lot of skill and maybe a little balls. Hitting your turns precisely and accellerating and braking just right to get the best time around the track is an art. Doing that for a few hours requires a lot of endurance, concentration and strategy. Those guys make it LOOK easy, but by no mean is it simple to do.

And, by the way, you can learn a LOT about driving by watching the top drivers. I've been watching racing since I can remember. I used to frequent a local karting place and I started out with some decent times. I tried for a while but I couldn't improve my lap times on my own, so I started watching the fastest guys - the line they take, where they brake or don't brake, every move they made...my lap times dropped by over 1.5 seconds, which is considerable when we're talking about 30 second laps.

I mountain bike also, which isn't the same as cycling, but I do appreciate what it takes for them to do what they do also. I have a friend who used to ride 70 miles a day, to and from work, through the hills - he rode with the US Postal team, Lance's team. WOW that guy has massive legs - looks like the hulk. He doesn't take any type of chemical or anything to be able to do what he does, but then again he isn't winning the TDF either.

At what point is it OK to chemically enhance oneself just to win? You are supposed to be in these sports because you like the SPORT. Didn't we learn this as kids? You don't need to win every time to enjoy it...

 

[racquetman]

At what point is it OK to chemically enhance oneself just to win? You are supposed to be in these sports because you like the SPORT. Didn't we learn this as kids? You don't need to win every time to enjoy it...

Unfortunately at the top levels, sports are no longer sports. They are all business, and the team owners and the coaches and the sponsors want results - if you can't provide them they'll find someone who can. When you have an IQ in the mid double digits, and your sports career is only going to last 5 to 10 years on average, you better be making some major money during those years, because they aren't going to be brain surgeons when their sports careers are over. When there is that much riding on a game or a match or a race or whatever, it just isn't going to be fun at that point - unless you win of course. At the top of every sport are the giant egos, and they don't like to lose. Can you say Barry Bonds???!!

 

[Leprkon]

It's funny how people have different perspectives about things - perspective being the key word.

Anyway, my point is that if you can't appreciate something you are more than likely going to rip on it like you have with tennis (and I with racing). Maybe you should spend 10 minutes watching a tennis match and then go out and try to do what they do - good luck by the way!!

Mr Federer might be a whiz, but he'd never live through even one practice of team synchronized swimming. Not that anyone (me included) watches it, but those are the very best conditioned athletes in the world. The rest of "sport" does not approach that level of pure athleticism.

As far as "racing" not being a "sport", let's put Mr Roddick or Mr Nadal in the boxing ring with Carl Edwards... I'd be putting my money on NASCAR !!

 

[Leprkon]

Unfortunately at the top levels, sports are no longer sports.

This has nothing to do with the top level of sports. I live in a town where coaches up in the press box call down plays and defenses for a sixth-grade football game.

 

[racquetman]

Wow, we can smack a ball back and forth real fast. Exciting.... I DO realize it takes skill and a level of athleticism to do this, but that doesn't change the fact that I can't HIT anyone (intentionally or unintentionally) while doing it Soccer and hockey for me, with maybe a little rugby once in a while.

Wow, we can go around a track real fast. Exciting..... (you see, it works with everything ).

I wasn't aware you could hit anyone in soccer and/or racing. They must have changed the rules. You can certainly hit someone in tennis (and it's completely legal) - I've hit opponents dozens of times, and it feels good every time (and if you don't think a tennis ball can leave a mark, meet me on the court ).

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

Mr Federer might be a whiz, but he'd never live through even one practice of team synchronized swimming. Not that anyone (me included) watches it, but those are the very best conditioned athletes in the world. The rest of "sport" does not approach that level of pure athleticism.

As far as "racing" not being a "sport", let's put Mr Roddick or Mr Nadal in the boxing ring with Carl Edwards... I'd be putting my money on NASCAR !!

You got that right. Anyone play any water polo? My brother in law was on the Cornell water polo team, and I used to make fun of him until I suited up. OMG, I almost drowned. I wrestled in college, and was in very good shape. I worked out muscles I didn't know I had. Swimming, cross country skiing, and swinging an ax/post hole digging are probably the most intense things you can do to your body. (I'm building a deck as well as taking out trees/roots in the yard, and man, is that a workout).

 

[racquetman]

This has nothing to do with the top level of sports. I live in a town where coaches up in the press box call down plays and defenses for a sixth-grade football game.

Yes, but the athletes are still amateurs and are not getting paid and therefore the responsibilities aren't as great. That's not to say that the pressure isn't there at all, because the pressure that coaches and parents and your teammates can put on you can be significant, but it's not the same as costing a franchise millions of dollars. I played 4 sports in high school and was an all conference tennis player in college, so I know a little something about this. The thing that you need to remember is that pressure is all self-induced. You could have the weight of the world riding on your shoulders (like being a quarterback in the Superbowl), but if you can handle that in your own mind and make it seem like you're tossing the ball around in your back yard, it doesn't have to be overwhelming. Conversely you could be playing ping pong in your garage with a buddy for 5 bucks, and if you want to win bad enough you can create enormous stress and anxiety in your own mind about it. It is all up the individual - some are good at handling those moments and others are not.

The pressure on athletes is trickling down to younger and younger ages, but that's a topic for another thread.

 

[racquetman]

Mr Federer might be a whiz, but he'd never live through even one practice of team synchronized swimming. Not that anyone (me included) watches it, but those are the very best conditioned athletes in the world. The rest of "sport" does not approach that level of pure athleticism.

As far as "racing" not being a "sport", let's put Mr Roddick or Mr Nadal in the boxing ring with Carl Edwards... I'd be putting my money on NASCAR !!

Are you an expert on team synchronized swimming?? Are you an expert on tennis players?? I doubt you could tell me the first thing about the daily curriculum of a top tennis player, yet in your own mind you think you have it all figured out. I doubt you've ever been on a tennis court in your life. If you were, you would know that playing a 5 hour tennis match on a clay court is probably one of most grueling things an athlete can endure. If you think a panzy *** race car driver could handle such an event, I would ask you to do a little research and get back to me.

I think Rafael Nadal would do just fine in any fight - check out the pipes!!

 

[majorloser]

If you think a panzy *** race car driver could handle such an event, I would ask you to do a little research and get back to me.

I would NEVER say a Formula 1 driver is not an athlete. The G-forces alone they take in one race is enough to cause even the fittest athlete to pass out.

NASCAR is another story.