Sub shopper seeks feedback

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Tom V.

Audioholic
You certainly never miss a chance to voice your displeasure with PSA do you shadyj?....lol
The size of the TRIPLE stack of magnets....that's the latest diatribe these days? Oh my. Somehow we managed to make "product of the year" here. And our CEA output (which is largely dependent on the quality of the driver) matches/exceeds any like priced product. Just imagine what we could do with a properly designed woofer:rolleyes:

As with any business/product there are an infinite amount of ways to increase efficiency and provide more "bang for the buck" to to speak. We LOVE it when someone compares our products to like priced competition. Let your own ears be the judge.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
 
T

Tom V.

Audioholic
I have to disagree Jman, I think you get what you pay for with PSA, Now I know a couple guys on here like them and swear by their value, I have recently heard an XS15 and a XV30, neither impressed me, and although Shady is known for stirring the pile a little (sorry) I have to agree the picture of that sub with the tiny magnet doesn't do them any favors in the "get what you pay for" argument, I know a few guys on here recommend them to people and I cringe when I see it, there is a reason HSU owners swear by their subs and others swear at their subs after they hear the HSU and see the price...
Dave bought an XV30 and I dont remember how much it was but I was NOT impressed with it, and neither was he
I wish "dave" would have contacted me during he setup/calibration. I don't believe we've had a single XV30 returned to date. If he is still having issues please have him contact us asap. Thanks.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
 
stevenn

stevenn

Audiophyte
Originally Posted by jbrown15

You certainly never miss a chance to voice your displeasure with PSA do you shadyj?....lol
Do yuh think? :)
 
its phillip

its phillip

Audioholic Ninja
The drivers will be fairly high quality ones, probably better than what you find in Hsu and Outlaw subs and certainly better than what you will get with a PSA sub. For a better driver in a commercial sub, you would have to look at higher than $1k subs, and with the Dayton kit you get two such drivers. This means low distortion, high output, good linearity, good compression behavior, and high sound quality.
Drivers & quotes from audioholics reviews:

psa xv-15 driver:
The 15” driver used in this system is constructed on a 12 spoke cast aluminum frame and uses a heavy pressed paper fiber cone with an inverted dust cap. The surround is a large half roll of Rubatek foam which should allow generous excursions. The voice coil is a 2” diameter copper flat wind with an 8” poly cotton spider providing centering and returning force. The motor is comprised of a triple stack of y35 grade magnets of about 5” diameter and a vented pole piece to remove heat from the gap. This driver appears to be sturdy, heavily built for a subwoofer selling in this price class and capable of withstanding large excursions. Power Sound indicates that the driver is capable of 2” peak to peak stroke.


outlaw audio lfm-1 ex driver:
After pulling the driver out of the enclosure to examine it further it could be seen that it was a well built and substantial unit but of moderate cost. The 12” driver is built on a stamped steel frame and a good sized motor of roughly 6” in diameter with dual stacked ferrite magnets. The back plate is bumped and has a small pole vent with a screen to prevent debris from entering the gap. The cone appears to be pressed and coated paper attached to a 2” diameter voice coil and former. The suspension consists of what appears to be a 6” diameter single spider and a rubber half roll surround. Interestingly the motor also has a large bucking magnet attached to the back of it for magnetic shielding purposes. This is increasingly less of a concern since CRT televisions are becoming much less common. The driver is of a very humble pedigree and built of unassuming components but is not out of character for a subwoofer in this price range and appears to do the job well, which is what matters.


hsu vtf-3 mk3 driver:
For my money, the real star of this show is the VTF-3 Mk3’s driver. It’s a nominal 12” unit, with a half-roll surround, and sporting a massive vented motor assembly. Hsu Research has, from its inception, focused on 12” driver as its driver of choice and they have over the years refined their design approach to where their products perform out to the limits of what a12” driver can do. In the world of subwoofers it’s easy to overlook 12” drivers, seemingly overshadowed by their 15” and 18” brethren. Underestimate the VTF-3 Mk3 at your own risk – this is one potent sub! For the specification-inclined I’ve included a table with some of the driver’s T/S parameters.


The words from the VTF-3 review were from a reviewer named Mark. The PSA and Outlaw reviews were from Ricci (and of course have more information). I dunno why you're a hater. They're all good products. I would imagine the Outlaw LFM-1 EX driver and VTF-3 mk3 driver are actually the same driver, but I of course don't know for sure.
 
S

shadyJ

Speaker of the House
Staff member
My problem is not with the product itself which I do not think is bad. My objection is that the XV15 is often recommended by a lot of guys as the only credible choice under $1k, and they are doing so based on the most barefaced specs alone. It seems like the XV15 is only out to win an SPL war at it's price point, which it manages to just barely do against a cheaper and more feature rich sub with a 12" driver with a less powerful amp. And it does so at the expense of linearity, which can be seen from the review, and, I'm guessing cone control, given the motor of its driver. From my view, the only real reason it merits consideration as an alternative is because of a better warranty (although one can purchase a matching extended warranty from Hsu). Of course, I must admit to being biased, having been well served by both Hsu and Outlaw.

Anyway, around this price I think that the Dayton dual 12" kit looks like an easily better choice than Hsu, Outlaw, or PSA at the moment. You get two high quality drivers, a good amp, and a heavy duty enclosure, with only minimal assembly. Unless the size is a problem, I can't believe anyone who is concerned with performance wouldn't go for that in a heartbeat.
 
V

vardo

Enthusiast
My first post, so take this with a grain of salt. ShadyJ I respect your knowledge....we both have a lot
of respect for HSU subs. I've owned 2 of the original VTF-2's, a VTF2/3, and VTF3/3 w/turbo. I live close to
HSU and don't have to pay for shipping, and get a slight discount on top of that (good customer as
Dr. Hsu calls it). Their customer service is outstanding.


Even so, when it was time to upgrade I thought I'd give PSA a shot. So I ordered multiples of XV-15's.
I glad I did, and have no regrets. Their subs are extremely well built, and the price can't be beat....
you get a lot of woofage for the $. IMO the XV-15 is just a slight step up from a VTF-3/3 (of which I owned
for 4 years). I have not heard the VTF-15 so maybe I missed something there.

Just thought I'd try a different sub co., and glad I did.

vardo
 
stevenn

stevenn

Audiophyte
My first post, so take this with a grain of salt. ShadyJ I respect your knowledge....we both have a lot
of respect for HSU subs. I've owned 2 of the original VTF-2's, a VTF2/3, and VTF3/3 w/turbo. I live close to
HSU and don't have to pay for shipping, and get a slight discount on top of that (good customer as
Dr. Hsu calls it). Their customer service is outstanding.


Even so, when it was time to upgrade I thought I'd give PSA a shot. So I ordered multiples of XV-15's.
I glad I did, and have no regrets. Their subs are extremely well built, and the price can't be beat....
you get a lot of woofage for the $. IMO the XV-15 is just a slight step up from a VTF-3/3 (of which I owned
for 4 years). I have not heard the VTF-15 so maybe I missed something there.

Just thought I'd try a different sub co., and glad I did.

vardo
I totally understand. Back in the day I bought 13 SW from a certain Co. then I decided to branch out and try some others including many DIY projects with some help in the math dept. I recommend HSU as a option when it's within the criteria and respect HSU products in general. Anyway I'm sure you're going to enjoy your new XV-15's. Congrats!
 
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