The Adventures of Montucky and Danzilla with combining the forces of RBH & SVS

[KEW]

All I got to say is just know, if my immune system is down due to lack of sleep and I catch Coronavirus and die, it's on you!
Ahh, at last, sweet sleep!

 

[Danzilla31]

All I got to say is just know, if my immune system is down due to lack of sleep and I catch Coronavirus and die, it's on you!
Ahh, at last, sweet sleep!

I haven't been able to sleep since you sent that KEW Man u sure know how to twist that knife in a fella don't you? Man I swear KEW I'll never be late on another update again I promise!

 

[JStewart]

@Danzilla31 , that’s one really good looking room. No doubt it sounds amazing too.

 

[Pogre]

I have those speakers ... except for the "rock" cabinets! I always wondered how much difference the cabinet would make! I met a guy who was pouring his tower cabinets out of concrete, just chatted. Later wished I had asked him if he would let me come check them out after he finished and exchanged contact information!
Did Montuckey say the cost, I forgot because I knew it wasn't going to happen on my budget (and I have never quite been satisfied by soft domes)?
My pedestrian wood cabinet version are wonderful for mid-range detail, especially, and I wonder what having such a rigid non-resonant cabinet would do with that! I imagine it is stunning!

I think I remember reading somewhere that concrete enclosures have a resonant ring to them. It was something I heard a long time ago. I've never seen one.

Kurt, didn't you and I talk about these speakers before? I also remember you owning the wood cab versions now that you mentioned it. Iirc they're not your favorites, but very nice speakers. I do think the rock cabs would take them to the next level. So freaking inert.

 

[Danzilla31]

@Danzilla31 , that’s one really good looking room. No doubt it sounds amazing too.

Thank you!!! It's hard to leave but you know us audioholics I'm always OCDing on someway to make it better

 

[Montucky]

Thanks for posting the report, Danzilla! Had a great time. You have a fantastic HT. I think we need to hang up a plaque in there with an "Audioholics Seal of Approval."

What a treat. The RBH on its own was quite a champ, as are your SVS subs. I was SO happy to see how the combination totally eliminated any unevenness, though. Seems like we've eliminated any "mother-in-law seating positions."

What I still can't get over is how effortless these things have such great impact at such low volumes. Dan has achieved that cinema sound WITHOUT having to crank it up. While I'm a big fan of playing things loud, we all know that's tough to do at times when others are in the home or you don't want to damage your hearing too quickly. Playing at very moderate levels, these subs still hit ya. But no matter what volume you play them at, they stay clean and accurate.

We ran some great tests. We went through a few key scenes in Blade Runner 2049 that really show what a sub's made of. It actually made me realize how much I was missing out on the first time I saw it as I don't even think many lesser setups can handle that range of LFE while holding it together perfectly. We also ran the launch scene of Interstellar which is a great torture test. Again, the RBH and SVS's handled it so gorgeously. I've never heard it so clear before actually! Well done, Danzilla. You've achieved true subwoofer nirvana.

 

[Montucky]

Those 530 look really bad-ass the way you have them on the articulated wall mounts!

Indeed. Funny thing is that I don't believe I've ever seen a HT done with articulating mounts before, nor have I done it like that myself either.

In hindsight, it seems so obvious after seeing his, that I'm upset I never thought of that myself before! So sweet that post-install, you can play with them as much as you want to get them fine-tuned with as much adjustment as you want to go nuts with. You just really can't go wrong with the pre-wire, so it does take away a LOT of that anxiety that goes with building out a theater and praying you got the placement juuuuuuust right. Haha. So cool.

It's gonna be a hoot to start playing with the MiniDSP and really getting those speakers dialed in. Although truth be told, it's pretty darn enjoyable as is.

 

[Danzilla31]

Thanks for posting the report, Danzilla! Had a great time. You have a fantastic HT. I think we need to hang up a plaque in there with an "Audioholics Seal of Approval."

What a treat. The RBH on its own was quite a champ, as are your SVS subs. I was SO happy to see how the combination totally eliminated any unevenness, though. Seems like we've eliminated any "mother-in-law seating positions."

What I still can't get over is how effortless these things have such great impact at such low volumes. Dan has achieved that cinema sound WITHOUT having to crank it up. While I'm a big fan of playing things loud, we all know that's tough to do at times when others are in the home or you don't want to damage your hearing too quickly. Playing at very moderate levels, these subs still hit ya. But no matter what volume you play them at, they stay clean and accurate.

We ran some great tests. We went through a few key scenes in Blade Runner 2049 that really show what a sub's made of. It actually made me realize how much I was missing out on the first time I saw it as I don't even think many lesser setups can handle that range of LFE while holding it together perfectly. We also ran the launch scene of Interstellar which is a great torture test. Again, the RBH and SVS's handled it so gorgeously. I've never heard it so clear before actually! Well done, Danzilla. You've achieved true subwoofer nirvana.

You have no idea how much that means thank you! Me my pops and the installer for the parts that were over our head we put our blood sweat and tears in that room and then I spent a month literally every day and night obsessively dialing it in with music and with movies

To hear an experienced member give me those words and let me know I hit my ultimate goal to have incredible sound and headroom at any volume level it means a lot

Any member that's in town here in San Antonio and would like to come visit and enjoy the room and talking all things audio just hit me up your always welcome over here!!!!

 

[KEW]

I haven't been able to sleep since you sent that KEW Man u sure know how to twist that knife in a fella don't you? Man I swear KEW I'll never be late on another update again I promise!

LOL, my humor can go a little extreme sometimes. I try to keep a "filter of appropriateness" engaged but sometimes it is like Tourrettes and slips out! I'll blame this one on 4:15AM ... which has nothing to do with this thread - just me being a dumbass and cultivating a state of "late night mindless stupor" - which I seem inclined to do about once a week for some dysfunctional reason!

Which reminds me of a great song that I don't know if you've heard. Great bass line/beat although not especially deep (actually I have not heard it on my main system - most of my streaming of "new to me" songs is over JBL LSR-305's w/o subs, so there may be deeper stuff than I realize). I think I like it better without the video, but it is a great song in my book!
I bet it sounds great on your JBLs when he lays into it and wails at 1:04 and 1:58-ish! One thing about those horns is they are always ready to "get up and go"!!!

 

[KEW]

Kurt, didn't you and I talk about these speakers before? I also remember you owning the wood cab versions now that you mentioned it. Iirc they're not your favorites, but very nice speakers. I do think the rock cabs would take them to the next level. So freaking inert.

I don't know. Both Alex and I commented on them in the "Bookshelf shoot-out" thread TheWarrior started. As I recall (since the Ultras were a loaner set), your Ultras have a better top end with their implementation of the Al tweeter and the RBH 61lse had better mid-range detail. I have since played with manual EQ and found that a 1 dB increase at 16kHz helps tune the RBH (ScanSpeak) tweeter to my liking, but it is still not on par with the Focal Be tweeter! I think the rock enclosure can refine what is there and expect the detail is stunning on them, but I don't see how it would bridge the gap between the soft dome and a good Be tweeter. It might give you something else instead, but by giving the most pristine reproduction from the tweeter, not adding anything!
Of course, I doubt RBH (Status Acoustics) is selling that "rock" speaker as their premium product anymore without upgrading the tweeter to their current Be driver, so I think they agree that a soft dome just isn't quite as good!

 

[Pogre]

I don't know. Both Alex and I commented on them in the "Bookshelf shoot-out" thread TheWarrior started. As I recall (since the Ultras were a loaner set), your Ultras have a better top end with their implementation of the Al tweeter and the RBH 61lse had better mid-range detail. I have since played with manual EQ and found that a 1 dB increase at 16kHz helps tune the RBH (ScanSpeak) tweeter to my liking, but it is still not on par with the Focal Be tweeter! I think the rock enclosure can refine what is there and expect the detail is stunning on them, but I don't see how it would bridge the gap between the soft dome and a good Be tweeter. It might give you something else instead, but by giving the most pristine reproduction from the tweeter, not adding anything!
Of course, I doubt RBH (Status Acoustics) is selling that "rock" speaker as their premium product anymore without upgrading the tweeter to their current Be driver, so I think they agree that a soft dome just isn't quite as good!

Gotcha. Yeah, I'm pretty sure I'm thinking of the shootout thread you guys put together a while back.

Boy oh boy, those speakers in the rock cab with updated Be tweeters... sigh. My dream speaker expectations have just been recalibrated.

 

[Danzilla31]

Once again thank you for the feedback from everyone

And thanks again Montucky for all your help both you and @AcuDefTechGuy have been super patient with me this last year and a half grilling you guys about RBH your patience and info is invaluable

Final insights

@Montucky really hit the nail on a lot of what I wanted to follow up with in this thread

I think to summarize I'd like to finish with my design philosophy on this room

I really owe a lot of my design and speaker preferences to @AcuDefTechGuy I too have found if the space allows I prefer big towers with good bass capabilities and if it's allowed multiple full range towers or a lottof of super capable subs with big capable if not full range towers very very capable ones if I get bookshelves they need to be beasts. I need my towers to be dynamic efficient with good scale and very quick detailed highs got lucky with JBL's horns on that one

I think the technology is amazing we have these days but in an age of slender tall speakers that look good in a room with like 10 drivers to make them go as deep as possible I think as much as we've gained in the last few years some things have been lost

I miss the days off big speakers with BIG woofers and midranges that were cut off at a ceartin point to improve there midrange power handling I will always be old fashioned that way. I need to thank @TLS Guy for his excellent insights on how important a speakers power needs to be across the appropriate bandwidths of frequencies we need our speakers to accurately reproduce

So my philosophy is to pair the biggest baddest efficient dynamic towers and bookshelves with the biggest baddest subs I can afford and let em rip but I really think for me it's the best and quickest route to get what I want

Which is effortless clear and dynamic sound at any volume I want to get lost in the movie as much as below reference as well as at reference

My final point is I think in walls don't suck and offer ceartin advantages due to some room reinforcement issues but my philosophy tends to steer away from them unless your willing to spend a ton of money they generally are not as good as a value as Floor standers and bookshelves and placement has to be precise unless your building the room or you are good at DIY it's hard to overcome the costs to get me what I want these are just my insights and experiences

I owe everyone a big shout out but thank you especially to @shady J for answering countless hours of questions on subs speakers designs room implentations I can't thank you enough

Me and Montucky plan to do a thread on running REW and a mini DSP in a couple months and learning how to do so it's going to be an open thread where well make lots of mistakes and look for a lot of members feedback

We plan on doing this to help new guys to the forum learn how to pull off the same things and benefit from every ones experience

 

[Danzilla31]

One last thing lol

Those PB 4000 are awesome subs but that RBH is out of this world. And the finish and cabinetry is just gorgeous

I'm definetly a huge RBH fan to put that much power dynamics and output in a speaker of that size is mind boggling honestly

I'm definetly thinking down the road of selling the PB 4000's and going with the passive version of the RBH and using my own amplification a route I've been wanting to go anyway

I just think 3 or 4 of those bad boys around the room would be beyond epic

To be continued!!!!

 

[Danzilla31]

Indeed. Funny thing is that I don't believe I've ever seen a HT done with articulating mounts before, nor have I done it like that myself either.

In hindsight, it seems so obvious after seeing his, that I'm upset I never thought of that myself before! So sweet that post-install, you can play with them as much as you want to get them fine-tuned with as much adjustment as you want to go nuts with. You just really can't go wrong with the pre-wire, so it does take away a LOT of that anxiety that goes with building out a theater and praying you got the placement juuuuuuust right. Haha. So cool.

It's gonna be a hoot to start playing with the MiniDSP and really getting those speakers dialed in. Although truth be told, it's pretty darn enjoyable as is.

Yeah guys I really got tired of a lot of traditional speaker wall mounts I love articulating mounts whether I want them flat sticking out upside down put at angles he'll diagonal its all good they can do it all and give you flexibility and stability you won't see on a lottof of traditional wall mounts

 

[Danzilla31]

Yeah guys I really got tired of a lot of traditional speaker wall mounts I love articulating mounts whether I want them flat sticking out upside down put at angles he'll diagonal its all good they can do it all and give you flexibility and stability you won't see on a lottof of traditional wall mounts

Also it's good to use ladders and boxes to stage your surrounds where you want them to go so you can dial in the exact sound and locations before you put on the mounts

 

[KEW]

... unless your building the room or you are good at DIY it's hard to overcome the costs to get me what I want these are just my insights and experiences

When you are getting speakers that were great at full price for 1/2 price or less, it becomes very difficult for DIY to compete with large scale production!.
Andrew Jones kind of proved that with the Pioneer BS-22 by producing a speaker that relied on very high sales quantities to get the cost down, but still used decent components. Dennis Murphy further validated this concept as he decided he was better off buying the Pioneers and modifying them because it was the least expensive way he could find to make a budget speaker from!
I'm not sure how well subs would compete if it weren't for the high shipping cost for the high quality ones (whether it is included in the price or an additional fee it is there and not free).

 

[Danzilla31]

When you are getting speakers that were great at full price for 1/2 price or less, it becomes very difficult for DIY to compete with large scale production!.
Andrew Jones kind of proved that with the Pioneer BS-22 by producing a speaker that relied on very high sales quantities to get the cost down, but still used decent components. Dennis Murphy further validated this concept as he decided he was better off buying the Pioneers and modifying them because it was the least expensive way he could find to make a budget speaker from!
I'm not sure how well subs would compete if it weren't for the high shipping cost for the high quality ones (whether it is included in the price or an additional fee it is there and not free).

All excellent points KEW for me subs value lies in waiting on excellent deals I prefer the used market and am willing to wait as long as it takes to score a good deal. With the SVS PB 4000's well paying in cash really helps your dealer give you an awesome deal Lol

But I think your so right on speakers especially I love waiting for lines to go on clearance such as JBL's studio 5 and look at polks lsim right now If much rather buy something for crazy good value and mod if necessary like your talking about

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Yeah guys I really got tired of a lot of traditional speaker wall mounts I love articulating mounts whether I want them flat sticking out upside down put at angles he'll diagonal its all good they can do it all and give you flexibility and stability you won't see on a lottof of traditional wall mounts

I can attest to this. I used articulating mounts in my system for years. I spent countless hours adjusting every angle to get exactly what I wanted out of my surrounds. Well done Danno.

Also, very fun thread. It’s nice to read about members getting together and having fun. In fact tlsguy and I have made loose plans a number of times over the years to get together but every time I try and make it happen.....
Also, what were some of your favorite clips? And I am assuming by your words that a single RBH will outperform a single PB4k? Iirc numbers on data-bass were similar to the old ultra that the 4000 replaced. Understand if you don’t wanna kiss and tell. Lol

 

[Danzilla31]

I can attest to this. I used articulating mounts in my system for years. I spent countless hours adjusting every angle to get exactly what I wanted out of my surrounds. Well done Danno.

Also, very fun thread. It’s nice to read about members getting together and having fun. In fact tlsguy and I have made loose plans a number of times over the years to get together but every time I try and make it happen.....
Also, what were some of your favorite clips? And I am assuming by your words that a single RBH will outperform a single PB4k? Iirc numbers on data-bass were similar to the old ultra that the 4000 replaced. Understand if you don’t wanna kiss and tell. Lol

Thanks!

Yeah it was super cool hanging with Montucky awesome dude we had a blast

Also I can kiss and tell just don't tell the other audioholics okay? I don't want em getting jealous.

Yes one of the RBH SV-1212PR will outperform a single PB 4000. It has twice the amp and dual 12's and the numbers at data bass back it up.

But 2 PB 4000's on my front stage hold up against it very well and really give me sweet bass all across the room when combined with it

Plus my system is loafing I've never even come close to pushing it don't even want to. Don't need too so since all 3 subs are around the same port tune they play very very nice with each other with all that juicy headroom

The RBH has that sound I love out of great subs just cleeeeaaan deeeeeep smmooooth tight bass thick and deep but also realistic to the source very very neutral accurate and clear. It's hard to describe it but I know you've experienced it

The SVS has that same sound just the RBH has a bit more of it not to mention the RBH are just georgeous looking in that piano gloss black with the curves it has on it really really sexy

 

[Jon AA]

So my philosophy is to pair the biggest baddest efficient dynamic towers and bookshelves with the biggest baddest subs I can afford and let em rip but I really think for me it's the best and quickest route to get what I want

Which is effortless clear and dynamic sound at any volume I want to get lost in the movie as much as below reference as well as at reference

Now that's a philosophy I can get behind!

Congrats, your system looks great.