Second Sub - Options, Placement, and More

V

virtualdanger

Audioholic Intern
I'm looking add a second sub as part of a home theater upgrade, and would like to get input on options, placement, and more.

Context
To provide some background, I am based in the Philippines, so availability and pricing is vastly different from the US. I currently have a Yamaha RX-V375 5.1 channel amp, and am looking to move to a 9.2 channel amp. Most likely its going to be the Denon X3600H, with the backup option being the Marantz 6013 (Both having individual configuration for the subs). The planned speaker setup will be 5.2.4.My front towers are Polk Audio Signature S50's. Picked them up last year, and am very happy with them for 2 channel stereo.

I currently have a 10 month old Polk Audio HTS12 sub-woofer. Have been quite happy with it.

Second Sub
Initially I was interested in trying out a different brand, but my reading all points towards matched subs, and avoiding subs with different characteristics. So I'm assuming I am restricted to adding another HTS12. Correct me if I am wrong please?

A suggestion was to sell the HTS12 and get 2 new subs instead. I did consider SVS, but they are quite a bit more expensive. If it was just adding 1 to the existing setup it may have been doable; but 2 is biting off more than I can handle for now.

Also, prices in the Philippines are generally more than the US. Below are some options and prices in USD:
  • SVS PB1000 - $800
  • SVS PB2000 - $1250
  • SVS PB3000 - $2150
  • SVS PB4000 - $3200
  • Polk Audio HTS12 - $550
  • Q Acoustics - $800
  • Klipsch R-120SW - $550
  • Klipsch SPL-120 - $900
  • Klipsch SPL-150 - $1100
Note that with SVS sub's, stocks are also limited.

Let me know of your thoughts and suggestions.

Placement:
The room is not a dedicated home theater room, rather a re-purposed living room. For the most part its 16.4 x 9.4 feet. It is separated from the dining area it opens out into by curtains.

Below is the existing room layout:
  • I'm using a roof mounted projector
  • Front Left and Right speakers are slightly off-axis, pointed towards the listening position
  • Surround Left and Right are sadly a little behind the listening position (as they are wall mounted)
2510 HT Option 1.jpg


Below is a proposed room layout:
  • Existing Sub 1 position has been changed
  • Sub 2 has been included
  • Also providing an option for Surround Left and Right (Let me know if this is better suited than the existing position)
  • Another option is to leave the Surround speakers as they currently are (first image above), and just move the Couch a little behind.
2510 HT Option 2.jpg


The sub positions are based on Gene's YouTube videos and guides for multi sub placement. For 2 subs the suggestion was the front center and rear center of the room; opposite each other. I cannot do exactly center, but this is the next closest thing.

Go to the 5 min mark.
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Warlord
Damn dood. Good post. Lots of helpful info.

I saw some talk about that particular Polk sub between you and HD. I agree with him that Polk don't really make the best subs but yours looks to be an exception. At least better than most of their other offerings, anyway. A 2nd one might be sufficient for you, and would be your best budget option. If you switch to another brand SVS is about as good as it gets from your list, but I'd want a matching pair.

I would stay away from Klipsch unless you can get a good deal on the R112SW or R115SW specifically. Those models I've read are actually decent, but only those 2.

As far as placement goes it's different for every room. I'd say start out with a method that gets you as close as you can to "ideal" and see what happens. No 2 rooms will have the same response to the same setup. I've found the sub crawl to be pretty effective for me. It can work with multiple subs too.

 
V

virtualdanger

Audioholic Intern
Damn dood. Good post. Lots of helpful info.

I saw some talk about that particular Polk sub between you and HD. I agree with him that Polk don't really make the best subs but yours looks to be an exception. At least better than most of their other offerings, anyway. A 2nd one might be sufficient for you, and would be your best budget option. If you switch to another brand SVS is about as good as it gets from your list, but I'd want a matching pair.

I would stay away from Klipsch unless you can get a good deal on the R112SW or R115SW specifically. Those models I've read are actually decent, but only those 2.

As far as placement goes it's different for every room. I'd say start out with a method that gets you as close as you can to "ideal" and see what happens. No 2 rooms will have the same response to the same setup. I've found the sub crawl to be pretty effective for me. It can work with multiple subs too.

Thanks so much. Just trying to be thorough. Have been doing some research, and gathering info. So sharing everything I have. Besides if I provide enough info, it'll save y'all for asking questions about room dimensions, my receiver, etc.

Yes, based on my reading, many of the older PSW model Polk sub's were quite average, but thankfully this HTS series is better. SVS would of course be in a different league, but don't think the budget will allow for 2 new ones now.

Thanks for the tips on the Klipsch; didnt have any opinion on their sub's; so this helps.

Fair enough; I've been told about the sub-woofer crawl a few times, and by multiple people. As well as having seen several video's on it. Thank you, and yes, I will do it when settling on the positions.

Any thoughts on the Surround speakers? Between where they are now (image 1), and the proposed location (Image 2)?
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Warlord
My surrounds are set up like your image 2, up high and angled down a little. Image 1 would work well also with your speakers ~ear level.

As far as your subs, I say go ahead and set them up like your image and give it a try. That might work really well. If not, move 'em around a little. There's no way anyone can guess for sure how it's gonna work looking at a diagram. You just gotta roll up your sleeves and go for it.
 
V

virtualdanger

Audioholic Intern
My surrounds are at ear level, just that it is not at an angle. They directly face each other. So my fear with their current position is that they are behind the listening position.

For the sub positions, I will absolutely do the crawl. For the existing one, and then after that when adding the second one into the mix.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Seriously, I have no life.
FWIW from what I've read seems the Klipsch SPL-120 and 150 models are the successors to the R-112SW & R-115SW with more a change in model name than anything else (but hard to tell with Klipsch, they claim it's a step up from their Reference series but don't really say how, and their sub model number schemes tend to be a confusing mess).

The more I think about this situation if virtualdanger (I don't want to abbreviate as vd :) ) is relatively happy with a single HTS-12, for the costs involved a second may just well be the ticket.....if you can get it to satisfying levels and the extension works for you with a single, a second would be icing on the cake so to speak for smoothing out the response thru the room. If you're chasing lower frequencies it's somewhat limited but how important is that to you?
 
V

virtualdanger

Audioholic Intern
FWIW from what I've read seems the Klipsch SPL-120 and 150 models are the successors to the R-112SW & R-115SW with more a change in model name than anything else (but hard to tell with Klipsch, they claim it's a step up from their Reference series but don't really say how, and their sub model number schemes tend to be a confusing mess).

The more I think about this situation if virtualdanger (I don't want to abbreviate as vd :) ) is relatively happy with a single HTS-12, for the costs involved a second may just well be the ticket.....if you can get it to satisfying levels and the extension works for you with a single, a second would be icing on the cake so to speak for smoothing out the response thru the room. If you're chasing lower frequencies it's somewhat limited but how important is that to you?
Yeah, the more we discuss it, it's becoming more evident that a second HTS is the least complicated way to go.

In terms of whether I'm satisfied, I am. But, that's not to say there isn't better that I can transition to. I have probably not experienced much lower frequencies, and may like it once I do. May even deem it a must have!

Prior to the Polk Audio HTS 12, I had a Morduant Short - Carnival 9 Sub. I was on a tight budget and that's all I could incorporate. It was a 10" model, an old unit, and lower power (Max 250 watt). In music it was mostly okay, but in movie scenes with deep bass it would crackle.

WP_20150816_23_09_09_Pro.jpg
WP_20150816_23_23_55_Pro.jpg
WP_20150816_23_23_43_Pro.jpg


Needless to say the HTS12 was a wonderful step-up.

Another option would be to just stick with the 1 sub for now, and look at doing the dual sub upgrade sometime later; maybe next year, so budgets are more allowing. At that point I can go for 2 new ones. Of the brands I'd mentioned, is SVS the only one you'd say is worth considering?
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Seriously, I have no life.
If I were to buy subs from that list they would be SVS, two PB2000s looks to be a pretty good performance to $ ratio. If the Klipsch were priced lower they could be interesting but at that price I'd go with SVS.

OTOH any interest in DIY? That's what I do these days....
 
V

virtualdanger

Audioholic Intern
If I were to buy subs from that list they would be SVS, two PB2000s looks to be a pretty good performance to $ ratio. If the Klipsch were priced lower they could be interesting but at that price I'd go with SVS.

OTOH any interest in DIY? That's what I do these days....
I have not really explored the DIY market here, and what components are available. Besides, I have never tried anything like speaker assembly, so I'm not very confident in my speaker building skills. I've assembled some computers, but that's probably a very different thing.
 

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