Sealed speakers

[JRED 1219]

I think sealed speakers typically be placed closer to a wall than ported, correct?

Can anyone point me towards some guidelines on room placement?

 

[shadyJ]

I think sealed speakers typically be placed closer to a wall than ported, correct?

Can anyone point me towards some guidelines on room placement?

In many cases you can place sealed speakers closer to a wall without bloating the bass, since the bass is lower in level, boundary gain will not jack it up as much. But it depends on the sealed speakers. Many acoustic situations are different, so the thing to do is try different positioning until you get a response that you like.

 

[ryanosaur]

The designer determines the type of compensation built into the XO fpr such things like Baffle Step and Boundary Compensation. Some speakers you will see specifically described as being able to be placed close to a wall. It is just important to understand that this is not a hard fast rule.
Just like a front port should give you more flexible placement options than a rear port, it still does not allow for smacking it right up against the front wall with impunity.

This is a good resource... geared towards studios more than homes, the rules of acoustics still apply.

In short, though, most speakers are tested Anechoically, so no reflections or boundary gain are included in the results. If you take an accurate speaker that tests pretty flat across the FR spectrum and introduce those reflections... you can end up with a completely different beast. The best speakers can be rendered useless in a bad room with poor placement.

Tips on placement? I would say at least 18" from the front wall, and two feet from side walls is a good start, regardless of ports or not. Whether you toe-in or run parallel is dependant on the speakers off-axis performance more than anything else. Likewise, Mains should have the tweeter positioned at, or just below ear level. You can experiment in your own room to find what works best, but thats where I would start.

Hope this helps!

Cheers

 

[lovinthehd]

Just a reminder there's a difference between acoustical suspension and sealed....if you're looking at older speakers particularly. Sealed speakers don't have a port to deal with so may work well up against a boundary whereas a few inches (double port diameter generally) is fine for a ported....

 

[DigitalDawn]

You will still get boundary reinforcement with a sealed speaker near a corner or side wall. I would try to stay at least 1 to 1.5 feet from the wall if possible.

 

[JRED 1219]

In many cases you can place sealed speakers closer to a wall without bloating the bass, since the bass is lower in level, boundary gain will not jack it up as much. But it depends on the sealed speakers. Many acoustic situations are different, so the thing to do is try different positioning until you get a response that you like.

Thanks for the info.

Also, I am also looking at speaker stands for my monolith 365Ts. I think the tweeter is about 13" from the bottom of the speaker, and my ears are about 40" off the floor from listening position.

Am I good to be in the 24"-28" range when looking for stands?

Was looking at the monolith stands because they are relatively cost effective and look decent too. The height options are 24" or 28". Which is better? Tweeter above or below my ears?

The top plates are 8.5" x 6" and the base for the 365T is (semi rounded) 11.5" x 9.5". These stands are apperently good for 75 lbs though which gives me some comfort, as these speakers are over 33 lbs.

I've never had speakers on stands before, do you think this should be ok?

Any other suggestions for other stand options?

(I ask because I know you had some time with these fairly recently).

 

[ryanosaur]

Ear height... or a little below is usually what I see recommended. You can always get a pair of monitor isolation pads from amazon to lift the speaker another 2" or so.

I'm not familiar with their stands but iirc when i bought mine, i thought they looked to be decent. I use VTI. Ive heard good things about Sanus, too.

Hope that helps!

 

[JRED 1219]

Ear height... or a little below is usually what I see recommended. You can always get a pair of monitor isolation pads from amazon to lift the speaker another 2" or so.

I'm not familiar with their stands but iirc when i bought mine, i thought they looked to be decent. I use VTI. Ive heard good things about Sanus, too.

Hope that helps!

Thanks!
Those VTIs look decent. My concern is mainly with the top plate and wondering how much that matters. Is it ok to have the speaker a few inches wider than the top plate, or can that create a stability issue?

 

[shadyJ]

Thanks for the info.

Also, I am also looking at speaker stands for my monolith 365Ts. I think the tweeter is about 13" from the bottom of the speaker, and my ears are about 40" off the floor from listening position.

Am I good to be in the 24"-28" range when looking for stands?

Was looking at the monolith stands because they are relatively cost effective and look decent too. The height options are 24" or 28". Which is better? Tweeter above or below my ears?

The top plates are 8.5" x 6" and the base for the 365T is (semi rounded) 11.5" x 9.5". These stands are apperently good for 75 lbs though which gives me some comfort, as these speakers are over 33 lbs.

I've never had speakers on stands before, do you think this should be ok?

Any other suggestions for other stand options?

(I ask because I know you had some time with these fairly recently).

For the 365T speakers, IF you are going to be using the Atmos section of that speaker, I would mount the speaker so that the listening position ears are a bit below tweeter level. If you are not going to be using the Atmos speakers, I would arrange it so that ear height is level with tweeter or perhaps just a bit above. This graph is illustrative of the behavior of the 365Ts on the vertical axis. It shows that hard lobing nulls don't even really start until 40 degrees off axis, so it doesn't matter that much where you sit on the vertical axis, so long you are in a 30 degree angle, which is very likely the case. However, if you use the Atmos speakers, you want as little of their sound to reach your ears directly, and so you should be as far off the vertical axis of those while still getting a good response from the main speakers.

 

[JRED 1219]

For the 365T speakers, IF you are going to be using the Atmos section of that speaker, I would mount the speaker so that the listening position ears are a bit below tweeter level. If you are not going to be using the Atmos speakers, I would arrange it so that ear height is level with tweeter or perhaps just a bit above. This graph is illustrative of the behavior of the 365Ts on the vertical axis. It shows that hard lobing nulls don't even really start until 40 degrees off axis, so it doesn't matter that much where you sit on the vertical axis, so long you are in a 30 degree angle, which is very likely the case. However, if you use the Atmos speakers, you want as little of their sound to reach your ears directly, and so you should be as far off the vertical axis of those while still getting a good response from the main speakers.

Don't think I will use the upfiring speakers other than to test them out. I would rather just have good clear sound directly pointed at me...

What about the size of the top plates? These speakers will extend 3" over the edge of the top plates of most stands on all sides.

As you know, these are rounded and finding an exact fit is impossible. There are some stands with larger top plates, but the selection is limited.

 

[JRED 1219]

Has anyone used this stuff? Apperently it is often used to secure speakers to the stands.

https://www.amazon.ca/gp/aw/d/B001FGLX72/ref=ox_sc_act_image_2?smid=A21CW3FU7CN37N&psc=1

 

[shadyJ]

Don't think I will use the upfiring speakers other than to test them out. I would rather just have good clear sound directly pointed at me...

What about the size of the top plates? These speakers will extend 3" over the edge of the top plates of most stands on all sides.

As you know, these are rounded and finding an exact fit is impossible. There are some stands with larger top plates, but the selection is limited.

3" is way too far to be sticking out. You must be looking at the wrong kind of speaker stand. Speaker stands can be very easy to make if you have any woodworking skills at all. Maybe look for a project that fits all your criteria. If not interested in that, maybe this one by Monoprice will work. I made my own, they look like this:

That is easy to make and it is very stable. It is only four boards screwed together.

 

[JRED 1219]

3" is way too far to be sticking out. You must be looking at the wrong kind of speaker stand. Speaker stands can be very easy to make if you have any woodworking skills at all. Maybe look for a project that fits all your criteria. If not interested in that, maybe this one by Monoprice will work. I made my own, they look like this:

That is easy to make and it is very stable. It is only four boards screwed together.

I looked at those and the weight limit is 22 lbs...

It seems the higher the weight limit, the smaller the top plate gets for the ones I see on amazon, etc.

I suppose I could make my own, but I doubt I would get around to doing that and then I would have my speakers on milk crates or something for months...

 

[JRED 1219]

Ok well I have looked at a lot of stands online and virtually nothing has a top plate large enough to accommodate the 365Ts.

I'm thinking the blue tak putty should secure them well enough, hopefully...?

Another option would be drilling holes in the top plate and screwing into the bottom of the speakers (least preferred).

Or I can just make my own top plate to spec and affix it.

Are any of these crazy ideas, or am I generally ok?

Thinking of using these:
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00CQCIRTG/ref=crt_ewc_img_dp_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB

or:
https://www.amazon.ca/Sanus-SF26-B1-Steel-Foundation-Black/dp/B004T7VCM0/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

or:
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00BESJHB0/ref=ox_sc_saved_title_1?smid=A2DQKC33QPZUIY&psc=1

 

[davidscott]

Audio Advisor sells a nice selection of speaker stands. Man I haven't owned any sealed speakers since the 80s....

 

[ryanosaur]

The important thing about speakers and stands, remember that the weight of the speaker is towards the baffle, so you need to push the speaker back on the stands top plate to center the weight. Next, is the base of the stand: if the base is less than a foot^2, I’d be concerned for stability, especially on carpet. That said, if you are able to install spikes, that will help with stability on carpet. Dayton audio probably offers the best budget selection of spikes.
I mentioned above using a monitor pad if you want. The foam on these is pretty solid. If anything, you might want some non-slip rubberized dots on the top plate of your stand as these will grip the foam quite well. My speakers in gloss black are heavy enough (32#) that they don’t slide on the pads at all.
In general, the only thing you need to worry about after that is whether there is any further reason to be concerned about stability. Do you drink to excess, “smoke 2 joints before you smoke 2 joints then smoke 2 more,” or is there a toddler training to be an NFL lineman in the house?

 

[JRED 1219]

Audio Advisor sells a nice selection of speaker stands. Man I haven't owned any sealed speakers since the 80s....

I wasn't even alive yet in the 80s ...sorry, couldn't resist!

 

[JRED 1219]

The important thing about speakers and stands, remember that the weight of the speaker is towards the baffle, so you need to push the speaker back on the stands top plate to center the weight. Next, is the base of the stand: if the base is less than a foot^2, I’d be concerned for stability, especially on carpet. That said, if you are able to install spikes, that will help with stability on carpet. Dayton audio probably offers the best budget selection of spikes.
I mentioned above using a monitor pad if you want. The foam on these is pretty solid. If anything, you might want some non-slip rubberized dots on the top plate of your stand as these will grip the foam quite well. My speakers in gloss black are heavy enough (32#) that they don’t slide on the pads at all.
In general, the only thing you need to worry about after that is whether there is any further reason to be concerned about stability. Do you drink to excess, “smoke 2 joints before you smoke 2 joints then smoke 2 more,” or is there a toddler training to be an NFL lineman in the house?

 

[JRED 1219]

The important thing about speakers and stands, remember that the weight of the speaker is towards the baffle, so you need to push the speaker back on the stands top plate to center the weight. Next, is the base of the stand: if the base is less than a foot^2, I’d be concerned for stability, especially on carpet. That said, if you are able to install spikes, that will help with stability on carpet. Dayton audio probably offers the best budget selection of spikes.
I mentioned above using a monitor pad if you want. The foam on these is pretty solid. If anything, you might want some non-slip rubberized dots on the top plate of your stand as these will grip the foam quite well. My speakers in gloss black are heavy enough (32#) that they don’t slide on the pads at all.
In general, the only thing you need to worry about after that is whether there is any further reason to be concerned about stability. Do you drink to excess, “smoke 2 joints before you smoke 2 joints then smoke 2 more,” or is there a toddler training to be an NFL lineman in the house?

Thanks for the reply. These speakers do have a bunch of weight to the back of them, since the cabinet slopes back at the top to accommodate the (useless) atmos driver. Point taken, however, as it is still front heavy.
Most speaker stands (including many from Sanus, VTI, Pangea, etc. do not have a square foot base, they are generally around 10" by 11" or 9" by 12" or so. Larger than that is uncommon. I'm beginning to think I need two skinny end tables with isolation pads as an alternative.

I drink and smoke, but it's under control ...not me I'm worried about, just everyone else in the house...

 

[ryanosaur]

Thanks for the reply. These speakers do have a bunch of weight to the back of them, since the cabinet slopes back at the top to accommodate the (useless) atmos driver. Point taken, however, as it is still front heavy.
Most speaker stands (including many from Sanus, VTI, Pangea, etc. do not have a square foot base, they are generally around 10" by 11" or 9" by 12" or so. Larger than that is uncommon. I'm beginning to think I need two skinny end tables with isolation pads as an alternative.

I drink and smoke, but it's under control ...not me I'm worried about, just everyone else in the house...

More an inside joke... for friends that will never see it! But the point is quite salient here. One of my 32# BMRs is on surround duty right next to a doorway. *knocks on wood It is pretty stable (56.75" high, tweeter is 52.5" H, ears are ~49" H) between the 36" VTI RF stand, two legs filled with Kiln-dried sand, the weight of the speaker and the spikes. Sharper spikes for carpeted floors are great.
Speakers are level across the top... And offset with the back of the cabinet further back than the front. I'll post a photo in a moment. I'll also post a phot of a different stand that I modified for my old surrounds (now my rears mounted on the wall in the first phot I will post.) With that Video-Secu stand, I had to stabilize the bass and the top plate; both were too small.