Star Wars Revenge of the Sith **SPOILER** THREAD

ducker

ducker

Full Audioholic
Yea.... I remember back seeing Empire and Jedi for the first times.

When Luke jumped out of the carbon chaimber... I was like WHOA!!

Or in Jedi when Luke does the back flip up and climbs in to the rafters. For some reason I remember that final fight to of lasted so much longer... It seemed short this time. Regardless, that final fight in Jedi still does rule.



Rob Babcock said:
Yes, the lightsaber duels in the prequels reflect the times and show the influence of the Hong Kong martial arts genre. The fights in the old movies were fairly uneventful and mundane, whereas the new films have some pretty spectacular fight choreography. I guess I prefer the newer style, but the final Luke vs Vader fight in Jedi was epic! :D
 
C

claudermilk

Full Audioholic
Regarding the two trilogies' fight scenes and SFX, remember there's almost 20 years between them. The original movie changed everything for SFX and paved the way to the one we just saw. Kind of the same thing with the fight scenes; like Rob said regarding the Hong Kong movies. Those have now become mainstream and we are expecting to see that kind of spectacular choreography that probably wasn't even possible back with the first moveis.

In thinking about the original trilogy vs this last one, I have to say I think the Han/Leia love story was pulled off far better than the Anakin/Padme one. I'm not sure how much can be attributed to writing vs. the actors.

I do love how bad Yoda's become. That entrance to Palpatine's chamber came off to me as a "puhleeze!" from Yoda; it was probably one of the more effective moments in his screen time.
 
M

Mega2000

Audioholic
i was young when I was Empire Strikes Back, did anyone else think the movie was over and Luke went in the cave and cut Vader's head off. I was like... THAT'S IT!!!

again I was only 7 years old at the time.
 
rgriffin25

rgriffin25

Moderator
One of my favorite parts was Vader's first breath with his mask on. It was so quiet in the theater it was almost distracting. I really enjoyed the movie and I can't wait to get it on DVD!
 
mtrycrafts

mtrycrafts

Seriously, I have no life.
bumblebee said:
In another forum, someone opined that Leia was referring to Bail Organa's wife as her mother. Not Padme.

That's also a good possibility but would depend on the context of her phrase about this.
 
mtrycrafts

mtrycrafts

Seriously, I have no life.
Takeereasy said:
I just want to address this one:



God this is going to be nerdy but here goes. They alluded in the movie that the unborn Luke and Leia were aware in the womb. Both newborns saw their mother, even if only for a second, so..... isn't it possible Leia remembers the moment she saw her mother as a newborn and remembers feelings she had before birth? .
That is my take on this too. After all, they have extraordinary gifts, the force.
 
M

Mega2000

Audioholic
after watching return of the jedi last night. i still like the fight between luke and vader best. it might not be the flashy kung fu movie wire work, but it has a lot of emotion and just some classic sword work.

i think i don't like about the new cleaned up trilogy is that they changed the song at the end of the movie. i liked the cheesey ewok song, and when they make the ghose of anikin look like hayden christenson, he is wearing some brown robe. sinc ewhen did he ever were a big brown obi-won style robe... haha

anyway, i just love these movies.
 
T

tbewick

Senior Audioholic
I thought that the sound was good, because it wasn't overbearing, as many film soundtracks are nowadays.

Overall, I thought the film was boring and completes a poor set of films (1-3). None of the characters are people you'd like to meet - they are all very dull. At least the originals had Harrison Ford.

Oh, yes, I am really not impressed with CGI any more. A lot of this film was just like watching someone else playing a computer game.
 
Rob Babcock

Rob Babcock

Moderator
I thought Ewan McGreggor's Obi-Wan was a very nicely done character.
 
T

tbewick

Senior Audioholic
Yeah, Obi-Wan was one of the more likeable characters of the new trilogy, but rogues (Hans Solo) are just more fun. They're needed to keep things from getting lifeless.
 
L

Leprkon

Audioholic General
I must have seen a different movie than most of you. This was a Saturday-afternoon WB movie, not a true epic in the tradition of the original movie. I have to agree with the earlier post that this is a sad end to a sad trilogy. I was reminded of sitting through Rocky 5 and Terminator 3 thinking, well at least it will all finally stop here....

I was impressed with the sound, and I wasn't in the best room in the theater (but I was centered up, as someone else mentioned that may make a diff)

some of my personal gripes:

the basketball-pregnant Padme running off the ship at 100m speed when it landed on the volcano planet.

Obi Wan asks Padme where Anakin is... then has to hide on her ship to find him, putting everyone needlessly in danger... what happened to asking her, waving his hand in true Jedi mind-trick tradition, asking her again to which she replies "I will tell you all you want to know" and telling her to go to sleep.

The Millenium Falcon (supposedly the fastest ship in the universe) takes days to go from Tatooine to the Organa homeworld of Alderaan, but Padme's ship goes to the Outer Rim in a manner of minutes (and Darth Sidius even faster since he had to stop and kick Yoda's butt)....

if Lucas intended this movie to be meant for kids (as we keep hearing), why does he spend almost an entire minute at the formal ball on the girl with her tits hanging out ?

Sidius able to communicate by a hand transmitter all the way to the Outer Rim, when ObiWan couldn't do the same in Ep 2 using a ship-based radio about twenty times the size (maybe ObiWan needs a better wireless plan ?).

The Wookie fight did cause horrible flashbacks to the Ewok battle...

A machine-based life form that had to repeatedly cough... (what's up with that and even if it had been a real life form, why the cough ??? do all evil people cough instead of wear black ??)

Then there's the stupid battle droids... Would someone really program a droid they were sending into battle to say "Ut-oh", let alone "Get out of the way" ??

if Senator Organa was in on it from the beginning, why doesn't Leia know "later" how bad the Emperor and Vader are ?

Wasn't the original Darth Vader MUCH taller in the first three movies (like six feet seven inches)... Christenson was not what I would call imposing despite all Lucas' pitiful attempts at front-loaded perspective....Lucas must really hate that Peter Jackson not only writes better and makes more money, he at least know how to use a camera to exaggerate size (ok you dweebs out there, go ahead and tell me Palpatine had him made bigger when they rebuilt him... better, stronger, faster...)

what's the deal with KwiGon and immortality ? weren't we lead to believe in the first trilogy that a dying Jedi simply becomes part of the greater Force ?

and what did they do to Natalie Portman's face in that first balcony scene ? She looked like a sweating chimpanzee with a nasty case of constipation.... one kid sitting near me actually hid her face in horror...

yet another brave animal dumb enough to be transportation for one of our heroes is killed within minutes (maybe all Lucas transport animals are born with red shirts and tricorders ??)

Has there been a single science-fiction movie made since 1990 that doesn't have a prophecy in it ? Does Samuel L Jackson have them written into his contracts ?

what happened to the patch on the eye Padme's chief of security ? the one who gets blown away in the first thirty seconds of the movie...

The final issue is the whole run-and-hide attitude of ObiWan and Yoda... I got beat so I must go into exile and find someone who has no clue what a Jedi is to go fight my battles for me ?? What happened to the old days of the good guy charging unimaginable odds and winning ?? (I forgot, we did that in the original movie, we can't repeat that one)

all that being said, it still beats the crap out of Ep 1. It is worth seeing at matinee prices, but like Gene said, go watch it, don't analyze it or expect it to make any sense(pick any Bond movie in the past 20 years as a reference).

the coolest moments:

the battle droid that got his head cut off and kept coming after ObiWan (great look on Macgregor's face for that one).

Christopher Lee's performance, short as it was.

the fact they did stick to the original Darth Vader uniform, even though it looks horribly cheesey and outdated by today's standards (especially the chest console)....
 

Buckle-meister

Audioholic Field Marshall
I must say that I was rather dissapointed with part 3; more so even than part 2.

Personally, I reckon that part 1 was the best out of the first 3. It didnt have the cheesy love scenes of the other 2, but did have the most intense, realistic fighting scenes of any of the SIX films, not to mention the pod racing scene; surely one of the best CG action pieces of all time?

Part of the beauty of the original (parts 4, 5 and 6) series was that because nobody expected the films to be great at the time, the actors acted almost nonchalantly. By the time parts 1, 2 and 3 came around, the actors were too aware of the whole 'Star Wars' phenomenon, and tried too hard in my opinion, Liam Neeson being the exception.

I dont mind Ewen McGregor, but I dont particularly rate him in these films. I understand the logic of trying to have him mimic Alex Guinnes' behaviour in order to have as smooth a transition from part 3 to part 4, but at the end of the day, he ISN'T Alex Guinnes, so asking him to mimic him, in my opinion, just falsifies and suppresses his natural acting talent.

Never mind. Whats done is done. I at least found myself gaining a better context when siting down to part 4. I hadnt felt that I had been missing anything originally, but I do believe that parts 1, 2 and 3 have helped in that respect.

Cheers
 
B

bobman1235

Audioholic Intern
I just want to counter a FEW of Leprkon's objections :

Leprkon said:
Obi Wan asks Padme where Anakin is... then has to hide on her ship to find him, putting everyone needlessly in danger... what happened to asking her, waving his hand in true Jedi mind-trick tradition, asking her again to which she replies "I will tell you all you want to know" and telling her to go to sleep.
Mind tricks only work on the weak-minded. This is mentioned at least a thousand times thorughout the six films, and Padme specifically asks Anikin about it in Ep 2 and he says "I can't, it only works onthe weak-minded." It's amazing how much attention you pay when complaining about tiny inconsistencies, but completely ignore established facts.

Leprkon said:
if Lucas intended this movie to be meant for kids (as we keep hearing), why does he spend almost an entire minute at the formal ball on the girl with her tits hanging out ?
Everyone, including Lucas, said this installment was specifically NOT for kids like the others, hence the PG-13 rating. Also, you complain about tits but don't mind all the violence and slaughtering of innocent people and children? Hello?

Leprkon said:
Sidius able to communicate by a hand transmitter all the way to the Outer Rim, when ObiWan couldn't do the same in Ep 2 using a ship-based radio about twenty times the size (maybe ObiWan needs a better wireless plan ?).
Obi-wan's long-range transmitter was broken. In his message he says something to the likes of "Anikin, my long-range transmitter is broken, please retransmit this...".

Leprkon said:
Wasn't the original Darth Vader MUCH taller in the first three movies (like six feet seven inches)... Christenson was not what I would call imposing despite all Lucas' pitiful attempts at front-loaded perspective....Lucas must really hate that Peter Jackson not only writes better and makes more money, he at least know how to use a camera to exaggerate size (ok you dweebs out there, go ahead and tell me Palpatine had him made bigger when they rebuilt him... better, stronger, faster...)
Agreed, but it's possible the Emporor shrunk a bit, like my grandfather. :)

Leprkon said:
what's the deal with KwiGon and immortality ? weren't we lead to believe in the first trilogy that a dying Jedi simply becomes part of the greater Force ?
Just because you're part of "the greater force" doesn't mean you can communicate with the living. I was always lead to believe that only the best Jedi had this ability.

Leprkon said:
and what did they do to Natalie Portman's face in that first balcony scene ? She looked like a sweating chimpanzee with a nasty case of constipation.... one kid sitting near me actually hid her face in horror...
Maybe it was pregnancy rearing it's ugly head... :)
 
L

Leprkon

Audioholic General
bobman1235 said:
Everyone, including Lucas, said this installment was specifically NOT for kids like the others, hence the PG-13 rating. Also, you complain about tits but don't mind all the violence and slaughtering of innocent people and children? Hello?
first of all, you didn't actually see any kids get killed or even struck. secondly, Lucas used nothing but the kid defense to explain the whining excesses of young Skywalker in Ep1.. (if you will remember he actually changed Ep 6 from Revenge of the Jedi to Return of the Jedi because "revenge" might convey the wrong emotion to kids) did he suddenly develop a conscience ? or was it finally accepting that adults actually pay for the movies their kids go see ?

as a final "bump" to your arguments, you must never have seen any afternoon WB Japanese anime or X-box games intended for kids... nothing but children and innocents get slaughtered on those.. today's kids are completely unprotected and immune to things being killed.

I'm still wondering if Sidius has Cingular or AT&T on that hand-held... he must pay a freaking fortune in roaming fees...

find some heroes who don't go into hiding at the first sign of trouble

the movie was ok, but nowhere near as good as the original... just deal with it.
 
B

bobman1235

Audioholic Intern
Leprkon said:
first of all, you didn't actually see any kids get killed or even struck. secondly, Lucas used nothing but the kid defense to explain the whining excesses of young Skywalker in Ep1.. (if you will remember he actually changed Ep 6 from Revenge of the Jedi to Return of the Jedi because "revenge" might convey the wrong emotion to kids) did he suddenly develop a conscience ? or was it finally accepting that adults actually pay for the movies their kids go see ?

as a final "bump" to your arguments, you must never have seen any afternoon WB Japanese anime or X-box games intended for kids... nothing but children and innocents get slaughtered on those.. today's kids are completely unprotected and immune to things being killed.

I'm still wondering if Sidius has Cingular or AT&T on that hand-held... he must pay a freaking fortune in roaming fees...

find some heroes who don't go into hiding at the first sign of trouble

the movie was ok, but nowhere near as good as the original... just deal with it.

Hey man, I agree, I like the originals better as far as plot goes - altho the action scenes in the oldies can't even compare to the new ones.

And Lucas didn't develop a conscience, he just changed the nature of the movie -- the first one was definitely more geared towards a younger audience, and the last installment was definitely not. He was very up front about all of that, from teh beginning.

And as far as violence, just because it's prevelant in society doesn't make it right. If I had kids I'd much rather them see a pair of tits than a severed head.

I wasn't trying to insult you or anythign dude, just trying to explain away some of your qualms with the movie, t hat's all. I think you made a few valid points, and also said a few things that were easily explained away.
 
L

Leprkon

Audioholic General
bobman1235 said:
I wasn't trying to insult you or anythign dude, just trying to explain away some of your qualms with the movie, t hat's all. I think you made a few valid points, and also said a few things that were easily explained away.
I can live with that. If the worst thing I ever argued about with people was a movie, it would be a pretty good life. :)
 
Let's see if my wife is a genius...

I saw it twice now and my wife, after the first time seeing it, says to me:

My wife: Wow, so Darth Sidious' original master was the guy who created Anakin.

Me: Huh?

My wife: Remember in Episode 1 when Shmi says there was no father...?

Me: Yea?

My wife: And then in this movie, Palpatine says that Darth Plagueis his previous Sith Lord/Master (whom he killed) was "so powerful and so wise he could use the Force to influence the midi-chlorians to create life"?

Me: Hmmm (wheels starting to turn now...)

My wife: And Palpatine/Sidius said at one point that he had been watching Anakin for longer than (you) think.

Me: Honey, do you realize that this is like revelation-type stuff?!? I haven't heard ANYONE put forth this theory and yet it makes perfect sense...

So tell me, is my wife a genius?
 
BMXTRIX

BMXTRIX

Audioholic Warlord
Leprkon said:
the basketball-pregnant Padme running off the ship at 100m speed when it landed on the volcano planet.

The Millenium Falcon (supposedly the fastest ship in the universe) takes days to go from Tatooine to the Organa homeworld of Alderaan, but Padme's ship goes to the Outer Rim in a manner of minutes (and Darth Sidius even faster since he had to stop and kick Yoda's butt)....

Sidius able to communicate by a hand transmitter all the way to the Outer Rim, when ObiWan couldn't do the same in Ep 2 using a ship-based radio about twenty times the size (maybe ObiWan needs a better wireless plan ?).

A machine-based life form that had to repeatedly cough... (what's up with that and even if it had been a real life form, why the cough ??? do all evil people cough instead of wear black ??)

Then there's the stupid battle droids... Would someone really program a droid they were sending into battle to say "Ut-oh", let alone "Get out of the way" ??
My wife - three days before child birth was still doing some jogging around - she would forget that she was the size of a house. She quickly remembered though.

Totally agree with you, and everyone else, who has mentioned the time necessary for travel. Heck, the whole timeline seemed skewed without good reference points. It is fairly obvious to me that about 6 months or more passed in the movie - which means either Georgie cut out a LOT of valuable communication between Anakin and Palpatine - or I just suck at reading invisble "4 months later" subtitles.

I can use $5.00 Radio Shack walkie talkies to communicate to the other side of the earth... as long as one of them is next to a land based telephone line. Questioning details that can be explained quite easily don't make sense. He is on a planet setup for long range communication, like cel phone towers, it isn't the phone that does the work, it is a separate transmitter. You should know that. :)

If you watch the movie again, it doesn't appear that it is a machine based life form, but a flesh and blood life form wrapped in a highly technologically advanced exoskelton. There are critters running those there machineries. Getting through the skeleton to the creature was the hard part.

Have you met computer programmers? Of course they would program 'ut-oh' and 'get outta my way' into droids! More likely, the droids have enough AI built in to pick up languages and words spoken to them so they can integrate into local societies better. This way, little local slang isn't foreign to them, and they are able to use it as part of their vocabulary to communicate more effectively with locals. 'get out of my way' sounds exactly like something they would hear a lot. 'ut-oh' as well.

For me, the movie just seemed to drag and while I get the flip-flop of Anakin having been a build up process, his final decision to turn did seem to happen rather quickly and suddenly. Not a path he chose and began walking down, but more like a door he opened, then was forcibly pushed through. Which Palpatine likely had a great deal of ability to do. Help Anakin open the door, then when the time was right - push his weak mind straight through to the dark side in one fell swoop - but it still didn't seem right.

One thing I noticed that I did like was on the lava world, after Obi & Annakins fight, as Obi walked away, he picked up the light saber that he would give to Luke in Ep.IV.

I'm ready for the 3.5 hour version with all the deleted scenes put back in so the movie makes a little more sense... But, with the acting, it seems like it would just drag on instead of be better. I did NOT like how every shot of Padme seemed to be of her bare-belly or bare shoulders or bare flesh... She sleeps in a pearl beaded night gown! How freakin' obnoxious! Really, she seemed like the gratuitous flesh - which was exactly what Leia was NOT. Leia was a fighter - yet was attractive - but she made decisions and fought to follow them up. She wasn't all wishy washy like Padme.

Samuel L. Jackson should not have been a part of the movie ever. He did his wise overseer part in The Matrix and giving him the EXACT same role was more than a little weak. It was distracting from every single movie. Is there no other black actor who could have played that part? I would have taken Chris Rock over Jackson.

Yoda, Anakin, Obi-Wan, and Palpatine were the best they have been in any of the movies so far. Yet, they still seemed to be working with a script that doesn't allow for one shortened word or natural flow from the lips. Freakin' emotionless Vulcans I say! "I will not let you die Padme"... drrr... how about "I'm not gonna let you die" - we already KNOW he's talking to her! ;)

I did enjoy it, but if I'm paying money to go to see a movie, I'm going to TRY to enjoy it. I want to enjoy it.
 
BMXTRIX said:
Samuel L. Jackson should not have been a part of the movie ever. He did his wise overseer part in The Matrix and giving him the EXACT same role was more than a little weak.
Leprkon said:
Has there been a single science-fiction movie made since 1990 that doesn't have a prophecy in it ? Does Samuel L Jackson have them written into his contracts ?
Don't take this the wrong way, but you people are a walking billboard for ignorant white people who think all black people look alike.

Laurence Fishburn was in the Matrix. :)
 
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