Speaker Layout Recommendations for Open Plan - Atmos vs. Hybrid vs. Surround Only

[Fizzafarian]

Looking for advice on best speaker layout for my setup.
My current equipment is:

Front / Right - Martin Logan XT F100
Center - Martin Logan C100
Surrounds - Martin Logan B100 <- Still in return window
Front / Rear Heights - Onkyo S9800 HTIB <— To be decommissioned
Subwoofers - 2 x HSU TN1 15”

I would like to keep the front / left / center / subs at a minimum. Trying to figure out best layout given the above and my open floor plan location.

Current surround bookshelves on the floor stands are 110 degree positioned from center. If I keep these, they have passed WAF in their current location but moving them further back is not possible. They are still in their return window so I’m fine replacing them.

Some options proposed to me:

A. 5.2.1 - 2 surrounds in-ceiling; nothing on floor
B. 7.2.1 - 2 surrounds in-ceiling; keep B100 bookshelves as side surrounds on floor
C. 7.2.1 - Same as above; but side surrounds also in ceiling
D. 5.2.4 - B100’s as floor surrounds; 4 atmos in-ceiling speakers
E. 5.2.2 - Same as D; but only 2 Atmos
F. 7.2.4 - Same as D; but add 2 rear surrounds in ceiling in far back to separate from Atmos
G. 7.2.2 - Same as F; but only 2 Atmos

Which layout would you pick given the above? I would love an Atmos experience if possible. Running cabling is not a factor in my decision (can be done).

Thanks!

 

[TLS Guy]

Looking for advice on best speaker layout for my setup.
My current equipment is:

Front / Right - Martin Logan XT F100
Center - Martin Logan C100
Surrounds - Martin Logan B100 <- Still in return window
Front / Rear Heights - Onkyo S9800 HTIB <— To be decommissioned
Subwoofers - 2 x HSU TN1 15”

I would like to keep the front / left / center / subs at a minimum. Trying to figure out best layout given the above and my open floor plan location.

Current surround bookshelves on the floor stands are 110 degree positioned from center. If I keep these, they have passed WAF in their current location but moving them further back is not possible. They are still in their return window so I’m fine replacing them.

Some options proposed to me:

A. 5.2.1 - 2 surrounds in-ceiling; nothing on floor
B. 7.2.1 - 2 surrounds in-ceiling; keep B100 bookshelves as side surrounds on floor
C. 7.2.1 - Same as above; but side surrounds also in ceiling
D. 5.2.4 - B100’s as floor surrounds; 4 atmos in-ceiling speakers
E. 5.2.2 - Same as D; but only 2 Atmos
F. 7.2.4 - Same as D; but add 2 rear surrounds in ceiling in far back to separate from Atmos
G. 7.2.2 - Same as F; but only 2 Atmos

Which layout would you pick given the above? I would love an Atmos experience if possible. Running cabling is not a factor in my decision (can be done).

Thanks!

We get these posts continuously. I have come to the conclusion that open space multipurpose rooms are not suitable for surround and Atmos etc. You must have a tolerant wife. These are multipurpose spaces, and you have a massive conflict in terms audio and Interior design. Multichannel AV systems really need a dedicated space in my view. In spaces like your, less is better.

I was not intending to put a system in our great room, but my wife insisted and further said no floor space was to be taken up by the system. So I designed a 3.1 system with all speakers in wall.

Like your space it is a very large multipurpose space.

In your plan those surround speakers on stands, are just begging to be knocked over and sent flying, and they really upset the architecture of the room.

A big point I would make, is that a good 2.1 or 3.1 system gives you 95% of what is required. In fact in those sort of space I suspect that those multichannel systems like those are substantially inferior to systems with just good front speakers.

The system above fills that large space easily, and with power to spare. For visitors that tends to be the system here that draws the most interest. I think it is because it is way, way superior to sound bars that practically all are using. I am more and more convinced that comlex AV systems do require a dedicated space. So we have a dedicated space for our full blown all out system.

So, if you have a space you can build out, like a basement space for instance, then put the multichannel system there.

 

[Fizzafarian]

We get these posts continuously. I have come to the conclusion that open space multipurpose rooms are not suitable for surround and Atmos etc. You must have a tolerant wife. These are multipurpose spaces, and you have a massive conflict in terms audio and Interior design. Multichannel AV systems really need a dedicated space in my view. In spaces like your, less is better.

I was not intending to put a system in our great room, but my wife insisted and further said no floor space was to be taken up by the system. So I designed a 3.1 system with all speakers in wall.

Like your space it is a very large multipurpose space.

In your plan those surround speakers on stands, are just begging to be knocked over and sent flying, and they really upset the architecture of the room.

A big pint I would make, is that a good 2.1 or 3.1 system gives you 95% of what is required. In fact in those sort of space I suspect that those multichannel systems like those are substantially inferior to systems with just good front speakers.

The system above fills that large space easily, and with power to spare. For visitors that tends to be the system here that draws the most interest. I think it is because it is way, way superior to sound bars that practically all are using. I am more and more convinced that comlex AV systems do require a dedicated space. So we have a dedicated space for our full blown all out system.

So, if you have a space you can build out, like a basement space for instance, then put the multichannel system there.

Thanks for your feedback. Beautiful space you have!

Unfortunately, in my circumstance this is the only space I have available at the moment. No extra rooms to spare. No basement in existence. It is less for visitors, and more for myself to enjoy streaming movies, gaming on PS5 and music. For music, the F100's in Stereo are more than sufficient.

I do agree on the aesthetics of the surrounds in their current location. On a positive note, the bookshelf is screw-mounted into it's stand so it won't be toppled unless the whole stand is toppled. But still, definitely far from ideal. Hence why I am torn between 5.1/7.1 all in-ceiling vs an Atmos setup.

Given your feedback, I believe your recommendation is to forego Atmos and stick with 5.2.1 or 7.2.1 with ceiling speakers?

 

[TLS Guy]

Thanks for your feedback. Beautiful space you have!

Unfortunately, in my circumstance this is the only space I have available at the moment. No extra rooms to spare. No basement in existence. It is less for visitors, and more for myself to enjoy streaming movies, gaming on PS5 and music. For music, the F100's in Stereo are more than sufficient.

I do agree on the aesthetics of the surrounds in their current location. On a positive note, the bookshelf is screw-mounted into it's stand so it won't be toppled unless the whole stand is toppled. But still, definitely far from ideal. Hence why I am torn between 5.1/7.1 all in-ceiling vs an Atmos setup.

Given your feedback, I believe your recommendation is to forego Atmos and stick with 5.2.1 or 7.2.1 with ceiling speakers?

Then I would do front three and ceiling surround, and no Atmos. Trust me those surrounds will get knocked over, just a matter of when. The most important speakers are the front three.

 

[Wardog555]

Omg. The person is giving you stupid and inappropriate comments.

The only thing worth changing is atmos speaker locations as said previously.

Nothing and I mean it nothing else.

 

[Fizzafarian]

Omg. The person is giving you stupid and inappropriate comments.

The only thing worth changing is atmos speaker locations as said previously.

Nothing and I mean it nothing else.

Thanks. I will plan to replace the atmos speakers with ML MC8's and move the locations to be more aligned with Dolby.

Do you think adding rear surrounds (in-ceiling, distant back) would be beneficial or detrimental?

 

[Trebdp83]

Do not be taken in by those demanding the perfect placement of speakers in a far less than perfect room. What you have now is an acceptable placement of speakers for a 5.2.4 Dolby Atmos Speaker Configuration.

There is no reason to put more holes in the ceiling. You can mount new speakers in the place of the current set easily enough without making newer and bigger holes and plug the current holes easily enough if need be.

Fastening the Surround Speakers to the left and right walls is not a bad idea for the sake of little ones who may try to move them or bump their little heads on the corners of them. Moving the Surround Right speaker out to the wall with it against the banister will not be a detriment to the sound or room aesthetic.

Whatever speakers you decide on using, look into matching subwoofers to lessen the difficulty of dialing them into the system. What are you using to power it all now? Those speakers in that particular room will need good amps from a separates system or a very beefy receiver capable of powering nine speakers without difficulty.

Oh, and Surround Back Speakers will not really work here at ear level and should never be at ceiling level with Height speakers. You will not really want for anything using a 5.2.4 speaker configuration. New AVP/AVRs with new Dolby and DTS “object based” processing can do wonders. On wall Height Speakers are fine and are essentially what you have with the speakers attached to the mounts from their backs.

You might take the Front speakers and move them out a few more inches from the TV to better align with the Height speakers and try swapping subs with the large one in in the left corner and the smaller inside of the Center Channel and Right Speaker. Move the subs back again if bass drops off. Whatever you decide to do with it all, just enjoy it.

 

[-Jim-]

I'm not a fan of gear changes unless there's a real need, and if I was @Fizzafarian and I already had WAF for the present configuration, I'd try it as a 5.2.4 Atmos - before doing anything. As mentioned by @TLS Guy the vast majority of the sound is across the Fronts and Subs.

To obtain WAF for our 5.1 Family Room setup, I went with in walls for the Surrounds, and they are fine (for the very limited use that system gets these days). Our 5.2.4 Atmos system in the Games Room has in ceiling Atmos speakers which easily passed the WAF. At it is impressive with the right Blu-ray.

As mentioned by @Trebdp83 , keep the surround speakers (and for that matter all Bed level speakers) at ear level if at all possible. I just got home from 10 days in Palm Springs visiting (and playing 5 rounds Golf) with one of my Brothers at his winter home in La Quinta for 10 days. He's go a very decent 5.1 system, but the Interior Designers had put all of the bed level speakers in the Ceiling. They think it sounds great, but to me it was very weird. It was all I could do to keep my mouth shut about it as to not offend. There's a lesson to be learned here.

 

[Fizzafarian]

Do not be taken in by those demanding the perfect placement of speakers in a far less than perfect room. What you have now is an acceptable placement of speakers for a 5.2.4 Dolby Atmos Speaker Configuration.

There is no reason to put more holes in the ceiling. You can mount new speakers in the place of the current set easily enough without making newer and bigger holes and plug the current holes easily enough if need be.

Fastening the Surround Speakers to the left and right walls is not a bad idea for the sake of little ones who may try to move them or bump their little heads on the corners of them. Moving the Surround Right speaker out to the wall with it against the banister will not be a detriment to the sound or room aesthetic.

Whatever speakers you decide on using, look into matching subwoofers to lessen the difficulty of dialing them into the system. What are you using to power it all now? Those speakers in that particular room will need good amps from a separates system or a very beefy receiver capable of powering nine speakers without difficulty.

Oh, and Surround Back Speakers will not really work here at ear level and should never be at ceiling level with Height speakers. You will not really want for anything using a 5.2.4 speaker configuration. New AVP/AVRs with new Dolby and DTS “object based” processing can do wonders. On wall Height Speakers are fine and are essentially what you have with the speakers attached to the mounts from their backs.

You might take the Front speakers and move them out a few more inches from the TV to better align with the Height speakers and try swapping subs with the large one in in the left corner and the smaller inside of the Center Channel and Right Speaker. Move the subs back again if bass drops off. Whatever you decide to do with it all, just enjoy it.

Thanks for the feedback. If I move the right surround system back against the wall (with the clock) - would I also need to move the left to be more closely aligned on the same horizontal axis behind the couch? I'd need to run wires through the ceiling and bring them down to bed level to move the right speaker to that location unless I use a wireless transmitter (any caution against these?)

The subwoofers are currently 2 x matching HSU TN1's in each front corner of the room. What looks like a smaller sub just next to the TV is a robot vacuum

I need to replace the ceiling bookshelves in any scenario as they are underpowered relative to the new Martin Logan bed level setup and they distort at high volume. Am eyeing the Martin Logan MC6 in-ceiling speakers. I can extend the existing pre-wiring to the correct location and plug the current holes fairly simply and the current wiring came with an existing cover to use for the ceiling where the builder pre-wired the home.

Thanks for your advice!

 

[Fizzafarian]

I'm not a fan of gear changes unless there's a real need, and if I was @Fizzafarian and I already had WAF for the present configuration, I'd try it as a 5.2.4 Atmos - before doing anything. As mentioned by @TLS Guy the vast majority of the sound is across the Fronts and Subs.

To obtain WAF for our 5.1 Family Room setup, I went with in walls for the Surrounds, and they are fine (for the very limited use that system gets these days). Our 5.2.4 Atmos system in the Games Room has in ceiling Atmos speakers which easily passed the WAF. At it is impressive with the right Blu-ray.

As mentioned by @Trebdp83 , keep the surround speakers (and for that matter all Bed level speakers) at ear level if at all possible. I just got home from 10 days in Palm Springs visiting (and playing 5 rounds Golf) with one of my Brothers at his winter home in La Quinta for 10 days. He's go a very decent 5.1 system, but the Interior Designers had put all of the bed level speakers in the Ceiling. They think it sounds great, but to me it was very weird. It was all I could do to keep my mouth shut about it as to not offend. There's a lesson to be learned here.

Thanks for the feedback and your experience at your brother's house. I suspected they would sound odd, but never experienced first hand Am fairly happy with the sound now except with the distortion of the Atmos speakers in-ceiling. So will likely just go ahead and replace those with some matching Martin Logan's for the ceiling and reposition them appropriately. I also managed to pass WAF with the right demo reel

 

[Trebdp83]

I couldn't figure out that sub and no I know why I could not do so. You could move the SR to the clock wall but I'd also move the LS by the little tree by the sliding door if you do so. You could also move the SR to the right where the baby jumper is located in the pics.

What are you using for a processor or receiver? What are your crossover settings? I'd set the Heights no lower than 120Hz and maybe set them at 150Hz. If not using room correction, you can also manually EQ the speakers as well to taste and turn down the lower frequencies in the Height speakers along with using a higher crossover. You can readjust for the new Height speakers when replacing the current set. Oh, and you can also lower the Height Level setting in the AVP/AVR as well to try and avoid distortion from them when playing things at high volume.