Tips/tricks to enlarge sweet spot?

[supervij]

Hey everyone. I've got my speakers level matched (except for the centre speaker and the sub, both of which are 2 dB higher) using first YPAO then SPL meter, while sitting at the exact centre of my couch. And when I watch a movie, that's where I sit. When I watch a movie with my gal, we're sitting right next to each other at the centre. Both of these spots, the sound is fine. But I come across a problem when I've got more people in the living room.

A few weeks ago, some friends and I were watching the movie D.E.B.S. (pure guilty pleasure, and Devon Aoki looks great in a schoolgirl uniform!) and I noticed that for those who were not sitting within one seat of the "sweet spot", the surrounds and the mains were overpowering the dialogue.

One scene in particular sticks out in my mind. A scene at a bar where two characters were at a table, talking. The dialogue was coming from the centre, while the surrounds were blasting out very loud rock music. It became pretty difficult to discern the dialogue at times.

I know I could simply pump up the centre channel level, but I wonder if that would make the dialogue way too loud for the one or two people in the sweet spot. Would acoustically treating my living room help? The most I have in my living room is a huge couch that I imagine is probably pretty absorptive, and a large rug in the centre of the room. No bass traps or anything like that.

I did a search on the forums, but I couldn't find anything to help in this area. Any tips on enlarging the sweet spot?

cheers,
supervij

 

[Ron_Phelps]

sweet spot

I am anxious to see what responses you get for this one...

 

[agarwalro]

If your mains are toed in, try reducing the angle. Needless to say, after that you will have to recalibrate for level.

 

[STRONGBADF1]

Hi supervij,

Can we assume this happens with all movies and not just with some that might have a bad mix?

SBF1

 

[supervij]

agarwalro, in an effort to make my sweet spot as large as possible I haven't toed in my mains at all.

Stongbadf, this doesn't happen too often. Then again, like I said, it's usually just me or me and my gal watching. But when the gang comes over, sometimes it's noticeable, only cos there's people seated away from the absolute centre. Does D.E.B.S. have a bad mix? I'd love to hear from any others who have seen it to chime in on that, but I'm guessing it's not a huge number of people.

Just to complete the info, I've got my mains located at 22 degrees from the centre, and my monopole surrounds at 110 degrees (and 2.5 feet above ear level).

I'm not sure what other info I can provide. It's not a gigantic problem, just one I'd like to figure out before I hold my next movie night with the gang.

cheers,
supervij

 

[Sheep]

The trick is to put people who don't notice the difference away from the sweet spot, and put the people that do in it.

That or buy better gear, and completely redo the room/system.

SheepStar

 

[STRONGBADF1]

I haven't seen D.E.B.S. so I counld not tell you if the mix is good or bad. Sometimes I get really down on my lowfi system until I hear somthing mixed really well. So it stands to reason if you have mid/hifi your okay until you come across a bad mix....?

I would play something that is generaly considered a great mix and sit out of position.

I bet correctly placed room treatments would help also.

SBF1

 

[mtrycrafts]

Hey everyone. I've got my speakers level matched (except for the centre speaker and the sub, both of which are 2 dB higher) using first YPAO then SPL meter, while sitting at the exact centre of my couch. And when I watch a movie, that's where I sit. When I watch a movie with my gal, we're sitting right next to each other at the centre. Both of these spots, the sound is fine. But I come across a problem when I've got more people in the living room.
A few weeks ago, some friends and I were watching the movie D.E.B.S. (pure guilty pleasure, and Devon Aoki looks great in a schoolgirl uniform!) and I noticed that for those who were not sitting within one seat of the "sweet spot", the surrounds and the mains were overpowering the dialogue.
One scene in particular sticks out in my mind. A scene at a bar where two characters were at a table, talking. The dialogue was coming from the centre, while the surrounds were blasting out very loud rock music. It became pretty difficult to discern the dialogue at times.
I know I could simply pump up the centre channel level, but I wonder if that would make the dialogue way too loud for the one or two people in the sweet spot. Would acoustically treating my living room help? The most I have in my living room is a huge couch that I imagine is probably pretty absorptive, and a large rug in the centre of the room. No bass traps or anything like that.
I did a search on the forums, but I couldn't find anything to help in this area. Any tips on enlarging the sweet spot?cheers,
supervij

I would ask how far are the speakers from the center seat reference point?

Have you tried dipole in those two surrounds?

It is difficult to get such a large sweet spot in a small space and two surrounds. After all, if you are closer to one surround by a considerably good bit, the level will be most audibly different and being so far off center will be also noticeable.
Can anyone sit behind the main center seats? Even then, if the speakers are too close, it will be worse, except the center image should be good.

 

[Jack Hammer]

I believe Audissy (sp?) multiq is supposed to help with that. It's available with some of the Denon recievers.

 

[billy p]

Isn't the sweet spot

exactly that, the perfect location for YOU and your H/T. In my opinion, I would give that up somewhat to get the full effect of the sound field because I don't always sit in that one spot!!

 

[supervij]

Good ol' SheepStar; always can count on you to give the advice that no one else would dare give! (By the way, I laughed out loud when I saw the description under your username -- very nice!)

Strongbadf, I'm starting to wonder if your first paragraph is the problem. I hear one, maybe two bad mixes and start to wonder if something's wrong with my system/setup. Maybe it IS all in my mind. I put on D.E.B.S. tonight to check it out, and even though I don't remember doing any tweaking since last time I watched it, it sounded okay, even with me sitting out of the sweet spot. I feel kinda idiotic -- like, why does it sound better now when I didn't change anything? The problem also existed with a rented copy of Pride & Prejudice, but I'm not about to rent it again just to see if the problem with that movie is still there.

I love the idea of room treatments; I just need to figure out what to place and where to place it, while keeping my living room nice to look at. It's a strangely shaped room, and I'd need some personalized help with it, I would think. My girlfriend, as wonderful as she is about HT in general, might nix the room treatments that look yucky.

mtrycrafts, distances from centre (sorry, Canadian spelling) seat reference point: Fronts 8.5 feet; Centre 9.5 feet; Surrounds 6.5 feet; Surround Back 9.0 feet; Subwoofer 9.0 feet. Do you think those surround sides are too close? I can't really move them further back without affecting the dispersion to the front and rear of the room (they're tilted downward slightly and pointed in the direction parallel to the couch -- straddles the line between the people on the couch and the people just behind it).

I have considered dipoles for those surrounds, but I listen to multi-channel hi-res music a lot, so I've wanted to leave them as monopoles. Unless there are some inexpensive speakers that can switch between the two.

It's an average sized living room, I think, although a little oddly shaped, as I mentioned. I'll try to include a diagram of the layout in the morning. Sitting on the far end of the couch brings the ear to about 4.5 feet from the surround speaker.

There is room to sit behind the main centre seats, but I haven't heard any complaints from those sitting there.

Jack, I can't afford a new receiver any time soon, Denon or no. Maybe someday.

billy, I'm usually the only one watching movies in the apartment, so I'm always in the sweet spot. It IS great, without question. Even when I watch with one other person, the sweet spot is big enough for two people. Problem is when I have a bunch of people over, I want everyone to have great sound; I'm just trying to figure how to do that.

Maybe for the next movie night, I'll nudge the surround level down a decibel or two. Sigh. I dunno. It's 1:00 am and I can't sleep cos my mind is too busy thinking about this stuff. I need some sleep. I'll try to be a little more coherent tomorrow. (Did I even manage to answer any of the questions you guys had about my setup?) Sorry for the rambling, guys.

cheers,
supervij

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

The trick is to put people who don't notice the difference away from the sweet spot, and put the people that do in it.

That or buy better gear, and completely redo the room/system.

SheepStar

Why did Sheep get banned?

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[mulester7]

.....something's got to give with more people in a sound chamber....you can tune a sweet spot for one listener in a home theater, but in an auditorium of 500 people, everything goes mono....in a home theater for 10 people, I guess all-channels-stereo might be the best you can go....thoughts on that?.....

 

[tomd51]

Why did Sheep get banned?

Short term ban/joke by Clint, see this post... -TD