Spatial M3 Sapphire Speakers

V

VMPS-TIII

Audioholic General
Has anyone here listened to the Spatial M3 Sapphire Speakers. Looks like an interesting design.


 
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Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Warlord
I did some digging into open baffle designs. Super clean bass, but not a lot of it was my takeaway on it. I haven't heard any, but this guy must think they're ugly af...

793291530_HiFiSpace17x12.jpg.733a5dedb3d806409c696b9192c8bbfc_copy_800x389.jpg


I have no idea what the logic is here, but it's one of the images that came up when I Googled for a better look at them, lol.

Hmm... upon closer inspection those don't appear to be the same speakers. Still funny tho!
 
V

VMPS-TIII

Audioholic General
They look like this.... :D

M3 Sapphire.png

M3 Sapphire Specifications:
Type: 2-Way Dynamic Dipolar - Open Baffle
Drivers: 1 X Spatial M100 Uniwave® - 575Hz - 40kHz Ultra Wide Range
2 X Spatial ST15 - 15 Inch Cast Frame Dipole Woofer
Frequency Range: 32Hz-40kHz (Typical In-Room Bandwidth)
Impedance: 4 Ohms Nominal
Sensitivity: 92 DB
 
S

shadyJ

Speaker of the House
I am skeptical about these speaker's efficacy. I don't trust the specs on that tweeter. I would assume that speaker has all kinds of directivity control problems until proven otherwise.
 
NINaudio

NINaudio

Audioholic Field Marshall
I am skeptical about these speaker's efficacy. I don't trust the specs on that tweeter. I would assume that speaker has all kinds of directivity control problems until proven otherwise.
I was trying to find more info on their drivers, it seems they use Eminence woofers, but I couldn't hunt down the tweeter.
 
John Parks

John Parks

Audioholic General
I always thought the X2 model looked awesome:
1596044032466.png
 
M

marko.lindvall

Audiophyte
I was trying to find more info on their drivers, it seems they use Eminence woofers, but I couldn't hunt down the tweeter.
Tweeter is Peerless DA32TX-08 1-1/4" corundum dome tweeter.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Slumlord
You know I just don't know why people turn out junk designs like that.

You can only do an open baffle speaker like that with complex DSP. The cancellations between the front and rear of the cones will be immense, giving an atrocious FR.

They have crossed the tweeter right on its FS. Yet it is a high Q tweeter, Qt 0.56. So it needs to cross at 1Khz, and then with an electrical fourth order filter. Yet the hype says it is a simple crossover network.

Who ever designed that atrocious speaker must know virtually nothing about loudspeakers and even less about how to design one. This sort of thing is just sad.
 
C

ChevChelios

Audiophyte
Danny Richie believes they are a great design and backs it up. I would bet a 100 bajillion dollars that both Danny and Clayton know more about speaker design and physics than you do.

They sound fantastic, even magical on some material according to my wife. (She is the real deal BTW.)
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Slumlord
Danny Richie believes they are a great design and backs it up. I would bet a 100 bajillion dollars that both Danny and Clayton know more about speaker design and physics than you do.

They sound fantastic, even magical on some material according to my wife. (She is the real deal BTW.)
I highly doubt that, and I stand by my comments. You can NOT defy the laws of physics, which that design attempts and inevitably must fail to do.
 
C

ChevChelios

Audiophyte
TLS Guy, the most likely scenario is that those two highly experienced professionals know more about how the physics work than you do. I own them and they sound great. Every single person who has heard them agrees. I had Dynaudios in my system before and everyone liked them....but after experiencing the M3 Sapphires , everyone who sits and listens to their choice of artist agrees they are on an entirely different and higher plane when it comes to the space, scale, tangibility, authenticity and the experience of music.

Cheers.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Slumlord
TLS Guy, the most likely scenario is that those two highly experienced professionals know more about how the physics work than you do. I own them and they sound great. Every single person who has heard them agrees. I had Dynaudios in my system before and everyone liked them....but after experiencing the M3 Sapphires , everyone who sits and listens to their choice of artist agrees they are on an entirely different and higher plane when it comes to the space, scale, tangibility, authenticity and the experience of music.

Cheers.
Well I have over 60 years of experience. I have measurements and data to back up my designs. Your claims are anecdotal BS and mean nothing. I want to see data. I can show you data on my designs. Without data your claims are totally worthless.
 
C

ChevChelios

Audiophyte
Well I have over 60 years of experience. I have measurements and data to back up my designs. Your claims are anecdotal BS and mean nothing. I want to see data. I can show you data on my designs. Without data your claims are totally worthless.
What is your loudspeaker company? Have you heard these speakers? Have you tested these speakers?

If you haven't heard or tested them, then we all know whose foul rantings are totally worthless.


Take Care and GFY!!!;)
 
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TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Slumlord
What is your loudspeaker company? Have you heard these speakers? Have you tested these speakers?
No, I have not heard and tested those speakers. However I can spot a promising design. But would not recommend one without data.

My current AV room



Left and right dual active triamped TL speakers and center active biamped TL



Sealed surround speakers, and rear back active biamped dual TLS. The 4 ceiling speakers are sealed.

FR and impulse response of a front main speaker.



Off axis response. Black line is 90 degrees off axis.



Waterfall response.



This is the FR in the new room, which has less LF artefact.



FR of the center TL

This is the FR of the total system at the main listening position.



Center speaker



I have two other systems in the house all with measurements. The above are just a few to illustrate what I mean.

I am a retired physician.

The late Siegfried Linkwitz published a lot on open backed speakers. He showed that good results could only be achieved with an active design with active Eq.
 
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ChevChelios

Audiophyte
No, I have not heard and rested those speakers. However I can spot a promising design. But would not recommend one without data.

I am a retired physician.

The late Siegfried Linkwitz published a lot on open backed speakers. He showed that good results could only be achieved with an active design with active Eq.

Being a physician confers you zero authority on this topic. Being retired also provides no credibility. I see you have software and it has produced graphs. And yes, there was a guy named Linkwitz who had ideas on this topic. You
You however, have no basis to speak on, nor to rudely criticize.

Like I said, Danny Richie of GR Research knows more than you. He tests more than you. He has designed and sold more speakers than you, and has won more accolades than you. Exact same for Clayton Shaw, the founder of Emerald Physics and Spatial Audio. Neither are retired from their field of expertise, they are moving the ball forward.

Your room is pretty though.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Slumlord
Being a physician confers you zero authority on this topic. Being retired also provides no credibility. I see you have software and it has produced graphs. And yes, there was a guy named Linkwitz who had ideas on this topic. You
You however, have no basis to speak on, nor to rudely criticize.

Like I said, Danny Richie of GR Research knows more than you. He tests more than you. He has designed and sold more speakers than you, and has won more accolades than you. Exact same for Clayton Shaw, the founder of Emerald Physics and Spatial Audio. Neither are retired from their field of expertise, they are moving the ball forward.

Your room is pretty though.
Publish you data or put up.

I have every right to criticize when I see a designer cross a high Q tweeter right at its Fs. That is a massive howler and shows colossal ignorance of the principles of speaker design.
 
S

shadyJ

Speaker of the House
Like I said, Danny Richie of GR Research knows more than you. He tests more than you. He has designed and sold more speakers than you, and has won more accolades than you. Exact same for Clayton Shaw, the founder of Emerald Physics and Spatial Audio. Neither are retired from their field of expertise, they are moving the ball forward.
Where is the proof that these designs are any good? I can't find a single measurement for any model within this speaker manufacturer. If these engineers are so great, why isn't there evidence of their expertise anywhere? The problem is that these designs have would have what would seem to be fundamental flaws. Sometimes there can be clever solutions that deal with those flaws, but you are going to need to have proof that those problems have been overcome. Claims require evidence, and extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, but there isn't a single shred of evidence around for the extraordinary claims that this manufacturer is making.
 
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benou80

Audiophyte
I was trying to find more info on their drivers, it seems they use Eminence woofers, but I couldn't hunt down the tweeter.
Hello guys,

Those loudspeakers seem to sound great. Indeed, there is no measurments published out there but Danny RITCHIE said they are one of the best loudspeakers out there (and he publish his own loudspekaers measurements).

Does anyone know about the subwoofers used on those speakers? Are they Eminence drivers? Which model is that? It seems to be a custom version.

All the best,
Ben
 

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