Runco 810 Ultra vs. Sony VPL-VW100 Projector

[TABCON]

I've decided to go with a mid-line DLP projector and have narrowed it to these two.

Any thoughts from anyone...anyone...



Tabcon

 

[mtrycrafts]

I've decided to go with a mid-line DLP projector and have narrowed it to these two.

Any thoughts from anyone...anyone...



Tabcon

Have you been to the Runco web site?
It is a single chip DLP, up to 720P capability. Color wheel. long throw distance of 1.8x width of screen. It seems to have enough light output.
I think it is about $10K?
That Sony is listed for $10k but can be had for a lot less. 3 chip LCos, up to 1080p HD, similar light output, closer throw distance, about 1.4. Closer, more light. Super quiet.
Big discussion about that Sony, known as the Ruby, at the AVS boards.

 

[BMXTRIX]

I wouldn't touch or recommend Runco to anyone on the face of this earth unless I really held a grudge against them. They are a boutique brand - like a Bose or Monster Cable. Way to much money for the quality you get and easily blown away by units costing thousands of dollars less.

The Ruby on the other hand is projection technology that is pure cutting edge. A 1080p projector that (now) accepts 1080p input and delivers it for a fair price.

If that is your budget then you have a choice between quality and getting ripped off as far as I can tell. Very - VERY - simple choice.

 

[TABCON]

Thanks for the heads up about Runco. I had no idea. The one I did watch was wonderful, but I have not seen the 'Ruby' yet.

Where can the Ruby be had for a better price then the 10k msrp?

Thanks!

Tabcon

 

[TABCON]

One more thing, is the Sony a DLP unit?

Also the lumen output seems very low at 800.

Tabcon

 

[LEVESQUE]

The VPL-VW100 is a real 1080p projector that can take 1080p directly. It's not a DLP, it's the Sony version of LCOS named SXRD.

I've used alot of high-end DLPs before like the Marantz S4 and Sharp 12K at 720p. Rainbows all over, motion dithering, screendoor at less then 1.5X screen width... I'm sitting at 1X screen width from my Ruby. No screendor, no pixel structure, no artifacts. Clean and smooth picture.

I'm at over 120 hours with mine and light outputs is still making me blink in outdoor scenes. Paired with an high gain screen, the light output is still in the "painful" snow or white sand scenes territory...

I was looking at LOST in 1080i scaled at 1080p with a pre-production Gennum VXP scaler yesterday and the picture quality was unbelievable. This machine was made for HD, and the best is still to come with the upcoming Blu-Ray and DVD-HD players.

The 720p projectors are a thing of the past in my mind. If you invest that kind of money, go with a 1080p projector to be ready for what's coming soon...

 

[mtrycrafts]

Thanks for the heads up about Runco. I had no idea. The one I did watch was wonderful, but I have not seen the 'Ruby' yet.

Where can the Ruby be had for a better price then the 10k msrp?

Thanks!

Tabcon

It is hard to find a Ruby demo. There are some at one of the chains stores but very poorly set up. So, unless you can find someone in your area, perhaps a post at AVS website?
Check Runco's web site for their lumen rating since they use after calibration fL ratings and lumens, not ANSI lumens as that is a poor yardscale. Then check all of their DLP. I did. the true lumen is about 48% of the ANSI lumens but I don't know how that number translates to LCD or the LCOS type.

AVS has lots of posts and a number of videoholics there have measured the footlambert and also Widescreen review has the numbers. Depending on screen size, you will get theater level brightness.

I would suggest you contact projectorcentral.com and ask for Jason. I think you will like their delivered price. Too low to advertise.

 

[TABCON]

I've located a brand new "Ruby" for $7,400, which sounds pretty decent to me.

I'll be using a 104" diag. Carrada Criterion bright white screen and my AV room can become black as night at noon if required.

From what I've read about the Ruby...it's an awesome projector, especially at 7,400 bucks.

Tabcon

 

[mtrycrafts]

I've located a brand new "Ruby" for $7,400, which sounds pretty decent to me.

I'll be using a 104" diag. Carrada Criterion bright white screen and my AV room can become black as night at noon if required.

From what I've read about the Ruby...it's an awesome projector, especially at 7,400 bucks.

Tabcon

Great. I doubt you can beat that delivered price I couldn't

What is the screen gain on that screen? I don't think you want it very high.

 

[mike c]

I wouldn't touch or recommend Runco to anyone on the face of this earth unless I really held a grudge against them. They are a boutique brand - like a Bose or Monster Cable. Way to much money for the quality you get and easily blown away by units costing thousands of dollars less.

good thing I saw this ... chicklet for you - you saved my dad a lot of moolah. so what other brand would you suggest with the same performance as these Runco units? (I was kinda impressed with the Runco demo - sort of like watching a 110" CRT tv)

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to BMXTRIX again.

 

[BMXTRIX]

I think comparible to Runco units start as low as the Panasonic AE900U and go up from there rather quickly. The Optoma H78, H79, the Infocus 7210, many of the Sharp projectors, there are a couple of Samsungs that are supposed to be killer as well.

Really killer? Sim2 is one of the best engineered projectors for the money and if you want a Runco killer for the same cash that actually offers a higher level of engineering - they are THE company to go to. They will also likely be one of the first companies who will be delivering a 1080p DLP front projector... and I imagine it will be about as good as it gets.

If I were in the $10K range right now? Ruby - Sony Ruby - nothing else.

 

[mike c]

thanks BMXTRIX. what about EPSON?

 

[Preetu]

hello

I have Epson PowerLite and m very pleased with it’s picture quality ……and I found that the replacement bulbs r resonalbe compared to other projectors ….and it comes with a 800 x 600 resolution at 1600 lumens and it’s 3LCD technology ensures accurate color and remarkable saturation.......

 

[LEVESQUE]

I'm using a Da-Lite High-Power (gain of 3) 110" dia (8' wide) with my Ruby and the PQ is great. The Vutec Silverstar is also another good choice for the Ruby.

The "problem" with the Ruby now is that it's ahead of the game... The run of the mill scalers using the FLI and Sil chips are doing BOB and weave and vertical interpolation only to reach 1080p. The internal scaler of the Ruby is performing inverse telecine, but introducing noise and lowering the sharpness a bit.

I was testing a Gennum VXP scaler, a Realta HQV scaler, and a pre-production Blu-Ray scaler last week with the Ruby, and bypassing the internal scaler, and the PQ was unbelievable. For those that think that HD won't make "that much of a difference", then think again.

The best is to come for the Ruby.

 

[BMXTRIX]

thanks BMXTRIX. what about EPSON?

I think the 550 and 800 home theater projectors they have seem to be very noteworthy for providing an excellent projector for the cash that is also very bright - or at least can be very bright. Realistically though, if you have no need of the additional brightness and will calibrate for optimal theater performance, then you may not need that extra brightness or to spend the extra cash on them.

Otherwise, they have a lot of very mediocre business projectors which don't perform much better or worse than almost any other brand out there as far as I know.

I have strongly considered the 550 because of my family room projection setup... but I just wait until after dark to use my front projector.

Is a Epson as good as a Runco? Well, I think Runco does best it for image processing and DLP typically produces a tiny bit better overall image regularly... which is most of what is in my list above. But, unless you are viewing the Runco head-to-head with another home theater projector odds are good that you will see very little to no difference between the Runco and most of the other home theater projectors of equal resolution on the market.

For example: The day I got my Panasonic PT-L300U projector (960x540 LCD) I took it into DC area Myer-Emco (whom I worked for) and set it up directly below a $12,000 Runco projector. Split the component feed to both projectors and shot onto the same screen with both units on.

The store manager walked in and said "Yep, that's why we don't sell cheaper projectors, they look just way to good for so little money." The Panny did look a bit worse - not the same shadow detail, not quite as good with motion handling, not quite as bright. But... it was $10,000 LESS! The next week 2 guys in the store picked up the same projector for their homes - they were sold in one viewing.

Moral: Tons of great projectors out there, not a lot of cash necessary to spend to get them.

 

[TABCON]

I'm using a Da-Lite High-Power (gain of 3) 110" dia (8' wide) with my Ruby and the PQ is great. The Vutec Silverstar is also another good choice for the Ruby.

The "problem" with the Ruby now is that it's ahead of the game... The run of the mill scalers using the FLI and Sil chips are doing BOB and weave and vertical interpolation only to reach 1080p. The internal scaler of the Ruby is performing inverse telecine, but introducing noise and lowering the sharpness a bit.

I was testing a Gennum VXP scaler, a Realta HQV scaler, and a pre-production Blu-Ray scaler last week with the Ruby, and bypassing the internal scaler, and the PQ was unbelievable. For those that think that HD won't make "that much of a difference", then think again.

The best is to come for the Ruby.

In english please...lol.

Are you saying I should wait for later models of the ruby, or get one of the scalers you referred to? How much are these scalers by the way? Also, will I like the Ruby just like it is straight out of the box?

The gain on the Carrada screen is 1.4 I think.

Tabcon

 

[The Dukester]

Have you checked the price of a replacement bulb for that Ruby? Last time I checked, they were in the $1k range. That's a bit pricey for me, especially after you lay down that kind of coin for the pj. I guess it's like they (whoever "they" are) say; If you can't afford to put gas in that Hummer, don't buy one.

There is a local dealer here that has a Ruby on display, and it does have quite the picture, however!

 

[mtrycrafts]

In english please...lol.

Are you saying I should wait for later models of the ruby, or get one of the scalers you referred to? How much are these scalers by the way? Also, will I like the Ruby just like it is straight out of the box?

The gain on the Carrada screen is 1.4 I think.

Tabcon

Well, right now you can take advantage of a scalar as it is of higher quality than the Ruby's scalar. But as HD and Blue ray DVd come to market, and if it outputs 1080progressive, no scalar is needed and the picture will be superb as expected. I would think that you will be more than fine in the meantime with that internal scalar, or one in a DVD player?

That 1.4 and at the minimum throw distance, it should be fine, even after the bulb dims. Just don't expect it to be a TV brightness as that is not what is in theaters either.

Unfortunately, even the Ruby will need calibration for best results.

 

[LEVESQUE]

Are you saying I should wait for later models of the ruby, or get one of the scalers you referred to?

No. What I meant was that the Ruby is ahead of the technology right now, because it's a true 1080p projector, and there is almost no sources out there that can't really use it fully and make it shine. So if you want at least to graze it, you need (for now...) a good 1080p scaler. But with Blu-Ray and HD-DVD players you won't need them, except for "old" SD DVDs sessions...

Logically, Sony should have put the Ruby on the market with a Blu-Ray player... But it's Sony, so nothing is logical with them...

 

[mtrycrafts]

But it's Sony, so nothing is logical with them...

How true this is. I chatted live with them today to get the mounting hole dimensions from lens front on the Ruby, preplanning. Not in manual, need to contact installer or dealer

How easy is it to check yours, thanks.