Small office/den surround system

[jcl]

I'm thinking of replacing my office system with a 5.1 or 7.1 system so it can dual purpose as a den. it is 12' x 14' x 8' so not very big. My desk is on one short wall at one end of the room, the audio rack & current speakers at the other. Probably will get an SVS sb12 (or 2) for the low end. Will use my Onkyo HT-Rc180 for now.

My Vonschweikert VR-3s are just too big for the room. They haven't sounded as good as in my previous larger office with vaulted ceilings. I really like the sound of maggies, but I don't think there's enough room to do them justice (and I think the center may still be an issue).

Small towers or monitors, that can be placed close to the walls would fit the room best. I'm thinking I'll listen to the back surrounds as near fields at my desk as a zone 2. Not sure if I want to do all monitors around or have a center. TV can mount on the wall so I'll have space for a monitor in the center. Listening levels will be modest.

Budget < 3,000. The less I spend the better.
NHT, maybe absolute towers up front, or classic 2 or 3s.
Atlantic Technology 2400 system
Philharmonic Monitors (haven't found much on these, the towers are just too deep)
ATC SCM7 - due to TLS Guy's strong recommendation
ERA d3 or 4 or 5, the lcr's are around
Ascend Sierra 1s
Energy Rc-10s

That's already a lengthy list. Any suggests for brands/models I'm missing? Recommendations for/against anything on the list?
Opinions on tower/center/surround vs. monitors all round?

Thanks in advance

 

[theJman]

Small towers or monitors, that can be placed close to the walls would fit the room best.

Based upon that a few others perhaps worth considering are:

• KEF Q300 or XQ10
• XTZ 99.25 Mark II or 99.26 Mark II
• DefTech SM65
• Source Loudspeakers 1.6WC
• Swans/HiVi has a number of nice bookshelf speakers to choose from

 

[alphaiii]

The NHT Classic Three is very nice... on sale right now too for $300 each. Sale ends today though. There is an authorized NHT dealer with a 10% off code that would bring the cost down even more - a steal at that price.

I like the RC-10's alot, but sold those in favor of the Classic Three... Of course, the Three's are twice the price.

The Era speakers are going to be tough to find, since they were discontinued. Listen Up does have some of the LCR models available new at closeout pricing. The Era D4 and D5 have been replaced by the Peachtree D4 and D5, and the price isn't cheap.

The Sierra's are great speakers as well... also clearly better than the RC-10, IMO... but at almost 3x the cost. I didn't own the Sierra and Classic Three at the same time, so I can't say which I think is better... but I did compare each of those directly (A/B level matched) to the Energy RC-10...

Taking that experience, I'd say the Classic Three at the current sale price is a better deal... but that doesn't mean it's the better speaker. You'll find there are plenty of fans on each side of that shootout.

I have no doubt the Philharmonitors are a top notch speaker, given Dennis Murphy's repuation. I'd love to hear those.

 

[GranteedEV]

Budget < 3,000. The less I spend the better.
NHT, maybe absolute towers up front, or classic 2 or 3s.
Atlantic Technology 2400 system
Philharmonic Monitors (haven't found much on these, the towers are just too deep)
ATC SCM7 - due to TLS Guy's strong recommendation
ERA d3 or 4 or 5, the lcr's are around
Ascend Sierra 1s
Energy Rc-10s

Rather than any of those, I would probably be inclined towards:

3X Soundfield Audio M1 ($1950) + 2X KEF Q100 ($400) + 2X Epik Legend ($900)

Ever so slightly over the 3K mark, but that's mainly because of the dual sealed subwoofers. You coudl always add the subs later, as the M1s have rather deep response on their own.

 

[jcl]

Rather than any of those, I would probably be inclined towards:

3X Soundfield Audio M1 ($1950) + 2X KEF Q100 ($400) + 2X Epik Legend ($900)

Ever so slightly over the 3K mark, but that's mainly because of the dual sealed subwoofers. You coudl always add the subs later, as the M1s have rather deep response on their own.

I wasn't including the subs in the $3k, that's for speakers alone. So that's still under budget.

However, I thought the Soundfield Audio's top feature was it's deep extension and efficiency for a bookshelf due to the active woofer, which I don't see of great value to me in a small room crossed over to capable subs.

I always thought built in powered 'subs' in the likes of def techs and Polk LSI25's were an awkward solution. Think I'd rather go active or passive only, not the mix. Not sure though, i'll do some more reading up on them.

 

[GranteedEV]

However, I thought the Soundfield Audio's top feature was it's deep extension and efficiency

Not at all - its top feature is the KEF-sourced 5" aluminum coaxial driver plus tangerine tweeter guide covering 200hz on up. With the 8" woofer taking away the need for it to produce lower frequencies, it's the mids that benefit with top class resolution and accuracy.

Unlike every since speaker on that list of yours, this one will actually have an even sound power response into the small room, which will give a more natural tonal balance. The rest are all just basic box speakers with a power response dip in the midrange accompanied by a power response peak, as the large mid transitions to the small tweeter.

For example the Ascend sierra one at 45 degrees off axis:

See how there's an increase in treble response after 1.5khz or so? That's why I wouldn't want the sierra one - the sound reflected by the room is not balanced.

The Soundfield M1 even at 60 degrees off axis:

Shows pretty much none of this behaviour in the upper mids/lower treble (a bit more energy in the upper treble, but these are benign frequencies, which are more readily absorbed by rooms anyways). The off-axis response declines smoothly. The speakers on your list will not have this important feature.

Also being a coaxial, the vertical, horizontal sweet spots are significantly wider, whether that matters or not, it's never a bad thing. With the recommended cross-firing you will get a very nice soundstage.

I mean, yes the woofer can dig pretty deep, and that's cool, but it's an interchangable part. The coaxial mid/tweeter is not - it's the star of the show. The Q100 however forces it (the same driver) to play too low in frequency for best results.

 

[jcl]

Ok, the Soundfield's are using a coaxial driver, I had forgotten that. The first 'high end' speakers I listened to at length were a friends KEF 105s. How though would the Soundfield's compare to a higher KEF offering, maybe one of the smaller towers, Q500 for instance? Or perhaps a Tannoy revolution?

 

[GranteedEV]

Ok, the Soundfield's are using a coaxial driver, I had forgotten that. The first 'high end' speakers I listened to at length were a friends KEF 105s. How though would the Soundfield's compare to a higher KEF offering, maybe one of the smaller towers, Q500 for instance? Or perhaps a Tannoy revolution?

I can't comment on the tannoys, but i'd expect them to be as good as anything short of the R500 / R900 / 207/2 /Blade, all of which of course have bigger footprints. I'd rather have the soundfields than the Q500, because the Q500 again asks the 5.25" mid to play really low (at least down to 80hz if crossing to a sub). Since the Soundfields have a high pass almost an octave and a half, maybe two octaves higher than that, you've got less potential for frequency modulation. Of course a true 3-way costs more, and that is the case.

 

[jcl]

Can anyone provide feedback on the Philharmonic Monitors? The towers certainly have gotten a lot of attention around here. I'm wondering how they sound with the raal.

 

[Nuance AH]

Can anyone provide feedback on the Philharmonic Monitors? The towers certainly have gotten a lot of attention around here. I'm wondering how they sound with the raal.

The Monitors don't use the RAAL, but rather the Fountek. Dennis has great things to say about the latter, though. They are on the large size, but I'm sure they sound great. The SoundField monitors mentioned also look very nice. You wouldn't happen to have made a post under a different name on AVS Forum as well, eh? Someone over there has the same requirements as you.

 

[jcl]

The Monitors don't use the RAAL, but rather the Fountek. Dennis has great things to say about the latter, though. They are on the large size, but I'm sure they sound great. The SoundField monitors mentioned also look very nice. You wouldn't happen to have made a post under a different name on AVS Forum as well, eh? Someone over there has the same requirements as you.

Thanks for the correction on the RAAL vs. Fountek. I have read info on the monitors only a few times and I must get confused between the I, II, and some customs. I haven't posted anything over there in a long time. I spend/waste enough of my time on a regular basis here. I pop in there only once in a while.

 

[Nuance AH]

Thanks for the correction on the RAAL vs. Fountek. I have read info on the monitors only a few times and I must get confused between the I, II, and some customs. I haven't posted anything over there in a long time. I spend/waste enough of my time on a regular basis here. I pop in there only once in a while.

Gotcha. Well, I second Grant's recommendation of the SoundField Audio Monitor 1, and also reaffirm the Philharmonitor recommendation. I think both would put a huge smile on your face.