Sub-upgrad-itis. From Klipsch Sub-10 to A2 - 300 Subwoofer

[Chitown2477]

I am strongly considering selling my Klipsch Sub-10 and buying the Elemental Designs A2-300 subwoofer. I have Klipsch reference series speakers (RF-52, RC-52, and RS-42). I use my system for 80% movies and really like a solid home theater experience - my wife and I RARELY go to the movies.

I would like your opinion to determine if there will be any significant benefits to changing to the A2-300. Unfortunately, I cannot audition the sub.

Side note - I bought the Pioneer Elite VSX-21THX last Black Friday. When I used the MCAAC to calibrate the system, I did not like how the sub seemed to play differently - seemingly flatter. I got used to it and actually like the sound from all my speakers better. But the Sub-10 now seems like it struggles with LFE on some movies. Maybe I am just looking for an excuse but I swear something is different. Tried the the crawling for bass thing - no much difference. DIY sub decopuler did seem like it made a difference. Ergo, thinking about upgrading.

 

[bandphan]

IMO, if you are going to upgrade, go at least one more level up.

 

[Tungsten06GT]

Go with the A3-300

 

[Chitown2477]

Update: I have held off on getting a new sub and am thinking about the ED A3-250. Does anyone hear think that will be a big improved over the Klipsch Sub 10? Looking for more low end as it seems the Sub 10 struggles or gets muddy at times.

 

[shadyJ]

While the A3-250 will be a nice jump over the sub 10, I don't think it will be a spectacular leap. If money is tight, it might be worth it, but if you can make the stretch to a A3-300, or a Outlaw Audio LFM-1 Plus, or Hsu Research VTF2 mk3, try to do that. But the A3-250 should definitely have a edge over the sub 10, and if that is what you are mostly after, no reason to spend a lot more money.

 

[sholling]

I agree with the others. If you're going to spend the money for a jump in performance then save enough for a substantial jump.

 

[Chitown2477]

I can't afford more than $450 and that is a stretch. However, comparing the eD A2-300 ($415) or even the A3-350 ($450) it seems both would have a lower frequency range - down to 18hz vs. 28hz for the Sub-10. The reason I am looking to upgrade is the Sub-10 seems to get muddy or unresponisve during some serious LFE scenes in movies. Also it seems to be a bit weak for music, i.e hip-hop/R&B. But, I don't need something really expensive ($600 or more) that will likely by turned only half way up or otherwise may drown out my Klipsch Reference 52 line HT.

Can anyone (else - thanks shadyj) tell me if they feel the A2-300 or A3-350 give me more than an incremental increase in performance? I know there is some subjectivity here but on paper the A2-300 or A3-350 look better. I am leaning toward the A2-300 bigger it is bigger (hey its a guy thing!).

Thanks Much!!

 

[Chitown2477]

Correction - In the message above I stated the A3-350. I meant the A3-250

 

[wave]

help

I have def tech 7006 front speakers, a klipsch c2 center speaker, klipsch ksw 10 sub woofer. My question is my denon 1707 reciever enough to get all the potential out of my speakers. When i crank it up it is ok but not as booming as I thought. If i upgrade my reciever to a pioneer vsx 1019ah-k reciever will that make a difference? I only have 3.1 system could I route more power to my speakers with the extra watts left over?

 

[miniSQ]

would you consider building your own sub?

 

[Chitown2477]

I have thought about it but don't know the better options and I am worried about making sure its a quality build. I am very comfortable with DIY projects but I know I can't compete with factory builds.

Any suggestions?

 

[miniSQ]

Correction - In the message above I stated the A3-350. I meant the A3-250

i would not suggest upgrading from a 10" to a 10"....you are looking for cleaner and deeper output for a HT...so you should try to get to a 12" or better still a 15" ported design.

Have you talked to eD yet about options? They have a forum and they have great tech support...pop over and ask them for an opinion. minimum upgrade IMO would be the a3-300.

 

[jostenmeat]

i would not suggest upgrading from a 10" to a 10"....you are looking for cleaner and deeper output for a HT...so you should try to get to a 12" or better still a 15" ported design.

Have you talked to eD yet about options? They have a forum and they have great tech support...pop over and ask them for an opinion. minimum upgrade IMO would be the a3-300.

And you think PSB has terrible build quality?

You obviously haven't read mike c's posts.

Size itself does not necessitate quality, nor output.

 

[Chitown2477]

i would not suggest upgrading from a 10" to a 10"....you are looking for cleaner and deeper output for a HT...so you should try to get to a 12" or better still a 15" ported design.

Have you talked to eD yet about options? They have a forum and they have great tech support...pop over and ask them for an opinion. minimum upgrade IMO would be the a3-300.

Thanks for the reply. I have talked with eD (and visited their forums) and they have been very helpful. They suggested the A3-300. I have debated the A3-300 but I personally think the A2-300 is very close to it except for a bit more power (100 vs 300 watts) and excursion (15mm vs 25mm). The A3-300 likely will play a bit flatter (at least in a narrower frequency band per the graphs posted by eD) but I don't see the value for $200 - especially because all I have is $400 right now. I figure worst case I can buy another A2-300 in a year or two and get more even/flatter sound across my HT. Right now the room is 10x12x16 but opens into dining room. I do have a thick curtain as a simple barrier - which, as a side note, I think helps with sound reflections along with some acoustic panels I have.

How does this approach sound?

 

[miniSQ]

Thanks for the reply. I have talked with eD (and visited their forums) and they have been very helpful. They suggested the A3-300. I have debated the A3-300 but I personally think the A2-300 is very close to it except for a bit more power (100 vs 300 watts) and excursion (15mm vs 25mm). The A3-300 likely will play a bit flatter (at least in a narrower frequency band per the graphs posted by eD) but I don't see the value for $200 - especially because all I have is $400 right now. I figure worst case I can buy another A2-300 in a year or two and get more even/flatter sound across my HT. Right now the room is 10x12x16 but opens into dining room. I do have a thick curtain as a simple barrier - which, as a side note, I think helps with sound reflections along with some acoustic panels I have.

How does this approach sound?

i think that sounds reasonable...did alex say what the differences between the a2-and a3 were besides the amp? If both drivers are the same i might recommend the a2....but for eD to also recommend the A3 i would tend to listen to them...if you spend a month or 2 to save up another $200 it may allow you to save money next year in buying a second a2.

what are you going to do with your sub10?

 

[bandphan]

what are you going to do with your sub10?

Good question cause if he can get 1-150 selling it, just order this and be done with it.

 

[miniSQ]

Good question cause if he can get 1-150 selling it, just order this and be done with it.

i am not sure i would suggest a sealed sub for him...i think he would be happier with the increased output of a ported design.

I was also thinking if he used the amplifier from the sub10, he could build his own sub

But that amp might have built in EQ stuff for the sub10 that might cause problems...so i didn't suggest it.

 

[bandphan]

i am not sure i would suggest a sealed sub for him...i think he would be happier with the increased output of a ported design.

I was also thinking if he used the amplifier from the sub10, he could build his own sub

But that amp might have built in EQ stuff for the sub10 that might cause problems...so i didn't suggest it.

I would out of all the sub choices he currently has. A dual 12" sealed will give good usable output. And at the introductory price, it would be the best bang for the buck, doesn't look bulky, big and obtrusive, and should he ever decide to sell it, he would likely recover the money spent for it or close to that.

 

[miniSQ]

I would out of all the sub choices he currently has. A dual 12" sealed will give good usable output. And at the introductory price, it would be the best bang for the buck, doesn't look bulky, big and obtrusive, and should he ever decide to sell it, he would likely recover the money spent for it or close to that.

i missed it was a dual 12"...i assumed that to get 2 12's it was the "dual legend"...but i see now that dual legends is 2 of the dual subs. Confusing...to me anyway.

i have dual 12's sealed in a 12x23 room and it is plenty..but i have a 1300watt plate amplifier (eD)..even though i am using only about 600watts.

so yeah that might be another option...although i would maybe stil suggest the a3-300.

 

[Chitown2477]

I have an email out to eD to ask about the differences between the A2 and A3. Waiting for their response. Will have to consider waiting a bit to save $600 depending on eD’s response. I really like what I have read about their subs and they have been a great help. I don’t mid the size.

I have the Sub-10 on Craigslist for $225; may need to lower my price. Regardless, the sell of that is part of the overall $400 budget.

I thought about a DIY but have been hesitant. I am pretty good with DIY projects just have no reference for DIY audio or electronics for that matter. I will do some research today. Really have no idea where to start but I am sure I can find some resources here (DIY thread) or at other sites.