So I gotta ask, 104% tariffs on China?

[highfigh]

not yet .... but when there is finally peace ... hopefully soon

Peace- what a concept.

 

[haraldo]

Would the tariffs be able to kill Boeing as a company?
I reckon Aviation is not dependent on global trade ..... it defines global trade

It is not a joke, if the tariffs make a Boeing 737 tens of millions of dollars more expensive, there´s not going to be any sales..... I reckon it is very likely for massive layoffs in Kansas, South Carolina and Seattle ......

Quote: Angus Kelly, CEO of Aercap, the world´s largest aivation lesser
These tarriffs will reduce Boeing to becoming exclusively a US domestic brand, leaving Airbus to dominate Europe, the middle east and Asia. Chinese Comac could then become a serious contender

 

[Mikado463]

Didn't Donnie announce that Boeing was getting the F47 contract ?

 

[Trell]

Didn't Donnie announce that Boeing was getting the F47 contract ?

It's about the civilian air plane part of Boeing. As for the F47: Designing and making new military fighter jets are very expensive and US has been able to reduce that cost by having allies buy planes. That is currently not an easy sell, and that goes for the current F35.

 

[haraldo]

my post .... and that youtube video is only about the civilian range of aircrafts ......

I think US government is not exactly setting themselves in an advantageous position to sell any military aircrafts to anyone else than .... the USA

Kongsberg Defence and Aerospace in Norway are making the Carbon based elevators for the F35 fighter jets, but now I reckon they will be 35% more expensive because Trump does not like Norway .... I guess Lockheed Martin soon needs to double the price of the F35 ..... I guess layoffs coming to Lockheed Martin too .....

 

[haraldo]

Didn't Donnie announce that Boeing was getting the F47 contract ?

No country outside of US is going to consider this aircraft without an agreement of trade deals ..... with the toll barriers this is not going to happen and essentially Trump with his decisions will kill the whole F47 program

There is no way there is going to be an F47 program with the toll barriers in effect!
Again .... massive layoffs in the US, USA voted for it!

 

[Mr._Clark]

No country outside of US is going to consider this aircraft without an agreement of trade deals ..... with the toll barriers this is not going to happen and essentially Trump with his decisions will kill the whole F47 program

There is no way there is going to be an F47 program with the toll barriers in effect!
Again .... massive layoffs in the US

Trump's stance Re NATO and the trade wars have already caused buyers to reconsider the F-35.

>>>Growing tensions with NATO over the U.S. stance on Ukraine and President Trump's escalating trade war now jeopardize a crucial aspect of the alliance's airpower strategy, as member countries indicate they could walk away from plans to purchase F-35 fighters.<<<

https://www.npr.org/2025/03/19/nx-s1-5330475/f35-fighter-nato-trump-gripen

 

[haraldo]

Trump's stance Re NATO and the trade wars have already caused buyers to reconsider the F-35.

>>>Growing tensions with NATO over the U.S. stance on Ukraine and President Trump's escalating trade war now jeopardize a crucial aspect of the alliance's airpower strategy, as member countries indicate they could walk away from plans to purchase F-35 fighters.<<<

https://www.npr.org/2025/03/19/nx-s1-5330475/f35-fighter-nato-trump-gripen

From what I know, Canada already cancelled all the remaining deliveries of F35, considering Swedish Gripen
That is 88 airplanes at a value of 13 billion $ ... just because of the toll barriers to protect USA
nice ..... Trump

 

[dlaloum]

From what I know, Canada already cancelled all the remaining deliveries of F35, considering Swedish Gripen
That is 88 airplanes at a value of 13 billion $ ... just because of the toll barriers to protect USA
nice ..... Trump

Trump cannot lie straight in bed, let alone utter two words without lying.

His intent is unclear - and certainly cannot be discerned from what he says (both because he lies, and because he spouts mutually contradictory reasonings, sometimes within minutes of each other).

Yes he has expounded popularist trigger and dog whistle lines.... "Toll barriers to protect USA" being a key current one.

The reality that no credible economist agrees that "Toll barriers protect USA" is irrelevant to the popularist statement.

So far all he has demonstrated, is that he can use the Tariffs to manipulate the stock markets, and make billions for his administration friends through insider trading. (which he has proudly boasted as a win.... pointing to all of his friends that made lots of money! - it's a positive!!)

The next thing that is apparent, is that his royal majesty has set himself up as the "patron" - with individuals, countries and companies, coming to him and making various offers, in exchange for tariff "deals" - effectively line my pocket and I will carve out an exclusion for you.... He has set up a patronage system. (which could absolutely be dismantled by a willing legislature.... or in some cases supreme court - but so far neither have acted to halt Trump - and the administration is proceeding with replacing key leaders in enforcement positions, so as to ensure the potential future irrelevancy of congress and court)

The Bond market has started to show Trump and the Trumpistas, that they do not hold all the cards in this game, and if they really want to play in a Zero-Sum manner - the USA will lose too.

The thing is, Trump sees everything in a Zero-Sum manner. Even if he ends up ahead he does not believe that he has "Won" unless the opponent has clearly "Lost". There is no win-win.

Hence there are no true negotiations, everything is either a transaction, or a surrender.... actual negotiation is completely alien to Trump. (And even transactions need to be undertaken with a strong caveat emptor, as Trump demonstrably does not keep to commitments he has made)

 

[lovinthehd]

Translation ..............Pubs & Dems, both F-ups in their own right

Yeah but republicans have just gone off the charts with drumphy....welcome to fascist amerika!

 

[lovinthehd]

Yes, it was NIxon, but I doubt it was for MFN since they werent capable of manufacturing much of interest at that time. Maybe he saw potential, but I don't remember seeing anything about his interest in trade, which was very different at that time WRT offshore manufacturing. Tariffs on Japanese electronics (mostly TVs) hadn't reached the level that caused them to open plants in Mexico at that time and the US still had several consumer electronics manufacturers onshore owned by US-based companies.

No, it was just an opening of the relations door which had been shut due the commie thing, took the trade act of 74 to get that rolling. Believe 80 was first year of MFN status which was renewed yearly for 20 years until made permanent. Biggest objections I remember was over human rights issues.

 

[Danzilla31]

One of the main industries that is going to be impacted on the most is ours unfortunately.

Rythmik on the AVS forums announced they are going to have to hold off on their next major shipment because of the impact this is going to have on them.

Bigger companies that can bulk order and keep prices stable with excess stock until this calms down will survive. But smaller companies like Rythmik or RSL etc that can't afford to do that are going to really struggle.

 

[Danzilla31]

It's rough times for our industry for the imminent future I'm afraid.

 

[lovinthehd]

It's rough times for our industry for the imminent future I'm afraid.

Not just this industry but many. What is your view/explanation on your continuing support for the drumph with all the bullshit he's released in the last 90 or so days?

 

[Danzilla31]

Not just this industry but many. What is your view/explanation on your continuing support for the drumph with all the bullshit he's released in the last 90 or so days?

Well I've never supported him. I sat out the last 3 elections because Democrats just couldn't put anyone up against him I could vote for with a clear conscience. But I couldn't vote for him either. My post history back in the day actually reflects this when I posted a lot more on politics in the steam vent. I usually don't talk politics with anyone anymore because your not convincing anyone from either side these days of anything but since you asked about my views on this situation and Trump I'll try.

 

[Danzilla31]

Not just this industry but many. What is your view/explanation on your continuing support for the drumph with all the bullshit he's released in the last 90 or so days?

Since I don't blindly hate him I understand what he is trying to do. Im not sure his tactics are going to work

It is a bipartisan agreement I believe that we all can agree that certain products should not be produced by other countries especially countries that may someday be in opposition to you.

Steel
Pharmeucticals
Military
Energy

there's a couple more but I think we can all agree some things each country should be self sustainable

For 40 or 50 years BOTH parties have allowed not only the trade defict to happen but certain key sectors to get farmed out to any country willing to do it for cheap. There were other reasons we wanted to help prop up poor countries and economies we hoped to make some countries more democratic as well but regardless we allowed it to happen.

Now Trump wants to get some of that back. But after 40 or 50 years of allowing China especially to gain this much of an advantage I don't believe your going to get some of these key sectors back by using tariffs like a blunt instrument to get what you want.

30 years ago maybe but not now. We gave up too much of our infrastructure to think we can just push everyone around.

Plus due to COVID and the economy the last couple years the American people and small businesses may not be able to sustain themselves long enough for this type of strategy to work

Trump is gambling on the rest of the world and China being vulnerable as well combined with the fact that our purchasing power drives a lot of other countries industries that he can get them to cave and we can get a more even foothold in the free trade market and bring certain sectors of our infrastructure back

He's playing a dangerous game because it may not work. And if he crashes the economy it guarantees the Republican parties demise for the next several voting cycles. In poker terms he's going all in with this approach he's betting all of us and our economic stability on the line with this move. It's too dangerous in my estimation never put all your chips in one pot. Never play poker with money you can't afford to lose and it's not even his money it's ours.

Plus a lot of countries are aware of the problems China poses and they are just as unhappy about this as we are. Yes we are tarrifed by other countries but all countries do it. And some even us allow a deficit at times to other countries if it builds alliances or gets us something we need. Sometimes deficits are necessary in global trade something Trump omitted with his fancy tariff poster he showed us the other day. Instead of offering countries we could ally with some diplomacy to take on Chinas monopoly he alienated everybody.

And I'm not sure we can take on China alone in the trading sector

 

[Danzilla31]

What I'm unclear on because you can never figure out what that crazy sob is doing is are the tarrifs just a plot to shake up the established order. So that diplomatic and other processes can be brought to the table.

If that's the case it might work but if not if tarrifs are his plan on getting this to happen I don't see how it can work and I don't trust his ability to strategize especially when things don't go his way. He gets too emotional and egotistic in those scenarios and any strategy goes out the window.

That's it for how I feel about where I'm at with Trump these days

 

[Danzilla31]

Where I'm at with China and the tarrifs and how it impacts our industry and other industries is

I don't blame China one bit. We did this to ourselves. We've allowed this to go one for over 40 years because we've allowed our politicians and corporations to get away with it.

I can't blame China for taking advantage. Is it ruthless? Yes. Is it a problem? absolutely. But it's one we brought on ourselves. And now our industry and so many others are going to suffer for it while we try to correct our course.

And that's just a shame.

Buy what you can now guys. Because if this tarrif war goes on for a long enough time audio products are going to either get very expensive or just not be available for awhile

 

[TLS Guy]

Well I've never supported him. I sat out the last 3 elections because Democrats just couldn't put anyone up against him I could vote for with a clear conscience. But I couldn't vote for him either. My post history back in the day actually reflects this when I posted a lot more on politics in the steam vent. I usually don't talk politics with anyone anymore because your not convincing anyone from either side these days of anything but since you asked about my views on this situation and Trump I'll try.

Well, that did not help much. This is time for Republicans who disagree with this regime to make their voices heard and oppose loudly. I don't care who the Democrat candidate is. I just know he or she is very unlikely to be a fascist. Whereas there is a good chance any Republican candidate is.

I'm not joking. I just sat through the second Minnesota Republican second district Republican conference on Saturday morning, as I'm an alternate delegate now. I used to be a delegate, but got demoted. Anyhow I heard appalling stuff, especially from those running for the Senate in the midterms. The Democrat is retiring. One of the candidates who spoke was really over the top full blown fascist.

This is serious as Minnesota has been in the democratic camp of late. However current polls have not been encouraging. There is a fascist movement rolling across the US right now, and make no mistake about this.

It won't take much more of this to transmute into a full blown shooting civil war.

Even green card holders and those with citizenship like myself are potentially not immune from this vile man's poison, and currently that now includes a close family member. Remember they eventually come for you!

 

[Danzilla31]

Well, that did not help much. This is time for Republicans who disagree with this regime to make their voices heard and oppose loudly. I don't care who the Democrat candidate is. I just know he or she is very unlikely to be a fascist. Whereas there is a good chance any Republican candidate is.

I'm not joking. I just sat through the second Minnesota Republican second district Republican conference on Saturday morning, as I'm an alternate delegate now. I used to be a delegate, but got demoted. Anyhow I heard appalling stuff, especially from those running for the Senate in the midterms. The Democrat is retiring. One of the candidates who spoke was really over the top full blown fascist.

This is serious as Minnesota has been in the democratic camp of late. However current polls have not been encouraging. There is a fascist movement rolling across the US right now, and make no mistake about this.

It won't take much more of this to transmute into a full blown shooting civil war.

Even green card holders and those with citizenship like myself are potentially not immune from this vile man's poison, and currently that now includes a close family member. Remember they eventually come for you!

This is a thread on the audio implications of these tarriffs. Lets continue the political side of this conversation more in the steam thread if that's okay with you .

I probably shouldnt have answered Lovins question on this thread I didn't mind the question it's just off topic of the thread. Sorry about that everyone.